Did I roast my clutch?

[RPM - Robert]

Unfortunately, more trade classes, welding,wood working, automotive, etc. are even being dropped from school selective curriculum. We have colleges like universal technical institute. More if an expensive joke really. I had a friend go to UTI out of high school. They had a "recruiter" come in to our automotive class and he got suckered in. All said and done he was $40,000 in debt, didn't learn much more than he had already known from high school automotive. After his graduation it took almost a year to get hired. He finally got a job at a Chevrolet dealership and worked there for years for $14 an hour. Now he works at a winery. Moving boxes and making $35 an hour.

We have apprenticeships for electrical, welding, iron worker, but for whatever reason automotive apprenticeships aren't really a thing.

Mike Rowe has a very good listen about college vs trade schools here in the states. In short there are millions of kids going to college getting degrees and fighting for a minimal number of jobs. On the other hand there are millions of blue collar labor jobs with a minimal number of people going to trade school, doing apprenticeships, or anything of that nature.

[Millietant]

Unfortunately, more trade classes, welding,wood working, automotive, etc. are even being dropped from school selective curriculum. We have colleges like universal technical institute. More if an expensive joke really. I had a friend go to UTI out of high school. They had a "recruiter" come in to our automotive class and he got suckered in. All said and done he was $40,000 in debt, didn't learn much more than he had already known from high school automotive. After his graduation it took almost a year to get hired. He finally got a job at a Chevrolet dealership and worked there for years for $14 an hour. Now he works at a winery. Moving boxes and making $35 an hour.

We have apprenticeships for electrical, welding, iron worker, but for whatever reason automotive apprenticeships aren't really a thing.

Mike Rowe has a very good listen about college vs trade schools here in the states. In short there are millions of kids going to college getting degrees and fighting for a minimal number of jobs. On the other hand there are millions of blue collar labor jobs with a minimal number of people going to trade school, doing apprenticeships, or anything of that nature.

I'd guess with modern cars (I think it's the same with you guys in the uSA, but not sure), most servicing is an oil and filters change, a few standard parts replacement and then a lap-top check.

Diagnosing a problem in a dealership these days is all about plugging a  diagnostics too into a connector and reading off a fault code, looking up what that relates to and replacing a part. With the prevalence of automatic transmissions in the US, it wouldn't surprise me if some "mechanics" had never had to deal with a clutch, let alone know how to check one out, or even remove it and even fewer will have seen a carburettor, let alone a bank of 4 of them - over here, most of the smaller front wheel drive cars need to have the engines unbolted and lifted, or jacked up in the chassis to get the clutch housing off to get at the clutch plate. Simply replacing a $50 clutch plate can cost $800 in dealership charges and many otherwise perfect, older, high mileage cars are sold for pennies to "scrap" dealers with lifts and hoists, who put a new plate/thrust bearing in and then sell for $500-600 the car they've just paid $50 for.

Modern "Mechanics" are called "technicians" and are nothing like those of old and have a totally different set of skills, unfortunately

[RPM - Robert]

Same over here, /tires/tire rotations, oil changes, and plugging in laptops/computers.

Motorcycle dealers often won't touch FJs here. We are getting more and more calls/emails about how people took their FJ to the Yamaha dealer and they won't work on it.

Most definitely true on the transmissions over here. It is getting harder and harder to buy a true manual. Hell, I think the new Corvette doesn't even have a true manual option.

[giantkiller]

I don't have any problems even with Barnett  and extra diaphragm.  I have shorty levers on most of my bikes.  I have more of a problem with my right throttle hand. Lol.

[ribbert]

I don't have any problems even with Barnett and extra diaphragm.  I have shorty levers on most of my bikes.  

Dan, I'm not surprised, look at the size of you. You could probably bend down and operate the pushrod with your finger.  



For those that don't know, that is Dan to the left of the photo

Noel

[giantkiller]

That's what I used to  look like now I'm just a fat old man. Lol

[aigram]

Back to the regularly scheduled program. I would pop the clutch cover off and look at the steels and frictions. The slip will need to be addressed any ways. You can do a few things to address this.
If the steels/frictions are in order still.

1) Change the spring. This should get you years of service before having to replace again.
2) Add a second spring to the original spring. This will add clutch lever pull but you should never have another clutch slippage issue unless it is self inflicted by burning up the clutch.
3) Install a Barnett coil over conversion or something similar. We have new Barnett and some used ones out of the race cars.
4) You can do this for either of the above. remove the inner most narrow disc and anti chatter springs and install a wider disc back there. This will add a bit more friction surface area which will decrease the likelihood of slippage.

Thanks Robert. Are you thinking that from what I described, I did observe clutch slippage at high RPM, rather than some odd carb transition behavior?

[RPM - Robert]

Slippage at high RPM while trying to go wide open, would point to some sort of slippage. If you went wide open and had a carb problem, it would be more likely the bike would stall out. It's not a two stroke where it takes off once it's "up in the pipe"

[aigram]

Thanks Robert. Would this kind of behavior quickly transfer a lot of heat into the clutch that it could not normally dissipate? Is it likely now time to replace the clutch during the offseason?

[RPM - Robert]

Not likely to have instantly ruined/overheated the clutch. However, from the problem you are describing either the plates or the spring is worn/fatigued enough to let the clutch slip. So as posted

1) Change the spring. This should get you years of service before having to replace again.
2) Add a second spring to the original spring. This will add clutch lever pull but you should never have another clutch slippage issue unless it is self inflicted by burning up the clutch.
3) Install a Barnett coil over conversion or something similar. We have new Barnett and some used ones out of the race cars.
4) You can do this for either of the above. remove the inner most narrow disc and anti chatter springs and install a wider disc back there. This will add a bit more friction surface area which will decrease the likelihood of slippage.

5) Should add check and replace discs as needed.

You will want to measure the spring and fibers and check steels as Rolf posted. The clutch is a wear item, just like tires and oil, they need to be serviced/replaced every so often. This can vary for time between services based on many things, riding style, lack/proficiency of using the clutch to stop and go, etc., etc. 32k miles seems a little low but again it can vary. I know we rebuilt Ramos' motor a couple years ago. It now has over 100k on it, he swapped motors from wrecked bike to new bike, and it still shows no symptoms, but he also runs a double clutch spring, I believe.

[Millietant]

Thanks Robert. Would this kind of behavior quickly transfer a lot of heat into the clutch that it could not normally dissipate? Is it likely now time to replace the clutch during the offseason?

Clutches usually get toasted by repeated abuse/excessive slipping when pulling away from a standstill (like doing lots of drag race style starts, or lots of clutch-up wheelies). Once you're on the move, there's little you can do (but not nothing) to damage your clutch, unless you constantly hold and slip the clutch while riding.

Once the clutch plates are damaged/worn by this type of activity, they start to slip when the engine/transmission is under the greatest load - ie WOT at high revs, or when pulling quickly away from a standstill.

Once the damage is done, the slipping will only get worse with time and as Robert says, a clutch overhaul is the only solution.