FJ1346 from ashes to... Well, we'll see...

[fj11.5]

The squeeling noise you heard, may or may not be your speedo, cable,or drive from the wheel,I had a gsx years ago that would eat speedo cables every chance it got, would let this horrible screeching sound,  and a few seconds later, or maybe a week later, it would screech again and then the speedo would stop working, another cable snapped, still covered in lube, after a few months of this,  and working out what wasn't causing it, found out it was a semi seized speedo

[fintip]

Dude, when will your bolt misadventures end?!

Still reading everything here. That bike deserves a custom paint job, though. The theft-deterrent paint just ain't good enough for that machine of beauty.

[Charlie-brm]

I can definitely say that it makes a big difference having the side covers on with respect to how much heat I feel
on the bottom of my thighs. That being said the seat still gets quite warm. (I'm considering putting some aluminum
duct repair tape on the bottom of the seat pan to see if I can reflect some of the heat away.)

A piece of this cut to fit would work nicely: 

http://www.reflectixinc.com/basepage.asp?Page=Double+Reflective+Insulation&pageIndex=622

I've used material like that for home building behind tongue and groove pine but I didn't think it would hold up to an engine's direct heat. However there is a sheet on their site that reports surviving 250 F for 96 hours on direct contact without degrading. Impressive.
http://www.reflectixinc.com/images/uploads/allpdfs/t20%20hot%20surface%20performance%20c%20411.pdf

[skymasteres]

The squeeling noise you heard, may or may not be your speedo, cable,or drive from the wheel,I had a gsx years ago that would eat speedo cables every chance it got, would let this horrible screeching sound,  and a few seconds later, or maybe a week later, it would screech again and then the speedo would stop working, another cable snapped, still covered in lube, after a few months of this,  and working out what wasn't causing it, found out it was a semi seized speedo

See? This is why it's great to ask questions on an open forum. The speedo cable wasn't something that I had even considered. I will be lubing it before I take her out again.

[skymasteres]

I can definitely say that it makes a big difference having the side covers on with respect to how much heat I feel
on the bottom of my thighs. That being said the seat still gets quite warm. (I'm considering putting some aluminum
duct repair tape on the bottom of the seat pan to see if I can reflect some of the heat away.)

A piece of this cut to fit would work nicely: 

http://www.reflectixinc.com/basepage.asp?Page=Double+Reflective+Insulation&pageIndex=622

I've used material like that for home building behind tongue and groove pine but I didn't think it would hold up to an engine's direct heat. However there is a sheet on their site that reports surviving 250 F for 96 hours on direct contact without degrading. Impressive.
http://www.reflectixinc.com/images/uploads/allpdfs/t20%20hot%20surface%20performance%20c%20411.pdf

You know, I have to say that material looks like a real winner. I ordered a 24"x25' roll of it off of amazon for $25. (Gotta love the internet, I figure I can use this stuff on the other bikes as well to replace missing heat shielding) It might work, but I am a little wary about the magnitude of the heat being thrown off. (I suppose on the bright side, I won't need a seat heater in the winter time. All I have to do is remove this stuff...)

[skymasteres]

Dude, when will your bolt misadventures end?!

Still reading everything here. That bike deserves a custom paint job, though. The theft-deterrent paint just ain't good enough for that machine of beauty.

You know it's beyond me that I am still having issues with bolts. I mean, I get her all taken apart again
to adjust the valve lash (She's at 1200 miles now) and I find this guy when I pull off the exhaust.
(all signs point to not any time soon) [I'll have to think about the paint. I have a tendency to stick with stock.
That and the fact that I have yet to own a bike for more than a year without putting it down. We'll have to see...)



Now of course at first I was cussing under my breath and realizing that this must be the cause of the sudden
increase in oil usage. And of course it was the one oil pan bolt that didn't get re-torqued the first time around.
But wait, there's more...



I found these guys outright missing when I got down on my back and just about wedged my nugget under the
frame.  I'm simply amazed that my oil pan seal still seems to be intact. It would have been a really bad thing for
it to just come loose while headed down the highway. I am going to be systematically pulling all the fasteners I
can get to, putting thread locker on them, and re-torqueing them to spec.

Now here is an interesting thing. I started noticing that it was getting harder and harder to bump start the bike
if I stalled it out while it was warm in a parking lot or something. At first I thought it was just that I was getting
tired. But then I realized that while pushing it in first with the clutch pulled in it was rolling less and less easily.
I started noticing other symptoms as well. Like it shifting hard into first with a pronounced clunk and neutral
being very difficult to get into while stopped with the engine running.

The thing that kind of threw me was the fact that the clutch slave was freshly rebuilt so I did some digging
and found this thread.

http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=1143.0

Where 83elite was having the same issue.

I'll try the re-bleading and see if that does is.

How old is the clutch line?  If it's the original rubber line, it could be swelling and causing you to lose lever efficiency.

Hooligan

You know that's a good point. And could very well be the root cause as all of the lines are original to the bike.
The only thing that gives me a moment's pause was how wonderfully the clutch performed over the first 800 miles or so.

So at 1200 miles on the engine I think I am finally seeing some reduction in the amount of metal that is on the drain plug magnet.



I figure this will be my last oil change before I switch over to synthetic. (Probably do it at 2000 miles)

As for the bling plug, I got the old one pulled out. (Ended up putting a heavy flat bladed screwdriver through
it and prying the sucker out.



Putting the new one in was considerable easier than I had feared. I just lubed the edge with some oil and
used a flat surface to press it in by hand. I ended up using a few taps from a rubber mallet to fully seat it.
Hopefully the thing won't leak now.




Speaking of leaks, I pulled the galley plug out of the oil pan and found two things. It wasn't tight anymore,
and the o-ring was crushed flat. I ended up getting a replacement from the magic hardware store that
carries metric parts.

Of course I have some slight modifications planned that require removing the faring from the frame.
I'll have some words on that shortly, but D'Oh! Sometimes it helps to check before taking advice on face value.
More to come, stay tuned...

[HARTLESS]

you know, watching this thread (ive read the whole damn thing) is like watching an action drama on tv. you never know whats gonna happen next! but I have enjoyed reading about your venture and it makes me want to do more to my bike. hope that everything pans out well. It sounds like you are starting to get it all figured out... for now!

[aviationfred]

This may be stating something that you have already seen and fixed.

In the above photo, it appears to me that the right center stand bolt is missing. could be a possible source for the occasional rattle or thunking noise when bumpy roads are being ridden on.

[fintip]

My understanding is that line expansion contributes a very small amount to clutch feel, but is not at all capable of causing the type of clutch failure you are describing.

While a rebuild is in order, on my clutch, which does have a leaking slave, I have been able to get by for some time by just topping it off with brake fluid and squeezing. What I have found is that it is an intermittent leak; usually I will have to fill it up a couple times, and then, voila, months with perfect service. Then one day it will start giving the symptoms you describe again.

I just got a rebuild kit for the slave, so hopefully I'll be done with it here soon. At least for another 3 years or so.

Watch out for the effects of that leak on the belly pan! Mine was intact when I got mine, but that leak killed it. I still have it in two pieces, to be repaired at a later date. I wonder if when I repaint it, if I paint it with a white brake caliper paint, if it would resist the corrosive effects of the brake fluid on the plastic underneath? It should, right? It would just be a question of getting the color to match. I guess I could get an automotive paint color matched then to the caliper paint color, actually, since I'll likely do the whole bike at that point.

I digress!

Cannot believe your luck with bolts. Something really sounds fishy. Didn't you lock-tite them all the first time? Are you using your torque wrench right? I'm just flabbergasted, I've never heard of anything like this.

Oh, by the way--why are you waiting to use synthetic? You don't believe that old wives tale about naturally derived oils being required for break-in, do you?

[skymasteres]

you know, watching this thread (ive read the whole damn thing) is like watching an action drama on tv. you never know whats gonna happen next! but I have enjoyed reading about your venture and it makes me want to do more to my bike. hope that everything pans out well. It sounds like you are starting to get it all figured out... for now!

It has certainly been a learning experience to be sure. I'm glad you are entertained with all of the ins and outs of this build.
It's funny because now that I have some miles on the motor I'm back into the enjoying the project mentality and not just
grinding it out like I was when I was trying to get her running for the rally.

This may be stating something that you have already seen and fixed.

In the above photo, it appears to me that the right center stand bolt is missing. could be a possible source for the occasional rattle or thunking noise when bumpy roads are being ridden on.

You have a good eye my friend. That is exactly what I was illustrating with that picture. And your inference is correct.
That was the source of the clunking noise while going over bumps. I have removed the center stand while I search for
a local replacement for the other shoulder bolt. Keep looking at things critically though. Maybe you guys will see
something I don't. (It's happened before)

My understanding is that line expansion contributes a very small amount to clutch feel, but is not at all capable of causing the type of clutch failure you are describing.

While a rebuild is in order, on my clutch, which does have a leaking slave, I have been able to get by for some time by just topping it off with brake fluid and squeezing. What I have found is that it is an intermittent leak; usually I will have to fill it up a couple times, and then, voila, months with perfect service. Then one day it will start giving the symptoms you describe again.

I just got a rebuild kit for the slave, so hopefully I'll be done with it here soon. At least for another 3 years or so.

Well, I have a feeling I have a leak somewhere. I'll just go with re-bleeding for now and see how it goes. I am loth to
think it is the slave cylinder though because I just rebuilt it with fresh seals and polished it all up internally before assembly.
(Well, cleaned it real well with scotchbright pads to get rid of all the ugly spots. Not a real polish till it's a mirror job)

Watch out for the effects of that leak on the belly pan! Mine was intact when I got mine, but that leak killed it. I still have it in two pieces, to be repaired at a later date. I wonder if when I repaint it, if I paint it with a white brake caliper paint, if it would resist the corrosive effects of the brake fluid on the plastic underneath? It should, right? It would just be a question of getting the color to match. I guess I could get an automotive paint color matched then to the caliper paint color, actually, since I'll likely do the whole bike at that point.

Caliper paint would be just fine with respect to resisting the effects of brake fluid. If you need to have your
belly pan welded back together let me know. (I have the equipment to do it right. )

Cannot believe your luck with bolts. Something really sounds fishy. Didn't you lock-tite them all the first time? Are you using your torque wrench right? I'm just flabbergasted, I've never heard of anything like this.

Well, the problem is a little more insidious than that. Yes I torqued all of the bolts to spec. Yes they had something
on them when they went in. But it wasn't thread locker. I had it in my nugget that it would be good to use anti-seize
on all of the bolts with them being steel going into aluminum. In restrospect this probably wasn't the best idea.
On the bright side, only two of the case bolts have the stuff on them. (I put it on because they were going in "funny")

This is probably why the sucker is kicking out the fasteners.
(Everything is going back in with threadlocker. Just like the cam chain tensioner did)

Oh, by the way--why are you waiting to use synthetic? You don't believe that old wives tale about naturally derived oils being required for break-in, do you?

I'd be interested in hearing more about why this is an "Old Wives tale"  I was under the impression that if you used
synthetic for break in you would not get the polishing action needed to allow the rings to seal properly. (Some wear
being good wear and what not.) I have to admit, I can definitely say that I could tell a marked difference in the
behavior in the engine day to day as it "broke in" It started getting progressively easier to start. Cylinder temperatures
started coming down. The idle needed to be adjusted several times as the internal friction in the engine dropped.
The very character of the engine has become more relaxed.

Right now the engine is sitting at 1200 miles on it and I have no oil in the case.  I have finally started to see a lessening
of the metal particles on the drain plug magnet and the idle is stable.

Please make an argument for what kind of oil I should fill her back up with.

[ribbert]

Oh, by the way--why are you waiting to use synthetic? You don't believe that old wives tale about naturally derived oils being required for break-in, do you?

Kyle, why is this an old wives tale?

[HARTLESS]

Oh, by the way--why are you waiting to use synthetic? You don't believe that old wives tale about naturally derived oils being required for break-in, do you?

Kyle, why is this an old wives tale?

my guess would be the fact that both synthetic and "natural" oil both do the same thing, the sole difference is synthetic doesn't break down as fast which makes it lubricate a bit better. A lot of oils that are "synthetic" are derived from "natural" oil but the molecules are mated with additives that help prevent wear enough to put them in the same class as a synthetic. idk, I've never even heard this wives tale. I would think no matter what you want the least amount of friction as possible. the wives tale I have always heard is a tight engine is a good engine.

[andyb]

No oil talk to ruin what's otherwise a reasonably interesting thread.

[fintip]

Well, I only have one comment's worth of response to give anyways, and so I'll just share my source:

http://fjowners.wikidot.com/oil#toc11

That's what I've read on the topic, and it follows from everything else I've read. If there's any reasonable support for that theory that I have not heard of, I'd love to hear it, but I by no means intend to start some kind of dogmatic discussion.

I'd be interested in hearing more about why this is an "Old Wives tale"  I was under the impression that if you used
synthetic for break in you would not get the polishing action needed to allow the rings to seal properly. (Some wear
being good wear and what not.) I have to admit, I can definitely say that I could tell a marked difference in the
behavior in the engine day to day as it "broke in" It started getting progressively easier to start. Cylinder temperatures
started coming down. The idle needed to be adjusted several times as the internal friction in the engine dropped.
The very character of the engine has become more relaxed.

Some wear being good wear? On a brand new engine that is tighter than its machining tolerances allow it to stay, it will settle down and loosen up, wear itself in. That is what break-in is. If we could avoid that, I think one would want to (in theory) (the engine would probably need to be made/rebuilt in response to that if it were possible, but it's not, so it's all theoretical; but the engine will continue to get 'more relaxed' until the day it runs out of compression). But as what I pointed to says, it is simply untrue that synthetics are 'more slippery' than conventional oils. That's not a benefit of synthetic oil. Synthetic oil just degrades slower, basically, because it requires less additives. So I don't know why one would think 'it won't get the good wear if I use synthetics' would be the belief that it is slipperier.

But then I have to ask: good wear? I mean, necessary wear, a part of the process wear, but I don't know about the term 'good wear'. But I guess that's a separate question. Good wear or not, there's no reason I know of that synthetic oil should change how it wears... It will just change the rate at which the oil goes bad.

I could understand, though, an argument for using cheaper oils for the break-in, since you don't use the oil long enough to make the oil go bad and see the difference between the two. That'd be about all I could imagine for honest justification, though.

[skymasteres]

you know, watching this thread (ive read the whole damn thing) is like watching an action drama on tv. you never know whats gonna happen next!

You know. The other thing that I just realized is, it would take a staggering amount of time to actually read this thread from start to... uhm... well this point is staggering.  I tip my hat to you.

No oil talk to ruin what's otherwise a reasonably interesting thread.

Yeah, and here I was all ready to put the issue to bed. (After the question was raised I spent a good chunck
of time thinking critically about the issue and came to a conclusion that I can stand behind) Good points have
been raised here and in other "Oil" threads, but it boils down to the fact that during break in there is a window
of opportunity where wear is a required thing to allow the rings to seal properly. For me the single greatest
selling point of synthetics is their ability to almost arrest wear. That's something I want to take advantage of
once everything is all smoothed out and sealed up inside. (I'll leave the hows and whys for a different thread)

Anyway, this has been a little more than just an oil change and a valve lash adjustment. Now that I have a
fair amount of saddle time there are some things that I would like to address. But a word of caution to those
that want to remove their fairings.



On the 90 (and I'm guessing the 87-90 model years) there is no EASY WAY to just remove the main fairing from
the support frame with the fairing support frame still attached to the bike. DO NOT try what I did and pull every
single screw out of the thing trying to separate it from the support frame. (Maybe the 91+ fairing is different,
but this doesn't work for the 90)  What you end up with is a very mobile fairing plastic that is still attached by
the blind nuts holding the headlight in place. Of course if you don't know this you end up with this.





I can fix it, but it was really a "D'oh!" moment.
The main take away here is, IT IS MUCH EASIER TO REMOVE THE FOUR BOLTS, ONE CONNECTOR and SPEEDO
CALBE than it is to pull the whole support frame than the couple dozed screws. (And break something) Besides,
it's easy to strip the frame out of the faring once it's off the bike. I don't know why people made such a point
of leaving the support frame attached to the bike when taking the fairing off. (I'd like to know what it is about
the 91+ bikes that makes that action so much more desirable)

I really had her stripped down so I could use the shim kit and get the valve lash adjusted. (I set her up really
loose so that I wouldn't have issues with the valves getting really tight during the break in)





It turns out that I was actually a little over zealous on the adjusting of the valves on the loose end to start
with. Well maybe not when you look at number 4. It sure gets messy on the exhaust end when one of the
shims snaps down in the bucket and splashes oil ALL over everything.  (I wouldn't have figured that such a
little shim could displace so much oil)





While I was turning the engine back and forth I took a look at the main seal to see if it was leaking too.



Looks good so far....





And yes, quite possible the only seal on the engine that isn't leaking...


The next thing is taking my rough idea for making some mods to the electrical system and turning them into reality.
 






I know it's basically diner napkin stuff, but that's how I do things. It never ends up looking like the original
idea, but it works.

Well, sometimes it looks like the original idea. Like this RAM ball mount on the stem bolt. Funny thing was I hit
it with a punch to give myself an appropriately sized divot to make sure the drill bit didn't walk. Well I hit it way
to hard, or the metal was a lot softer than I expected and pounded it in pretty good. Flipping it over and hitting
it from the other side with the punch actually did a surprisingly good job of flattening it back out.
(That and you have to love the ductility of steel)




So after drilling it out to 1/4" I get this. And a nice place to mount my GPS.





That's all for now. I'll tackle the wiring nightmare later....