Two way radios

[Travis398]

i have been looking for a headset to communicate with friends while riding. i searched the forum but came up empty. i am assuming a bunch of you guys have been using them, so i thought i would ask what you guys are using, how well they work, or don't work, any suggestions, pro's and con's? 

[FJSpringy]

Autocom comms system with an ICOM 41s 5 w hand held been working for years never had a problem, but I do have a fairly large ground independent antenna that I hang off a removable bracket attached to the Givi rack.

It's the GI antenna that makes all the difference  


I have a few mates with those Bluetooth units but they just don't get the range which is a problem if you get the group spread out.

[carsick]

Travis, glad you asked, I was wondering what to get for the Northeast Summer rally to keep in contact with all of you folks. I hope this is more clear cut than a motor oil thread. I much prefer simple and proven reliable over new and feature laden.
Doug

[ren-dog]

Few months back my son needed to go into town
to complete some VET modules. He's into this whole
geekdom thing and will likely end up locked in a
dark room and the bottom of an abandoned stairwell
behind a black door with a sign that reads
"beware of the with a giant server".
But I digress ...

Bluetooth devices have numbers at the end of their specs,
e.g. 1, 1.5, 2, 6 etc. These are not bluetooth version numbers
but refer to the distance in metres the devices will transmit.
My concern with any communication device is the radiation output.
If brain cancer worries you too, then a patch cable to
a seperate transmitter stuffed in the tail section would be the go.
Otherwise use bluetooth to connect to a transmitter on your bike,
thereby minimising transmission power through your brain.
Or, to hell with it all, just stick an aerial on your helmet.   

I've always used the ever reliable iCom in my work utes,
but I don't know anything about using them whilst riding a motorbike.

[junkyardroad]

I have a Chatterbox GMRS X1. Works great.  All the wires hanging off the side of your helmet is a pain though.

[Marsh White]

i have been looking for a headset to communicate with friends while riding. i searched the forum but came up empty.

I posted the below message on the Yahoo list in Feb 2006:
--------------------------------------------------------
I believe the Starcom is (with the exception of the Baehr...but I wasn't
about to spend $1K) the best unit on the market. It blows Autocom out of
the water. I think I spent something like $340.00 for my setup that
included 2 headsets, cell phone cable, motorola cable, push to talk, XM Sat
radio cable. At the time http://www.casporttouring.com/ was the only US
importer, but I just got http://www.bikeeffects.com to start stocking
them as well for a tad cheaper. To my knowledge they are the only 2 US
importers. http://www.bikeeffects.com/products.asp?cat=8545

I've said it before, but the unit works easily above 100mph with earplugs.
I have had conversations with my passenger at 120mph (though above 105mph
you do have to start yelling a bit). Autovolume, 2 channel amps, VOX that
actually works (though I use the push to talk button anyway), stereo sound,
kick ass hands free intercom, etc. I've been on business phone calls at 75
mph and the guy on the other end didn't know I was on a motorcycle.

And I don't even have the "Advance" unit....I have the less expensive one.
The "Advance" wasn't out yet last summer when I bought my unit...

It's been a long time since I mentioned this so FWIW, I also setup this
group to get 10% off any http://www.bikeeffects.com purchase above
$50.00. Just enter FJ1200 in the coupon field on the checkout page. If
someone was interested in a Starcom unit, that adds up...

Note: In case anyone was suspicious, I get no money or anything from
this...I just did the guy's website so I have a little pull that is all.

-----------------------------------------------------

They now also sell a Bluetooth interface module (which I have) for the Starcom which I love so I don't have to plug in my cellphone everytime like I used to.  It works flawlessly!

Something else I was just made aware of: about 2 months or so ago Autocom went out of business.  Tecstar, the parent company of Starcom bought the rights to the name Autocom (nothing else – just the name).  Back in the day Autocom had the big name distribution and dealers and was pretty good as far as quality – though not as good as Starcom and also a little bit more expensive.  My point being – future Autocom units will be better!  The new Autocom units are NOT being manufactured now – anything Autocom being sold currently is left over stock from before the company went bankrupt.

[FJSpringy]

after much stuffing around trying to get rid of wires I have come to the conclusion that wires maybe ulgy but they are a good thing when it comes to quality of sound and reliability etc.

I run my moblie phone/MP3/GPS/2way though my autocom, all are very clear, the wife can listen and speak over both the moblie and the 2way, we both have similar taste in music so all good there and we can hold a conversation and listen to music at speeds up to 160 KPH with no sound distortion.

I always ride with the MP3 or radio blasting away, the only down side is my riding mates always say we better get moving soon because it takes Dave ages to put his entertainment system on  

Some of my mates have starcom but always find them a bugga to set up initally but if you do mange to get them working are very good, the big plus for them is you can get a remote handle bar sound control, which you cannot get for autocom.

The bluetooth system for the older autocoms like mine is quite ordinary as it is not stero capable and sounds very so so (read crap), I use the 4 pin wire and the sound is brilliant, the bluetooth dongle is IMHO way over priced at $190.00 AUD.

Also if I charge my phone through the 12v socket and have it connected to the autocom via the 4 pin plug I also get a ground loop which can be a bit annoying, so I only charge it when it really needs it   autocoms response was we know about that tough luck  

I am good mates with the autocom disty in Oz and he reckons its business as usual for him, but he would say that  

I guess you always love what you got and what your used to 

tired of re-editing this post to add this and that so I am   my keyboard.

[Navymech]

That's funny, I was just talking about this last night with my girlfriend, saying it would be good for the Northeast Rally.  The Autocom and Starcom look like a pain to set up yourself, but I could just be getting intimidated by the wires and such.   

Being that everything on my bike is stock (other than the suspicious wire under the seat that looks like should be a ground to something) would it be better to just have a shop install it?

[Dan Filetti]

This too from 2006: 

All-

As promised, I figured I'd pass along my impressions of the IMC
MIT-100 motorcycle communication/ audio hub. If you're at all
interested read on.

THE STORY

Ordered it From sierra Electronics http://www.sierra-mc.com/ on the
12th and I it arrived promptly Jan 16th ostensibly for my birthday on
the 24th. I indicated to the sales guy that I had the Kenwood
FreeTalk FRS radio, with the dual pin and he said 'that's what it
comes with'.

It arrived to my home via UPS during the day while I was at work, and
by the time I got home my wife had wrapped in birthday wrapping paper
-with a bow and everything. So now I had to wait for the 24th...
Opened it last Tuesday night, un-packed it, figured it out, and stole
away to the basement to hook it all up and test it. MP3 sounded good
-stereo sound does make it worth the extra $50 over the Motocomm IMO.
However, I could not make my Nady MRC-11 or my Kenwood Free-Talk work
with it. I even had a friend look it over with me and he agreed it
should work as configured. Called Sierra on Wednesday and they
immediately shipped me out a new one thinking there was a problem,
which they said was not at all common.

Got the new one on Friday and it did the same thing! I was pissed and
had already figured out where I was going to be buying my new Autocom
Active 7-Smart [all 2005 7 series units are 50% off anywhere they're
sold if you can find 'em] out of pocket it would have been 240.00
with shipping and the required cables (that's where they make their $$
by the way, on the cables). So in any case, I called Sierra yesterday
and they put me in touch with their tech guru who immediately
pin-pointed the issue, the two pinned adapter looks like it will work
with Kenwood, it fits and everything, but it does not actually work
-it's wired wrong. IMC apparently does not make a Kenwood adapter
either. I wish the sales guy had pointed that out when I told him I
had a Kenwood originally... Still skeptical, on the way home from
work last night I picked up a pair of Midland radios, $38.00 on
clearance at Bestbuy which he said would work. They did. I was relieved.

THE REVIEW

Sierra, and the IMC distributor in Canada are the only two places I
found who sell it. Both had it for $199.00. Sierra did a pretty good
job all in all, except for not catching the Kenwood incompatibility
issue. But their customer service was basically good, engaged and prompt.

The unit was reasonably well packed, everything in little bags etc.
The first thing you notice is that they give you too much stuff. It
comes with 4 head sets, two open face and two full face head sets. The
main unit, two coiled headset extension wires, an MP3 extension wire,
a cell phone (2.5MM) short Adapter, the infamous two pronged (non
Kenwood) FRS adapter, a power plug, and a PTT switch. It has a BMW
style Power adapter (Which I happen to have -which is good). FWIW, IMC
is German company, but the unit is manufactured in Korea apparently.

There is no option to run the unit on batteries and all of the wires
are well... hard wired to the unit. To me it would be nice to be able
to unplug (and cap) components that are not in use -AKA the passenger
headset) as well as throw in some AA batteries, but that would make
the unit bigger I guess. The main unit has 6 wires in total coming
from the small (about the size of a pack of Camel unfiltereds) black
box; 2 power, (pos and neg), an Audio wire (3.5MM standard MP3 jack),
two head sets shunts (driver and passenger) and a line out that
handles both the FRS and the telephone.

The unit will travel in my tank bag so the wire lengths are a bit too
long, and in fact, they would almost certainly be too short if I
decided to mount the unit inside the rear cowling. They's probably be
just about right for those of you that have removed the air box and
are looking for something to do with all that extra void...

In my garage without the bike running, it sounded good, but a bit too
loud, (the black box does do fixed amplification), and a bit too soft
under hard acceleration during my little test jaunt last night.
Probably about right at 60 mph on the highway, and too soft at 90, but
that just goes to show you what kind of noise biking crams into your
ears. Plus, the somewhat lower screen, coupled with the Two Brothers
exhaust on the Hurricane do not help this at all. Still there is no
volume adjustment, the unit relies on the device supplying the signal,
MP3, FRS, phone etc to control the volume. I think I would add a
volume adjuster (like on the Autocom Pro7) if I were building this.

The music is lowered by 50% when an FRS is used or during a cell
conversation. It comes back up after 15 seconds of non FRS or Cell
signal. FRS and Cell are clear and strong and the music is clear and
the Hi Fi stereo speakers do sound good in all three cases, but the 2
second transition back to 100% is slightly distorted -not sure why
that is. The speakers are sufficiently thin to mount in my helmet and
be comfortable. and mounting was pretty easy, although my Icon liner
does not come out so I wound up stuffing wires into crevices and using
the supplied Velcro to attach the speakers, and mic directly to the
liner. The whole process took maybe 20 minutes, and was not
challenging.

The on line literature, as well as the instructions that come with it
are seriously lacking. The written material is translated poorly into
English and is about three pages of 8.5 X 11 paper stapled together.
There is even less information about it on line. Little doubt, what I
have written here represents more information then they provide.

Overall, it's seems pretty good. I'm going to keep it and not get the
Autocom. [Although I talked to Autocom and they swear that their key
differentiation from their competitors is that their VOX/ noise
cancellation works and is apparently guaranteed to work "at any
speed". I'd like to test that claim b/c it's completely contrary to
all of my VOX experiences...] Obviously I have not taken the MIT on
any long rides yet, but it seems like it will do well.

I looked pretty closely at about 9 companies that make these things
and ruled out; Beahr, Starcom and Autocom for cost; Motcomm mostly b/c of the
mono; Chatterbox, and Collett b/c they mount outside of the helmet;
J&P, Nady and J&M b/c they were mono, and not functionally rich
enough. To me, seems like the IMC is a decent balance between cost
and functionality.

Hope that all helps...

Dan

[Travis398]

wow a lot of great stuff so far, thanks guys. i guess this is a tad more complicated than i was thinking. it doesn't help when i am the type of person that has to

research every spec from every model and compare them until they are obsolete. (like the new TV i have been researching for the past 2 years, my wife was going

so crazy from this she told me she don't care how BIG or how MUCH  

"JUST BUY THE DAMN THING SO I CAN STOP HEARING YOU TALK ABOUT IT"

i suppose it is meaningless to her, but very important none the less, anyways the search goes on)  

back on topic,    i was wondering how comfortable the stuff is crammed in the helmet, earplugs seem like a good way to go, i really don't know if i like the idea

of not being able to adjusting the volume. and i never thought of the MP3 thing but that would be so cool rocking out to tunes while riding.      

where does all this stuff go? radios, splitter boxes, MP3, cell phone, chargers.........etc.)  

a tank bag? holy shit do i have to rewire the bike and mount a satellite dish on the back?    

[Travis398]

i forgot to ask how far apart the bikes can be before you start loosing someone? a mile 2, more?

[Dan Filetti]

Radios:  The effective communication distance between riders depends a lot on your radio type and the terrain.  GMRS vs. FRS are the two basic types.  Google it for more information -there's lots...  But basically, GMRS is stronger and in entry level trim (+/- 3-5 watts) it's good for as much as 5 miles (on the salt flats) and depending on the terrain, maybe 2-3 miles in average obstructed riding conditions.  I have seen less than a mile in the twisty mountains.  From what I'm to understand, GMRS radios can go up to 50 watts, but these are not common at the consumer level.

The down-side of the GMRS, is that you need to apply for an FCC license to be 100% legal, although many folks ignore this...  In my case it was a form I had to fill out and send in with a few bucks, not terrible.

An FRS radio, in my experience is good for maybe a mile at best but there's no FCC license requirement. 

None of these bike units come with a built in radio, you'll need to buy one and that leads you to the above decision.  Do make SURE you buy one with the right connection for your unit, they differ, and some bike units do not sell/ provide connections for all radios.  Kenwood for instants has a +/- proprietary connection, but some folks have a Kenwood connection and others do not...  Also, some offer PTT (Push To Talk) as part of their wiring...  I would decide on your bike unit before you buy your radio.

Hope that helps.

Dan   

[andyb]

so crazy from this she told me she don't care how BIG or how MUCH  

"JUST BUY THE DAMN THING SO I CAN STOP HEARING YOU TALK ABOUT IT"

Meaning you can not buy one at all.  Then she doesn't have to hear you talk about it, and you can't hear her when you're riding.  Best of both worlds!

[Tuxracer]

Dan, thanks for the info, you just answered all my questions. My wife & I are looking to get an intercom so we are able to talk while riding. The music/phone functionality is a bonus and is only $150 for the IMC.

[racerrad8]

Marsh, Dan or anyone else for that matter,
        I have been looking at both products recommended by you guys and I have one question that I think I know the answer,  but I need to confirm.

I am looking at these two way systems for bike to bike communications. Does that mean I need to purchase two "kits". I do not see how the second rider can communicate from the separate bike as I do not see any PTT switch.

I am familiar with the radios we use in our race cars which require two radios, an adapter kit to convert the radio to helmet & PTT and the crew headset/mic combo to communicate from car to pit or car to car. This looks to very familiar to what I currently use; http://www.intaride.com/bike-to-bike-radio.html

I plan on doing more research but this question effects my decision more than any. I have several FRS radios, unsure of the brand, that we use at the race track during event to keep in contact since cell service doesn't work half of the time. I was hoping to use these radios on our two bike with a system and not have to purchase new ones.

This is going to be our Christmas present in anticipation for the 2011 WCR and first rally we will be attending.

Randy - RPM