Prolems with solenoid petcock on my 87 FJ1200

[gilangie]

Hi - i have a 1987 FJ1200 (Australian model) and am having real problems with the fuel cock which also has a solenoid shutoff to stop the fuel draining when the bike is in the shed.  It should operate properly with a vacuum when the motor is starting and it seems to work properly on the bench but is failing on the bike.  The Yamaha price is steep and my mechanic has suggested I turn to you guys for a cheaper solution, alternatively you may know of a work around.

Thanks for your help

Gil

[FJ111200]

I would disconnect it and connect an in-line fuel tap from the tank fuel line to the carb feeds.
You'll have to add a single pipe connection to the 2 sets of carbs but is that a problem?
Then just turn the new tap on or off when either riding or stationary.
Obviously keep the original fuel tap.
It could look a bit unsightly if not hidden discreetly.
One less electrical piece of junk the better as far as i'm concerned.

[Arnie]

Gil,

Check out this thread talking about the Pingel valve.

http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=3938.msg34338#msg34338

Cheers,
Arnie

Reposted from the "parts available" thread in response to original query.

[gilangie]

I was thinking the same thing the solenoid petcock is fine until it is not. 

Of course the petcock is tucked up hard under the LHS of the tank, i think pingle do a petcock plate and elbow that coudl be used to feed to carbies.  Would there be a problem putting a tap up where the reserve switch is next to the choke (on the LHS of the bike)?  I have never liked the idea of a reserve switch so i would probably fit it in there somehow.

Dumb question - I have never got in the habit of turning on or off a fuel tap and my last FJ never had a problem with the petcock - how long could i leave the FJ standing but not running with the tap in "on" position before fuel could start draining through the carbies and leak?

Thanks

Gil

[FJ111200]

how long could i leave the FJ standing but not running with the tap in "on" position before fuel could start draining through the carbies and leak?

There's two possibilities to that question and they are that there would be dirt in the carbs and that dirt is making the float valves stick open causing the fuel to carry on flowing, and secondly that the float valves and seats are worn causing fuel to carry on flowing.
We have this problem on the old XS1100's but it's become habit with me now to turn off the fuel tap after every ride.
Starts off with a little bit of corrosion in the tank and it works it's way through. Even the filters in the tap and carbs will not trap the very fine particles of rust. And you know the FJ's ain't getting any younger.

[JFox]

Hi,
My suggestion is do it 'properly', I mean without any byway...
There you have only solenoid and membrane. The cost is relative cheap (maybe transport cost would be problematic) and solution is durable.
Cleaning is for free and seems to be first done
Of course you may find another vacum valve but its solve the problem only temporary.
Of course you may install additional hand operated valve, but you have to find easy way to oprate

BTW:
1) Haven't you problem with reserve button? In this FJ model it's responsible for solenoid valve on-off operate.
2) Another question is haven't you problem with fuel filter?
3) Obvious, but I'll ask: did you connect underpressure signal?

Easiest way to check if the petcock is ok, is to make underpressure and see if it stop or not pulling the fuel.

Jarek

[racerrad8]

Here is the Pingle petcock for the FJ; http://www.rpmracingca.com/proddetail.asp?prod=M%2FC%3AFJPetcock

Randy - RPM

[gilangie]

Hi,
My suggestion is do it 'properly', I mean without any byway...
There you have only solenoid and membrane. The cost is relative cheap (maybe transport cost would be problematic) and solution is durable.
Cleaning is for free and seems to be first done
Of course you may find another vacum valve but its solve the problem only temporary.
Of course you may install additional hand operated valve, but you have to find easy way to oprate

BTW:
1) Haven't you problem with reserve button? In this FJ model it's responsible for solenoid valve on-off operate.
2) Another question is haven't you problem with fuel filter?
3) Obvious, but I'll ask: did you connect underpressure signal?

Easiest way to check if the petcock is ok, is to make underpressure and see if it stop or not pulling the fuel.

Jarek

Hi jarek,

I live in Australia and cannot find a replacement petcock easily so that is why i was looking for a non-Yamaha solution.

I do not know what you mean  when you say "without any byway....."

What do you mean when you say "connect underpressure signal"?  When we test the valve on the bench fuel flows properly, when on the bike it seems to malfunction when operating at more than an idling rev, presumably the higher th erevs the greaeter the vaccuum pressure but it is difficult to test operation under pressure without specialist equipment - which i do not have.

Regards
Gil

[gilangie]

Here is the Pingle petcock for the FJ; http://www.rpmracingca.com/proddetail.asp?prod=M%2FC%3AFJPetcock

Randy - RPM

Outstanding Randy - neat solution.  Presumably i run now without a reserve?  This troubles me not at all.

Regards

Gil

[Pat Conlon]

.... Presumably i run now without a reserve?  This troubles me not at all..

Gil, running without the reserve is not the issue. That's what your odometer and fuel light is for...
The *real* issue is reaching up under the tank into that hot, hot area and turning off the gas.....and you do want to turn it off....right?
The Pingle petcock with the Pingle vacuum valve would be the way to go... or just get a new '84/85 oem petcock and call it a day.

[JFox]

Hi jarek,
I live in Australia and cannot find a replacement petcock easily so that is why i was looking for a non-Yamaha solution.
I totally understand.

I do not know what you mean  when you say "without any byway....."
My English is not perfect, I meant non Yamaha solutions.

What do you mean when you say "connect underpressure signal"?  When we test the valve on the bench fuel flows properly, when on the bike it seems to malfunction when operating at more than an idling rev, presumably the higher th erevs the greaeter the vaccuum pressure but it is difficult to test operation under pressure without specialist equipment - which i do not have.]
I meant "Connect vacum signal", which actually is given from first cylinder - carb joint. To check petcock is easier then you think. Just make a vacum pressure by your mouth. If there is no pressure fuel doesn't flow, if the vacum perssure is - fuel flow.
IMO revs doesn't matter when considering petcock. If fuel flows and engine works properly at iddle, and problems are at higher revs it is not the petcock matter. It is matter of fuel flow drop generally.

If I am right, see as follows:
a) When you change revs can you notice the problem immediately? I shoot it's carburetors problem. When it was last carb service in your bike?
b) Or engine works some time and then rapidly stops? Engine works only when fuel level inside the carburetors is proper. When fuel supply is poor, level goes down or eaven fuel finishes, it might be the problem. In this option i would shoot dirt in the tank and in fuel line (also in petcock).
IMO when petcock is fault it just stop the fuel or leaking - constantly.
Anyway, if you find the problem in petcock you may make it empty - permanently opened all the time. The only problem is if your carburetors doesn't keep fuel level. In this case fuel may flow out.
What kind of malfunction do you mean?

[gilangie]

[/quote]
Gil, running without the reserve is not the issue. That's what your odometer and fuel light is for...
The *real* issue is reaching up under the tank into that hot, hot area and turning off the gas.....and you do want to turn it off....right?
The Pingle petcock with the Pingle vacuum valve would be the way to go... or just get a new '84/85 oem petcock and call it a day.
[/quote]
Hi Randy,

I agree - odometer and fuel light are enough i never liked the reserve idea anyway.

My bike is 24 years old so the vaccuum valve is the better solution.  There is absolutely no way i would reach under the tank to turn off the valve.  Even cold it requires me to take off the seat - and I don't want to cut into the mesh panel on the left hand side of the fairing.  I looked closer at the pingl petcock and it seems to have a reserve position and honestly would prefer it not have one - do you know if the pingle petcock can operate without a reserve option at all?  Alternatively use the plate and elbow solution with the vaccuum valve - is there likley to be an issue with no gauze to filter our rust and dirt from the tank?

Regards

Gil

Regards

Gil