Front end education.

[FJmonkey]

 

I tried, I got nothing...

[1tinindian]

Drilling new holes in your rotors and finding a-dapt-a plates for unobtainable calipers that won't work with an 89+ 17" front wheel...
Seems reasonable to me!

You either by an 89 FJ, or get the 89 front end to put on an older FJ.
It's been tried and tested by many FJ owners and is the preferred mod, if I'm not mistaken.
Why in hell are you finding it necessary to reinvent the wheel?

Oh, that's right, your researching possibilities!

[fintip]

Ok, I'm going to be honest here, I really can't understand why you are getting so upset. I have an opportunity to get a 17" FJ rim, it comes with a box of FJ parts and a set of saddlebags. It does not come with forks. I have decided I would vastly prefer an 84/85. An 88/later front end is neither easy to find nor cheap, I imagine, so I'm just trying to see if there's a way to make do with what I have.

Why is this so frustrating to you?

In any case, everyone neglected to tell me, until Pat just a minute ago finally mentioned it, that there IS a difference in the forks, and that difference is their mounting points for calipers. My speculation was based on the assumption (unchallenged until an hour or two ago) that the forks were the same.

Sorry for trying? If you are so bothered, go somewhere else in the forum or ignore me, I'm not sending you private messages or something. Nor am I talking about or to you except to respond to your angry diatribe. Nor am I even saying something remotely offensive, really, I'm just trying to find a second option. Why? Because it's cheaper.

I understand getting the '89/later front end is the preferred mod. If an easy way to make it happen comes to pass, or I get a lot of extra cash, I'll be happy to do it! Otherwise, if there's a cheaper option that requires a little extra elbow grease and legwork, I'll gladly do that! (Yes, that includes the insanely difficult process of--gasp!--drilling holes!)

Yes, I'm researching possibilities. Are you two done throwing a hissy fit over nothing yet?

Now, for anyone isn't angry at me for trying to live within my means, is finding an adapter plate so scary? Or, worst case scenario, getting a set of lowers... What about the member who just had an unfortunate wreck recently; possibly his fork lowers are still fine and he'd be willing to sell them to me for a reasonable price and I could help him get some money towards another FJ.

[SlowOldGuy]

I want a bike that performs kick-ass and can be ridden 600 miles in a day if need be--and while that's an interesting balance, I lean towards performance over comfort. On top of that, the earlier models did look the best.

That description fits BOTH of my FJs.  The performance difference is so slight that's you probably wouldn't notice it.

I've had the 1100/1200 discussion with Alf a few times over the years and it's just a difference of perception and opinion.  One ride down a twisty road on the '93 was enough to convince me to try to "fix" my '85.

The '93 floated effortlessly into turns and allowed corrections without fighting me.  The '85 (in stock form) was a truck by comparison.  It required LOTS of countersteering pressure to maintain a lean and would try to standup if I applied any brake when leaned over.  It was a night and day difference between the two bikes.  Just like the night and day difference on my first ride with the '89 front wheel on my '85.

The improvement was even more noticeable because I was working on another (stock) '85 at the time when I finished the upgrade.  Riding them back to back made the difference shockingly apparent.

Now, for the other stuff.  I don't think the FZR400RR was imported into the US so good luck finding calipers from one of them.  You can't interchange the brake rotors, the hub diameter is way different between the pre and post '89 models

DavidR.

[rktmanfj]

Ok, I'm going to be honest here, I really can't understand why you are getting so upset. I have an opportunity to get a 17" FJ rim, it comes with a box of FJ parts and a set of saddlebags. It does not come with forks. I have decided I would vastly prefer an 84/85. An 88/later front end is neither easy to find nor cheap, I imagine, so I'm just trying to see if there's a way to make do with what I have.

Why is this so frustrating to you?

In any case, everyone neglected to tell me, until Pat just a minute ago finally mentioned it, that there IS a difference in the forks, and that difference is their mounting points for calipers. My speculation was based on the assumption (unchallenged until an hour or two ago) that the forks were the same.

Sorry for trying? If you are so bothered, go somewhere else in the forum or ignore me, I'm not sending you private messages or something. Nor am I talking about or to you except to respond to your angry diatribe. Nor am I even saying something remotely offensive, really, I'm just trying to find a second option. Why? Because it's cheaper.

I understand getting the '89/later front end is the preferred mod. If an easy way to make it happen comes to pass, or I get a lot of extra cash, I'll be happy to do it! Otherwise, if there's a cheaper option that requires a little extra elbow grease and legwork, I'll gladly do that! (Yes, that includes the insanely difficult process of--gasp!--drilling holes!)

Yes, I'm researching possibilities. Are you two done throwing a hissy fit over nothing yet?

Now, for anyone isn't angry at me for trying to live within my means, is finding an adapter plate so scary? Or, worst case scenario, getting a set of lowers... What about the member who just had an unfortunate wreck recently; possibly his fork lowers are still fine and he'd be willing to sell them to me for a reasonable price and I could help him get some money towards another FJ.

Irishluck, is that you??       

       

[Pat Conlon]

Going by memory, the custom adapter plates were made for the early Vmax forks to fit the later R-1 blue spots and someone found that they just happened to fit the early FJ forks. Mind you, this was several years ago....

Start your search here: http://www.cycleoneoff.com/Index.html   

Ask your adapter plate questions to them...not us.

[fintip]

That description fits BOTH of my FJs.  The performance difference is so slight that's you probably wouldn't notice it.

I've had the 1100/1200 discussion with Alf a few times over the years and it's just a difference of perception and opinion.  One ride down a twisty road on the '93 was enough to convince me to try to "fix" my '85.

The '93 floated effortlessly into turns and allowed corrections without fighting me.  The '85 (in stock form) was a truck by comparison.  It required LOTS of countersteering pressure to maintain a lean and would try to standup if I applied any brake when leaned over.  It was a night and day difference between the two bikes.  Just like the night and day difference on my first ride with the '89 front wheel on my '85.

The improvement was even more noticeable because I was working on another (stock) '85 at the time when I finished the upgrade.  Riding them back to back made the difference shockingly apparent.

Now, for the other stuff.  I don't think the FZR400RR was imported into the US so good luck finding calipers from one of them.  You can't interchange the brake rotors, the hub diameter is way different between the pre and post '89 models

DavidR.

Aye yai yai, it's reading posts like that that make me want to throw my hands up in the air, haha. I have bought into the Alf/Doc perspective for the time being, but I realize that I can't know without riding them--and I don't have them here to ride! So I'll just pick the one I 'feel' better about and run with it. And that's the story there, folks.

Any chance you can comment on acceleration beyond 8k between the two motors?

Can't interchange the rotors means drilling holes isn't enough, yes? Good to know. Thanks so much for your help, David.

Irishluck, is that you??

I'm tempted to assume that's an insult and that Irishluck was some former and disliked member, given some of my treatment here thus far... I'll just go ahead and give you the benefit of the doubt for now.

Going by memory, the custom adapter plates were made for the early Vmax forks to fit the later R-1 blue spots and someone found that they just happened to fit the early FJ forks. Mind you, this was several years ago....

Start your search here: http://www.cycleoneoff.com/Index.html   

Ask your adapter plate questions to them...not us.

Thanks, Pat, that's just the kind of lead I was looking for. I appreciate it.

[fj11.5]

actually the only places I've asked about fzr calipers for myself are in the states , only reason I havnt bought them is price to ship them here , the UK also has them , , so unless they were a grey import to the states ?? I don't know but quite a few if you just ask around

[rktmanfj]

Irishluck, is that you??

I'm tempted to assume that's an insult and that Irishluck was some former and disliked member, given some of my treatment here thus far... I'll just go ahead and give you the benefit of the doubt for now.

I'll return the benefit of the doubt, since you were quick to recognize that.  However, the post of yours it followed was very similar in tone and content to several of his.

If you continue to disregard and/or question the (very) good info and advice you have been given (ad nauseum) in multiple threads, the frustration is likely to grow.

[1tinindian]

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.

[bcguide]

Don't piss on fin head to much. I have the same questions as here in BC I can get a major break in insurance cost for a stock apearing 25 year old bike

[Alf]

I've had the 1100/1200 discussion with Alf a few times over the years and it's just a difference of perception and opinion.  One ride down a twisty road on the '93 was enough to convince me to try to "fix" my '85.

The '93 floated effortlessly into turns and allowed corrections without fighting me.  The '85 (in stock form) was a truck by comparison.  It required LOTS of countersteering pressure to maintain a lean and would try to standup if I applied any brake when leaned over.  It was a night and day difference between the two bikes.  Just like the night and day difference on my first ride with the '89 front wheel on my '85.

The improvement was even more noticeable because I was working on another (stock) '85 at the time when I finished the upgrade.  Riding them back to back made the difference shockingly apparent.

DavidR.

Really is a curiosity the difference on perception by 2 people about the same thing. After a lot of mods and tricks and seeing that it was near impossible to get the same results with the 93 model that the rest of us with the 3CVs and 1TXs, my friend Joe sold me his bike and bought a 3CV. We refit the OEq in order to sell it, but I liked so much in STD form that I keep near 2 years. But I liked in order to sedate touring, everyday riding and two up. For properly fast riding I own my 3 CV

Riding the STD 3XW side to side with my friend Mingo´s STD 1TX the feelings was like yours ... only than opposite. The 1TX feels (I ride it actually a lot of times) nimble, light, small, you can apply the brakes with absolute confidence inside the turns until the appex... The 93 was a bus in its company.

I don´t know why so much difference between us. Do your 11 wear radial tyres?. The first series are different beasts with radial tyres, improving the bike no way

[fintip]

For properly fast riding I own my 3 CV...

...Do your 11 wear radial tyres?. The first series are different beasts with radial tyres, improving the bike no way

Actually, about the radial tires... I read some places that you MUST NOT use radial tires, as these bikes weren't tested with them. Then I see others mentioning it casually. Can someone clarify that?

I'm caught off guard that you suggest the 3CV for 'properly fast riding'. I'm not even going to ask, though.

[1tinindian]

Yes, radial tires are BAD.
Just like you're not supposed to use them on cars built prior to 1975!

[Alf]

For properly fast riding I own my 3 CV...

...Do your 11 wear radial tyres?. The first series are different beasts with radial tyres, improving the bike no way

Actually, about the radial tires... I read some places that you MUST NOT use radial tires, as these bikes weren't tested with them. Then I see others mentioning it casually. Can someone clarify that?

I'm caught off guard that you suggest the 3CV for 'properly fast riding'. I'm not even going to ask, though.

En Spain we say "más sabe el diablo por viejo que por diablo". A free translation would be: Satan knows more due to the experience that the time give than for being Satan

Due to my web I know 15 FJ owners in person, and I´ve contacted and given my advice to tens more. Each time that the people has changed from bias-ply to radial tyres the bike has improved a lot. I know that the Doc recommends bias-ply with the OE rims, but he is WRONG. Sorry if I don´t look humble and I´m sure Doc knows infinitum more about bikes and riding than me, but in this issue I´m categorical and dogmatic: NO, NO, AND NOT. I´ve tested so many tyres and the owners have passed me so much experience, that there is no theme. I have not found any single owner that have told me than bias-ply are better than radials in his FJ

Only if your FJ fit 3" OE rim the correct tyre is 110/70/17. When appear the OE Dunlop was very narrow, a real 110, not a 120, and it was designed specifically for the FJ

This is from the Spanish mag Motociclismo, around 1986. Like I´m everyday practising my English here I leave it the article to you to practice your Spanish  

The test is a comparative between the FJ 11 and 12 models. The head letters say: Michelin Radials: the third FJ. And speaks about the difference is so abysmal with radial tyres than in fact it is like to ride a 3rd bike with stronger chassis, harder suspension... and less brakes!!!!!!