FJ1346 from ashes to... Well, we'll see...

[skymasteres]

You really should remove the plugs and clean the internal portion of the cams. When I receive back the cams I have Mega-Cycle grind for me, they remove the plugs and replace them with allen head plugs.

You can find the stock plugs here; Camshaft Plug

If they did not remove the plugs when the cams were welded and ground, they need to be cleaned. Well, they need to be cleaned even if they weren't ground. I remove all the plugs from cams I put into a rebuild engine and clean them with a barrel brush.

Randy - RPM

PS. - You probably should have coated the cam thrust flange as well as the journals.

Well I'll be. How do I remove the plugs without messing up the cams? (These don't look like you can just spin them like engine block freeze plugs.)
And now for the stupid question. Just which surface is the "thrust Flange" anyway?

[X-Ray]

You're right, I can't believe how much material has been added to those lobes. It looks like its gone from a stock street cam to one you would use in a 1/4 mile drag car, 

[skymasteres]

Well, this is a surprise indeed. (Less than 4 weeks) I got my gears back from APE racing all ready to be coated. The only bad news is they charge sales tax on their labor so the bill ended up being $400. (Still not sure how that works, but I'll look into it later)  Overall I am pleased with the way everything lines up. There was no welding required to make the cuts so I at least have that going for me. Hopefully I won't regret not getting the downshift sides of the gears cut but time will tell.


Here is a question. In the image above there, I know it's hard to see, the bushing that is to the left of the fixed gear on the input shaft is frozen. The oil hole is lining up right now, but I wonder if I should worry about trying to remove it and clean up the mating surfaces... Thoughts?

[skymasteres]

Time for a little update. First let me say that the undercutting on the gears looks great.
The tolerances on the mating surfaces are extremely tight with everything meshing as it should.
No matter which way I engage the cut surfaces they all line up perfectly with no gaps.
Here are some shots of the mating surfaces.  (56k Modem users beware...)




 










I know, probably overkill on the pics, but it illustrates the point well.
Next I set up to get the gears coated with Cermalube. (Kind of the whole point of getting the gears back unassembled.
So I could coat them and bring them back for assembly) I really didn't like the idea of putting an oil retaining lubricant on
the freshly cut surfaces of the dogs so I used wax to fill the pockets in the gears and q-tips (I know, high tech right?)
to clean off the coating on the protruding dogs.




After curing the wax melted off leaving just the residue that was on the surface.


So, once I get the transmission assembled I'll be mostly set for the reassembly. Which brings me to the class participation part of this post.
Does anyone have a list of the O-rings/seals that should be replaced with new when an engine is to be reassembled? I was looking at ordering
the parts and as far as I can tell it's the O-rings for the oil galley plugs, the oil pump O-rings, and the case gasket. Do any of you guys know what
sizes the O-rings are? (I'd rather get them from the local hardware store than pay $3.75 PER O-ring from Yamaha... )

[Dan Filetti]

Does anyone have a list of the O-rings/seals that should be replaced with new when an engine is to be reassembled? I was looking at ordering
the parts and as far as I can tell it's the O-rings for the oil galley plugs, the oil pump O-rings, and the case gasket. Do any of you guys know what
sizes the O-rings are? (I'd rather get them from the local hardware store than pay $3.75 PER O-ring from Yamaha... )

Ping Randy, He'll know what you need off the top of his head, and be able to send them to you toot-sweet and cheap.

Dan

[X-Ray]

Ping Randy, He'll know what you need off the top of his head, and be able to send them to you toot-sweet and cheap.

Dan

  I thought I was the only one who said toot-sweet, lol, good one Dan!

[Flynt]

I'd rather get them from the local hardware store than pay $3.75 PER O-ring from Yamaha... )

With the energy you've personally put into this, the coating/stripping/re-coating is a great example, I think I'd buy the OEM part from Randy...  or you could save $10.00 and cost yourself a fortune.  What am I missing?

Frank

[skymasteres]

I'd rather get them from the local hardware store than pay $3.75 PER O-ring from Yamaha... )

With the energy you've personally put into this, the coating/stripping/re-coating is a great example, I think I'd buy the OEM part from Randy...  or you could save $10.00 and cost yourself a fortune.  What am I missing?

Frank

For lack of a better term call it stubbornness. Or maybe it's because I'm a cheap bugger who can't
stand paying 100 times the value for stupid parts. 

I went and ordered the o-rings for the inside the case parts anyway. But I feel like it's $16 wasted.
I refuse to order the yamaha o-rings for the galley plugs. If my standard 9 cent ones hold I see no
reason to spend another $10. If they don't, one I'll be REALLY surprised, and two I'll just spend the $10.

I have some experience in machining and I just can't see how the Yamaha o-rings are going to perform so much
better than standard o-rings that they justify charging $3.55 for a 15 cent o-ring. I compared both the original
and the standard 70 durometer o-ring and, for the same size, the only difference is the Yamaha rings are more
like a 40 or 50 durometer rubber. (not as hard) Now, I can see this making a difference if you had two relatively
unsupported surfaces where the material could flex. Thus allowing the shape of the part to become distorted and
perhaps compromise sealing surfaces elsewhere.  But, in the case of these particular o-rings are well supported
and I just don't see how they would cause problems. That being said, I chickened out, caved, bent over, grabbed
my ankles...., took out my wallet, and bought the damn things...

Here is the oil pump with the o-ring positions marked.


Did I mention that I REALLY buggered up the original bolts that hold the oil pump together? Well yeah, it's toast. But on the bright side I got to use the drill press more on the oil pump to make room for the 10mm socket. (Needed to drive the replacement fasteners) (M6x55 for those that are interested)

And here is the case where the oil pump goes in.



Here are the bolts that secure the oil pump to the case. (They seem to provide plenty of clamping force)



It'll be a few days before they're in. I still have to get the coating on the cylinder head done so it's all good.

Here is the oil pump all taken apart and having the same coating process applied to the rotors and case.



Of particular note, if you do take one of these apart, THIS dowel goes HERE! Gosh it took me a lot of looking and wondering why I had an extra piece before I figured that one out. (It was late and I didn't have the leftover coating burnished out of the hole it went in....)

[racerrad8]

With the energy you've personally put into this, the coating/stripping/re-coating is a great example, I think I'd buy the OEM part from Randy...  or you could save $10.00 and cost yourself a fortune.  What am I missing?

Frank

For lack of a better term call it stubbornness. Or maybe it's because I'm a cheap bugger who can't
stand paying 100 times the value for stupid parts.

Well, let's see...

The first issue with any Yamaha o-ring is they are metric. I have yet to find a local hardware store, including the one owned by a good friend of mine that stocks the correct size.

The second issue, I could have supplied you all with genuine Yamaha o-rings, three for the oil pump, the case split o-ring and all three galley plug o-rings for $16.39 plus shipping and you would have had them in two days.

Oh well...

Randy - RPM

[skymasteres]

Well, let's see...

The first issue with any Yamaha o-ring is they are metric. I have yet to find a local hardware store, including the one owned by a good friend of mine that stocks the correct size.

The second issue, I could have supplied you all with genuine Yamaha o-rings, three for the oil pump, the case split o-ring and all three galley plug o-rings for $16.39 plus shipping and you would have had them in two days.

Oh well...

Randy - RPM

Randy, I'm not a complete dumbass... (Well not always) 

I am fortunate enough to have a local hardware store that stocks both metric and standard o-rings.
(Made it REALLY easy to match things up.) Of course I call the little hardware store the 'Magic' hardware
store because the place is like a Mary Poppins bag. It's just chock full of more stuff than you would think
possible for such a small place.

I actually did a quick search on your site a few days ago and didn't see the o-rings listed. Yesterday I
happened to be walk by a Yamaha dealer (was getting a key cut for a Honda and stumbled onto the place)
I figured what the hell, I was getting feedback that I'm an idiot for not getting the 'right' o-rings so I went
in and ordered them.  They'll be here in 5 days worst case and it cost me $16.08.

[skymasteres]

Alright, on the bright side I did get the XRJ starter clutch rigmarole worked out with Randy.
(He was good enough to sell me a used assembly out of one of his engines)

There are a few important differences between the two parts. Most importantly, but the least evident visually is
the difference in the diameter of the surface that the sprag grips on. For the FJ starter clutch it's 1.86" in diameter,
for the XJR it's 1.8". It doesn't sound like much, but that 0.06" difference prevents the FJ gear from working with
the XJR part and vice versa.

Here are the parts for comparison. The FJ1200 clutch on the left and the XRJ1300 clutch on the right. You'll note that
the FJ clutch has the three roller engagement vs eighteen for the XJR. The FJ part is also machined vs cast on the XJR.



There is also a weight difference between the parts (Actually some significant weight differences)

Here is the FJ1200 starter clutch on the scale weighing in at a hefty 1115g.



Compared to a fairly dainty 852g for the XJR1300 part. I'm fairly impressed that they managed a 9.3oz reduction considering the
increase in the clutch area. The diameter of the clutch is also reduced which in turn reduces the polar moment of inertia for the
part. I figure if they were the same weight, that alone would reduce the rotational inertia, but in addition to the weight reduction
it should help with spin up and down.



This is something that surprised me. The FJ starter gear is actually lighter than the respective XJR part.
Here is the FJ starter gear.



The XJR gear below is actually about an ounce heavier than the FJ gear. Visually I can only figure the additional wight
comes from the extra material used in making the gear face wider. I'm not sure why they did this. When you look at the
gear from the edge you can see from the wear pattern that only half of the tooth is engaged anyway. (the half that is
added is the part that is untouched)



I am actually considering chucking the thing in a lathe and turning down the gear so that it matches the stock one.
But I need to mock it up to make sure that I'm not cutting off something I need...
Here is the comaprison shot with respect to the width of the two starter clutch gears.



Finally I also finally stopped screwing around with the transmission shift drum. I didn't like how the holes were so I went and
champhered all of the holes. A little more stress relieved and a little lighter.

[JMR]

I remember working on a Muzzy Raptor with World Superbike kit parts....The shift drum (and clutch basket) were incredible. Everything milled out.....lots of hand work in them. To bad they were using shitty MTC pistons in that engine.

[Pat Conlon]

I always wanted to ask: What is the reason for drilling the shift drum? A couple of grams weight savings?

[JMR]

I always wanted to ask: What is the reason for drilling the shift drum? A couple of grams weight savings?

Basically....yes. The lighter drum also rotates easier as there isn't as much mass to it. On race bikes it comes down to the details Pat. I smooth the shift fork tracks on the drum just to help the shift fork pegs to move easier

[skymasteres]

I always wanted to ask: What is the reason for drilling the shift drum? A couple of grams weight savings?

Basically....yes. The lighter drum also rotates easier as there isn't as much mass to it. On race bikes it comes down to the details Pat. I smooth the shift fork tracks on the drum just to help the shift fork pegs to move easier

It's all about the inertia. If you look at the mechanics of how the shift drum moves the shift forks you can see that the
shift lever that you engage with your foot only does half of the work completing the shift. The mechanism that completes
the shift is the spring loaded lever that rides on the petals of the shift drum. When you push the shift lever it loads up
that spring as the roller rides up the uphill side of the petal. When it passes the peak, the spring forces the roller down
the other side spinning the drum quickly moving the shift forks and gears respectively completing the shift.

The part of the process with the greatest impact, aside from friction, is the inertia of the drum that the spring and roller
has to ever come. If you lighten the drum, you decrease the energy required to rotate the drum...