89 FJ1200 engine and gearbox rebuild

[ribbert]

The studs... I'm still unclear on the best procedure.

I have one stud that came out of the crank case and still has the nut attached.

I'll try gripping that one in the vice with the soft jaws and remove the nut. Once that's out, how tight does it have to go back into the crank case? ...and how do I grip it so as to tighten it?

Perhaps I can torque it down using a head nut then somehow grip the stud and remove the nut.

Or should I just replace the stud?

As for the corroded studs, clean and paint them.... but I can do that with them in the crank case, right? i.e. no need to remove them from the crank case?


Sorry for all the newbie questions, I want to get this right the first time.

Cheers,
Gabe.

A couple of suggestions that might help.

1  I would vigorously (or power) wire brush the studs then paint them with a high temp paint. It's the plastic that causes most of the rust in the first place.

2  Cardboard egg cartons. They make fantastic storage for small parts you want to keep in order such as shims, valves etc. The FJ also has a lot of small parts that only go in one place and they're good for odd, one off bolts, nuts, screws and fittings. Just identify each piece with biro opposite the part or inside the lid then close it up, write on the box and stick it on high shelf or in a cupboard.
It is one of the few methods I have used that is "Black Hole" proof.

In a month of so's time you will not remember where anything goes. To open up the carton and find everything just where you left it, labelled and in order with nothing missing is great.
These are used by a surprising number of workshops and mechanics, particularly when working on unfamiliar machines.

3  When it comes time to reassemble the motor, tune back in here or do some research on the correct way to tension bolts, the important ones anyway. I don't ever recall it being discussed here.

4 Curb you excitement, a freshly cracked motor will have you wanting to do everything "while you're in there". Don't get ahead of yourself, such as worrying about the cam journals, as they are unlikely to be a problem anyway. If they are, worry about it then.

Nothing beats the satisfaction of cruising down the road on the engine you built and no engine ever sounded sweeter. Good luck, you'll get great support here.

Noel

[DeltaFlyer]

Thanks Noel, sounds like the voice of experience talking.

A couple of suggestions that might help.

1  I would vigorously (or power) wire brush the studs then paint them with a high temp paint. It's the plastic that causes most of the rust in the first place.

I think that's the way I'll go, and I'll probably replace the one that's out if I can find a new OEM stud, otherwise I'll try to recover the one I have.

2  Cardboard egg cartons. They make fantastic storage for small parts you want to keep in order such as shims, valves etc. The FJ also has a lot of small parts that only go in one place and they're good for odd, one off bolts, nuts, screws and fittings. Just identify each piece with biro opposite the part or inside the lid then close it up, write on the box and stick it on high shelf or in a cupboard.
It is one of the few methods I have used that is "Black Hole" proof.

In a month of so's time you will not remember where anything goes. To open up the carton and find everything just where you left it, labelled and in order with nothing missing is great.
These are used by a surprising number of workshops and mechanics, particularly when working on unfamiliar machines.

Great idea. I started doing something similar but with zip lock lunch bags. I write on each bag where the part(s) came from and I'm packing the bags in a tub in the order they came off the bike.

3  When it comes time to reassemble the motor, tune back in here or do some research on the correct way to tension bolts, the important ones anyway. I don't ever recall it being discussed here.

I'll definitely be taking you up on that. 

4 Curb you excitement, a freshly cracked motor will have you wanting to do everything "while you're in there". Don't get ahead of yourself, such as worrying about the cam journals, as they are unlikely to be a problem anyway. If they are, worry about it then.

Nothing beats the satisfaction of cruising down the road on the engine you built and no engine ever sounded sweeter. Good luck, you'll get great support here.

Noel

I'm going over the whole thing in detail mostly because I don't want to miss anything, but also because I'm really enjoying my time in the workshop. It (hopefully) will be a very long time, if ever, that I'll be in there again. It's a bit like going on a big, long distance tour in that sense.

Cheers,
Gabe.

[DeltaFlyer]

Regarding the stud that came out and whether or not to replace it, how hard did it come out? was it about the same amount of torque that was required to remove the others? reason being is if there is ANY chance that stud is compromised I would not chance it and possibly break it off in the crankcase when torqueing it down....replace it. if you don't have a Stud removal tool the double nut method works. the tool allows you to grip the stud closer to the case reducing twist on the stud. they are also a cheap and usefull tool.

Scott

Initially it was the same effort to loosen the nut, but then it was quite stiff to unscrew from the crank case, probably half the effort required to loosen it initially. It got progressively easier as it came out but it did require the driver all the way out, it was never loose enough to move by hand alone.

Now I'm worried about it breaking off when torquing the head back on!... I might just replace it if I can find a good one. I'll check with Randy if they're available new. Plus I'll look into that stud tool.

Thanks for the advice, Scott.

Cheers,
Gabe.

[DeltaFlyer]

Remove the stuck nut. Clean the threads.
Double nut the stud....lock the two nuts together. With the nuts locked, use the top nut to torque in the stud.
Now, unlock the nuts....

Thanks 

seems obvious after someone explains it 

Cheers,
Gabe

[DeltaFlyer]

Will this type of tool be adequate for tightening a stud back into the crank case?



Cheers,
Gabe

[Country Joe]

Gabe,
That would be far more than adequate. But as has already been mentioned, 2 nuts & 2 wrenches is all you need. Not to mention the jam nut method will not leave marks on the shank of the bolts that could possibly lead to them breaking. I only use the pictured tool to remove studs that I would be discarding.

Joe

[DeltaFlyer]

I have to post these first few pics because I have never been so organized in my life and it's quite likely I never will be ever again  



In this next pic check out the stainless steel unit the crank case is sitting on. It's really well made, very solid - all heavy gauge stainless steel, all TIG welded together. It has heavy duty wheels, two of which can be locked, and a heavy duty drawer with ultra smooth guides that allow the entire draw to be opened without falling out. This is a real quality piece of kit....  Can you believe that I fished it out of a dumpster?   I sh*t you not!


I went over the clutch pack and every plate measured well within spec, in fact they showed very little sign of wear. The diaphragm spring, however, is looking a little weak. It's almost at the minimum height limit. The good news is that it has no warp whatsoever.

You may not be able to tell from the pic but there's a sheet of glass on the timber box. It's a fairly thick piece of reinforced glass I got from a friend that works in glass. He assures me that as far as flatness is concerned it's about as close to perfectly flat as he can get.

The clutch had started to slip above 5000rpm just recently, and by the looks of the first steel plate this is the one where it did all the slipping. There's the tell tale discoloration of heat on the first plate...


...but it's only very minor, and all the plates, including this one are perfectly flat.

I'm going to do the double spring fix by installing a second brand new OEM spring on top of my one. That should eliminate clutch slip at the lowest cost.

The teeth look to be in good shape with barely a sign of wear which amounts to little more than surface discoloration.


That's the clutch done and ready to reinstall once the new diaphragm spring arrives.
The wire is to keep all the pieces together. I've kept all the plates in the order they came out. I'm not sure if it matters but it seemed like a good idea.


Next I dismantled and inspected the starter motor. The commutator and brushes all tested in spec. The commutator diameter is right at 28mm and the brushes 11mm each. Checked the commutator for short with the ohmmeter and all is well.

Cleaned a bunch of soot out the end caps, and reassembled with a little grease in the plain bearing end, and it's ready to go back in the engine. The starter was working fine, but now I now exactly what condition it's in, so that's one less thing to worry about.









I removed the alternator and found that the shaft seal is leaking so will need to be replaced.


Uncapped the alternator, cleaned and inspected. Everything looks OK.


That's it for now. Next I'm going to make a valve spring compressor and strip down the head.
I'll probably have another update in a couple of days

Cheers,
Gabe

[movenon]

I would replace the stock pressure plate with an XJR unit. Easy mod and feels a lot better. Nice pictures thanks ! Yea and I was going to comment on that SS stand.  Good score. 
George

[racerrad8]

What is the difference between the FJ & XJR pressure plate?

Randy - RPM

[FJ_Hooligan]

While you got that alternator apart, it's a good time to replace that voltage regulator with RPM's Racetech unit.

[movenon]

What is the difference between the FJ & XJR pressure plate?

Randy - RPM

Ok please revise that to the FJR ? "clutch spring"  http://www.rpmracingca.com/proddetail.asp?prod=Clutch%3AClutchSpring&cat=39
Thanks for the correction Randy.
George

[DeltaFlyer]

While you got that alternator apart, it's a good time to replace that voltage regulator with RPM's Racetech unit.

But this one is working OK, why would I replace it?

[DeltaFlyer]

What is the difference between the FJ & XJR pressure plate?

Randy - RPM

Ok please revise that to the FJR ? "clutch spring"  http://www.rpmracingca.com/proddetail.asp?prod=Clutch%3AClutchSpring&cat=39
Thanks for the correction Randy.
George

Yeah, that's the one I ordered. I'm also replacing the bottom narrow fiber disk with a wide one.

I may also get the pressure plate machined and replace the top narrow disk with a wide one, if it's a straightforward machining job. I'll talk to the machinist when I take the head and cylinder block to get done and see what he says.

[movenon]

That's a good mod IMO.  I replaced my spring (and disk) from Randy and didn't realize how crappy the old spring was until I did it.  I also doubled up the spring with the old one but didn't like how hard it was to use the clutch so pulled it out and just went with the new spring.  Works great, has a good feel at the lever.

You are making good time on this project. 
George

[fj1289]

While you got that alternator apart, it's a good time to replace that voltage regulator with RPM's Racetech unit.

But this one is working OK, why would I replace it?

The voltage regulator is a very common failure point on the FJ.  The normal failure mode is over voltage which leads to very short battery life.  Worse though, is it is not always a consistent failure - has been known to test well in the drive way or garage, but later during the ride spike to over 15 volts -- maybe due to heat? vibration? both?