Weight loss

[2big]

Hi folks - greetings from Worcestershire, middle England.
I've just bought a '91 FJ1200 3wx. It's a bit scruffy cosmetically and the brakes are duff - wooden feel and at low speeds you can feel a pulse - like the disks are warped? Could be the ABS. Whatever I do has to be cheap, simple and improve the bike both cosmetically and performance wise.

It's heavy too! So
Ditch the ABS
Swap the wheels and discs ( might have some blue spots somewhere)
Fit a direct swap out aluminium swing arm

What easy fix suggestions have you to turn it round during lockdown?
Thanks Jan

[Sparky84]

G'day and Welcome Jan

Looking good and it looks like those brakes are doing quite well on that downhill you're on  

Enjoy the lockdown

Cheers
Alan

[2big]

  Alan...believe me these brakes are wooden & besides - I'm on the other side of the world
Keep smiling
Cheers
Jan

[andyoutandabout]

Beware, I bought myself an ABS model in the UK. Thought about removing all that gubbins and upgrading to 17 rear, but regulations dictate otherwise. Either the bike won't get through an MOT or insurance becomes a problem because the braking system has been modified. (Can't remember which, may even be both). Either way; classic law written by people who've never ridden a motorcycle. Replacing that OEM with non ABS blue dot calipers and such upgrades, improves the Fj in every respect, but blinkered policy has no interest in that.

[red]

Hi folks - greetings from Worcestershire, middle England.  I've just bought a '91 FJ1200 3wx. It's a bit scruffy cosmetically and the brakes are duff - wooden feel and at low speeds you can feel a pulse - like the disks are warped? Could be the ABS. Whatever I do has to be cheap, simple and improve the bike both cosmetically and performance wise.
Ditch the ABS
Swap the wheels and discs ( might have some blue spots somewhere)
Fit a direct swap out aluminium swing arm
What easy fix suggestions have you to turn it round during lockdown?
Thanks Jan

Jan,

I value the ABS.  Bleed the system well, replacing all the brake and clutch fluids.  Even a failed ABS is a straight pass-through for the hydraulics, and won't affect the "feel" of normal braking.
You may want new brake pads, or hand-sand (only!) the glaze off of the pads there. 
If you have "floating" disks, check that each of the "rivets" can rotate freely, as they should.  If you have solid disks, clamp a screwdriver to the frame somewhere with the tip almost touching the disk.  Rotate the wheel to check for warping, for each disk.
What is wrong with your swing arm?  I'd think about the shock absorber, before changing out the swing arm.  If you want better handling, a good shock and good tyres will count far more than a frame component.

[Motofun]

Feel bad for y'all that have to fight between "moditius" and satisfying "the man".  My FJ's carry antique plates which means no annual inspections and the insurance is cheap.

[2big]

Thanks guys for the positive suggestions and thoughts. The insurance in the uk is ok as long as you declare tweaks...tho insurance is reasonable the UK 'MOT'(roadworthy certificate) is still needed until the bike is 35 years old

As for the brakes - I couldn't lock em up if I tried so ABS sticker is more use than the actual system - was thinking of changing the sticker to say NBS - no braking system. Tell me guys who have this - does it actually work?

I went for a sunset ride tonight with my son on the back and had to do an emergency stop for a cat running out into the road. Kitty survived - but rather worryingly the left hand handle bar came a bit loose and was wobbly thereafter.

I think re: Bills suggestion - it's time to give this a good going over and just make it run like it should before any mods...I've got some NOS keys coming from Minnesota so will start on refurb of the ignition key and yokes, bars etc. Would really like to repaint the gas tank filler but the bead blaster and powder coaters are all shut because of the damn covid19 thing...

Have seen a nice set of repainted 3xW wheels (in white) with new tyres and disks - that would be a cheap enhancement over what i currently have couples with some new stainless brake lines pads...and a good bleed

Happy Easter!!

[PaulG]

Hi. I have a 92 ABS.  Pulsing is more likely warped discs.  Had the same issue and replaced them.  OEM and other aftermarket brands for ABS discs are horrendously expensive. Near double the cost of non ABS discs. At least here in Canada.  I bought some chinese ABS wave rotors several years ago at the same price as reg discs, and have never had a problem with them.

The wooden feel - are the brake lines original?  If so ditch them and get a set of steel braided lines.  You'll see an immediate improvement even with the original calipers and standard master cylinder. The blue dots will make it even better.  Many riders change the m/c as well but could be done later.

If the ABS works IMO I would leave it in. Just make sure the battery holds a charge.  If the voltage is too low the ABS kicks out and you'll get a flashing light on the dash.  Brakes will still work fine, just no ABS function.  There is a specific way to bleed the system which will be in the manuals.

Have you ever ridden a bike with ABS  before? Braking technique is a bit different than usual. Should be plenty of tips on web re this.

BTW if the ABS is working properly your brakes shouldn't lock up.  Under hard braking you may feel a rapid pulse coming through the lever. It's different than a warped disc feel. That's just the system adjusting the pressure to prevent lock up.

[red]

The wooden feel - are the brake lines original?  If so ditch them and get a set of steel braided lines.  You'll see an immediate improvement even with the original calipers and standard master cylinder. The blue dots will make it even better.

Jan,

I agree.  Braided Stainless Steel brake lines are the way to go.  Chances are, your ancient rubber brake hoses just "balloon" a bit, when you get on the brakes.  Any decent hydraulics shop can make the the new SS braided hoses  to order, by copying your old lines.  They can also add protective color sheathing over the SS braiding, for style.  Locally-made SS brake hoses may be much less expensive than the prices from the aftermarket bike parts places.

Now you can get "rotatable" banjo fittings on the brake hose ends, so there will be no twisted lines.  If you have one front brake line at the handlebar Master Cylinder, you can avoid the splitter at the forks and use a longer banjo bolt to attach two brake lines to the front master cylinder.  That brake line splitter on the forks can be a problem if you you want to add a fork brace later, and I think the double lines look better.  You then will run a separate brake line to each front caliper, without using a splitter.  You can also get banjo bolts with bleeder nipples in them (what a concept!    . )  The Bleeder-Banjo Bolts cost about US$15~$20 each, but you can pay three times that price, from the wrong seller.  That trick allows you to bleed the vertical hoses much better.  Use all new copper washers on brake line banjo bolts, every time.

Speaking of bleeding, I'd like to put in a small push for SpeedBleeders.  They make brake bleeding an easy, one-guy job.  There are machines that can do the job, but with SpeedBleeders, you can do the work anywhere that you have brake fluid and the correct spanner.  Those guys sell a "brake fluid catch bag" which also helps you very nicely.

Inside the front brake lever, there is a brass bushing that pushes the front Master Cylinder push-rod.  If this bushing is worn, you will not get enough travel at the rod to apply full front braking.  At a minimum, clean and lubricate that bushing.  You can get a new bushing from RPM; the store banner is at the top of this page.  They host this forum.

It helps when bleeding brakes if you "side-step" the brake lever after each brake application, letting the lever snap back as fast as the return spring will move it.

With SS braided hoses, new fluid, and good bleeding, expect to use real caution at first, when you jump on the brakes.
.

[FJ_Hooligan]

Take a lot of pictures of those white wheels now. 
About 5 miles down the road, they will be covered in brake dust, never to be white again. 
Oh and also, chain goo on the rear

[Millietant]

Be careful with insurers here Jan, telling them you've disconnected the ABS system will likely get you a huge increase in premium (on the basis that you are making the bike more dangerous), but if not, you might want to make sure thee aren't exclusions in any policy that severely reduce your cover/benefits.

My MOT tester knows which FJ's should have ABS (he used to race FJ's and is close to the UK FJOC) and has said he wouldn't pass a one which has had them disconnected/removed - if DVLA found out he could be in big trouble, both personally and his business, and if there was an accident involving such a bike that he'd passed, he could face a serious criminal prosecution as well.

What you're thinking of doing could open a real nest of vipers if you ever had an accident....even if that risk is extremely small, you should be aware of it. Personally, in the UK, I think the best option for you is new discs, brake lines, calipers etc and make sure you system is working as well as it can be.  

[FJ_Hooligan]

What if it has ABS but it doesn't work?  The ABS on my '93 never worked and it only had 6500 miles when I bought it.

And AFAIK, you can no longer get the ABS pump.  Does the MOT check if the ABS actually works?

[Millietant]

If it has ABS but it doesn't work, it'll fail the MOT (my old Nissan pick-up failed for a non-functional ABS system a few years ago). They test the braking by putting the wheel on driven rotors and applying the brakes until they get the maximum braking force, bringing the wheel to a halt. When they do that, if the ABS doesn't activate, then I'd guess they'd notice.

I'd also guess your Govt safety checks o vehicles aren't as strict as ours - sometimes I think ours are overly strict, but then again, when I hear of things that cars/bikes get failed for, I thus maybe its better to be safe than sorry !

[2big]

Thanks for the positive insights - very helpful
So
I checked with my insurers today here in the UK (Carole Nash) - they were fine with modifications to the bike and alterations to the braking system - to improve it or even remove the abs that was heavy and of unqualified benefit. Ok to fit current sized wheels to improve the tyre choice and handling, only that they couldn't be made of carbon or magnesium not be oversized like you see on some choppers. As for the MOT always look for the friend in the garage...I used to go to one in central Birmingham called Vale Onslow. Park up, log into MOT computer, have a cup of tea and chat about bikes - wait 10 minutes - issue certificate - get an advisory for nit doing enough miles on the bike....

Think the brake lines, discs and pads are definitely a good place to start. Also will think on the wheels & blue spot options, perhaps not in white. Saw this XJR 1300 wheel 17 x 3.5...looks like a good place to start
Might have to sleeve the spindle from 17-15mm
Have any of you had any successful experience of fitting these?
Cheers
Jan

[Millietant]

Just check that the XJR wheel will work with your speedo drive and that the discs will match up with your fork and caliper alignment/spacing before you buy a XJR wheel.

My insurers were perfectly happy with the mods to my FJ - everything has been done to "modernise" the bike so that it can use modern tyres and improve its braking and handling to make it safer  . But they specifically said that either elongating the forks or disabling OE ABS systems on any bike would not be acceptable within the parameters of my premium.

Your "friendly" MOT man might be in for a shock soon, as all test centres are going to have to have their testing equipment linked to the DVLA so that every result of each part of the test is instantly recorded on their systems (and they can monitor progress through the test process). As I understand it, it is specifically to prevent the "sit and have a cuppa while we do the paperwork" MOT's that some less than scrupulous testers offer.

My friend who does my MOT's has said he never expects to find anything wrong with our bikes (I sometimes use his garage and equipment to do my own maintenance), but he reckons he owes it to me to thoroughly check my bike.

Different strokes for different folks though and it was only through Steve telling me of some of the horror stories he'd found on "customer maintained" bikes that he'd had in for MOT tests, that I thought it best that he did proper tests on our bikes (just in case I'd missed something).

But I must admit, I'd be mortified/embarrassed if he failed one of our bikes