Remember the Kawasaki Z1? 46 years later now Z900RS

[bigbore2]

Had a 76 KZ900.  Put 95,000 mi on that bike.  I then sold it to a guy who buys the old kawi bikes and ships them back to Japan for the locals who find them popular there.
The 76 was 81 hp, the 73-75 were just a little more , like 84. It was fast for its day, but the FJ walks all over it, at 125 hp.

The engine was popular at the strip as you could build it up quite a bit, at least 1300cc.
My chassis was good up to 100-110 mph, above that the front would get light feeling.

[Pat Conlon]

The 76 was 81 hp, the 73-75 were just a little more , like 84. It was fast for its day, but the FJ walks all over it, at 125 hp.

Yep, our FJ's will pull the wings off the early Z1's, as they should,  and I suspect even the new Z900RS. The power numbers are not compelling:

Quote from Spiros Tsantilas 10/26/17 article: "...... focus turned to the 948 cc in-line four-cylinder engine that's been retuned for more low and mid-level power and torque. In peak values it makes 111 hp (83 kW), which is quite a bit less that the 125 hp (93 kW) of the Z900, but it maxes out 1,000 rpm earlier at 8,500, and Kawasaki suggests that up until 7,000 the RS is actually stronger than the standard Z900.

Torque figures are identical in the two engine versions as far as maximum values are concerned, but once again the Z900RS reaches the 98.5 Nm (72.6 lb-ft) peak at 6,500 rpm, sooner than the 7,700 of the Z900...."

It's unclear if the author is referring to crankshaft numbers or rear wheel numbers...
Regardless, a well tuned FJ with it's displacement advantage should have no problem.

Pat

[FJ1100mjk]

Yep, our FJ's will pull the wings off the early Z1's, as they should,  and I suspect even the new Z900RS.

Regardless, a well tuned FJ with it's displacement advantage should have no problem.

Pat

Your opinion, but ...Uh, really?

My opinion too, but...

I think that with riders of equal talent and body on each bike ("well tuned" and bone stock), and if they competed against one another on a track of sufficient technical difficulty (not a simple oval), that you may find yourself a little disappointed.

[Pat Conlon]

On a short track maybe....just maybe.

Ever ridden a naked bike over 120 mph? Fun huh. The Z900RS has the aerodynamic's of a barn door.
Other than a slight 30lb weight advantage and traction control/ABS, I can't see one advantage the Z900 has over a well tuned FJ (with modern 17" tires, suspension, brakes, and I/E mods)

It wouldn't suprise me if the Z900RS was speed limited.

[FJ_Hooligan]

While I think it's a cool looking retro bike, I wouldn't be interested in owning one.

Back in the day, there was not much to choose from and HP was king.  It was an awesome bike considering its peers.  

But there's no wind protection at all.  That would get tiring quickly.

I see it selling as badly as the Honda CB1000 retro bike.  My local Honda dealer can't give that bike away.

As much as I like the look of the Yamaha XJR, it kind of falls into that same naked retro class.  

I want a little fairing and a windscreen to keep from getting blown off the seat.

Speaking of speed limiting, I thought I read somewhere (not on the internet) that the new FZs and FJ are limited to 117 MPH? (edit: Googled it = 132MPH)

[FJ1100mjk]

Ever ridden a naked bike over 120 mph?

No, why would I anyways? They are not made for that, they are for the most part, to be used in an urban environment.

Other than a slight 30lb weight advantage and traction control/ABS, I can't see one advantage the Z900 has over a well tuned FJ

30 pounds, slight? 

[ribbert]

Back in the day, there was not much to choose from and HP was king.  It was an awesome bike considering its peers.  

They certainly were....



....but no one has mentioned the extremely nasty trait they had of throwing riders off at high speed, on smooth road, in a straight line. Even with a steering damper you could feel them trying.

I'm sure there are still a few blokes around that could tell you what it feels like to get chucked over the handle bars at 120mph. At least the H2's terrible handling was predictable, these things would just spit you off without warning.

And yes, even as a fit young bloke, riding at highway speeds or faster on a naked bike sucked. FJ's with the non US screens are excellent.

Sitting on 100mph with your arms loose and hands lightly gripping the bars and head not being tossed around is the way to go, not hanging on for dear life against the wind.

XJR's have probably been the most successful retro bikes but still never sold in big numbers.

Noel

[PaulG]

Ever ridden a naked bike over 120 mph?

No, why would I anyways? They are not made for that, they are for the most part, to be used in an urban environment.

I dunno but these guys seemed to go pretty fast on them back in the day.... 

[Mike Ramos]

Memories down motorcycling's "Old School Lane"...

If only one could convey the potential risks, the absolute pleasure & satisfaction of the very adventure itself; the excitement and personal vulnerability of not just each and every ride but of the entire motorcycling world of that era...!

Not a lot [of motorcycles] to choose from...?!  Not hardly...!  Surely you must be kidding...?!

A 305 Honda... of course the Scrambler model as the Dream had the low pipes and ground clearance problems...

Yet before we move on to some serious contemporary competition I must acknowledge...

During those early years I rode many a mile on a 750 Honda with the beautiful sound of the best sounding four cylinder exhaust ever (stock or otherwise) – the wonderful four-into-four HM-300.  With a 16" rear rim laced on for a wider tire and better choice of tire along with longer rear shocks for increased ground clearance, and with the center stand removed it was very competitive.  At overhaul time an official Japanese manufactured "big bore" 840 cc kit was installed and it really made a nice improvement in performance without sacrificing reliability.  Hmm, the same kit still remains & the engine still runs strong, if only locally...!
 
Also was the proud owner for many thousands of miles of a Norton 850; considering the rapidly advancing technology of the Japanese iterations, perhaps one of the most underrated motorcycles of the day.
 
Uh oh, it may be blasphemy: must confess - spent many hours on a Harley Davidson Sportster – the old 900 that still had the DRUM front brake...  Had a lot of enjoyment throughout the Santa Cruz Mountains or motoring up Hwy. 1 north of San Francisco competing with a variety of motorcycles trying their best...!

Let's see: there was the right hand shift up for first – right hand shift down for first – and the left hand shift down for first... careful now (!) do NOT confuse the shift patterns as it may lead to undesired and unwanted problems...!  Not to mention, what side is the brake on...?

Not a lot [of motorcycles] to choose from...?!

Competition was the aforementioned Kawasaki 900's for sure but do not forget the sweet smelling & stinking 500's & 750's added to the mix!

The fading but well handling Triumph 650's, both the single carb Trophy models and the dual carbureted Bonneville with its promise of increased performance.

Also of note were the various hot rodded Sportsters whose owners believed they were reincarnations of the all-conquering motorcycles of the flat track ovals but with tires appropriate for the street.

And there were fabled Ducati's of many variations; almost all dedicated to the "Café Racing" genre.

Quite a few sported up BMW's - some with ground off cylinder heads although the engines were raised within the frames for extra ground clearance!

The many & perhaps favorites of the day: assorted unidentified machines, almost all of Japanese origin & a variety of displacements; some highly modified and all dressed up as "Café Racers".

There was even the occasional "fabled" Laverda Triple with handling on par with the best and considered by some as the motorcycle Ferrari of its day.

When the first the Kawasaki 900 was introduced – yes, horsepower was king but only to a certain extent – for if H.P. was to reign unchallenged, it was as a boulevard champion.  With inherent mechanical strength by nature of its design, it was well suited to increased performance demands in regards to engine performance.  However, handling could not be tuned as well as other individual motorcycles and on winding and back country road it did not prevail.  High speed excursions were often exacerbated by the increase in horsepower output in a most challenging and often detrimental way.

No apologies: the best all-around performer of that Early Era was the Honda 750.


Developments continued and slowly but surely the Early Era was ending.  This was when when motorcyclist were having the rims widened to accept the newly introduced larger dimensioned tires with improved rubber compounds.  Engine performance was to the point where 750's were easily outperforming the 1100's from just a few years prior.  It was still an exciting time with many innovations and new motorcycles were being introduced yet time continued into a new era, people and attitudes.

Spoked wheels were giving way to cast wheels – when a Yamaha XS-11 was purchased it was with tubeless tires – quite an improvement although common today.

Running an Avon on the rear with a K181 (successor to the K-81) on the front it was quite a motorcycle.  Suspension was improved with heavy duty fork springs, a fork brace and Koni rear shocks with adjustable damping.  A "Superbike" handle bar was installed which gave a riding position similar to the FJ.

Many complained of the wobble while cornering – true but the solution was to stay out of the lean angle where the wobble was encountered – lean less or quickly transition to an increased lean angle beyond where the wobble was encountered.  Complaints about high speed wobble were valid, but inconsequential when approached with caution.

Ground clearance was very good and the center stand was removed for increased ground clearance, as a testament to its more than adequate handling characteristics, eventually the right side engine case was ground through.

It would cruise all day long at 6,100 rpm for an indicated speed of 95 mph.

It would regularly red line at 135 mph, although if conditions were too windy, high 120's were all that could be attained.

Concerning wind protection: wasn't bothered much at all on this or any motorcycle. 

A "Rabbid Transit" fairing (by Don Vesco) was installed on the XS-11 which was of very good quality and was, protection wise, similar to the FJ.  It was installed in attempt to establish better high speed performance and to remain competitive with other large bore motorcycles that were proliferating (ah yes – even more motorcycles to choose from).  However, at high speeds engine overheating was a problem especially with the lowers so the fairing was not used for any length of time.

So the chapter closed yet the difficulty to explain those early times still remains... Without doubt others have their favorite road.  Yet part of the mystique of those years were the many seemingly endless roads of far Northern California, the Western States and South western Canada. Without the incessant traffic of today and the vast openness as compared to what is experienced now.

Hmm, so was it all those years ago I raced a hopped up Kawasaki 1000 throughout the afternoon and he and I rolled in to Calgary in the late night hours... or was it of a more contemporary time... I still see him smiling with his open face helmet and giving a thumbs up... wind didn't seem to bother him at all...!

Ride safe.

[ribbert]

Ever ridden a naked bike over 120 mph?

No, why would I anyways? They are not made for that, they are for the most part, to be used in an urban environment.

I dunno but these guys seemed to go pretty fast on them back in the day.... 

We certainly did, but try and tell a young fella about it today and you can see their eyes glaze over with that "yeah... sure you did" look.

As Mike, myself, many of my friends, most riders of big bikes at the time and many here on the forum can attest to, we rode the wheels off those early rockets for the reasons below.

Because we could
We were young, stupid and oblivious to the risks
The bikes would go that fast
Bikes didn't come with fairings and there were very few aftermarket units available. Some of which made them scarily unstable at speed but looked cool.
The cops had next to useless speed detection equipment, even more useless pursuit vehicles but mostly didn't care. The general attitude being we were only going to kill ourselves, not someone else. No loss there!

So that's what we did, rode them pinned everywhere, often for entire trips, not just a squirt here and there. Harley riders wouldn't understand

As Mike's favourite all rounder of the era was his 750/4, mine was the GSX 1100

You "have to have been there" to fully appreciate the impact the Honda 750/4 had on the motorcycling world. This was not an evolution of anything that had existed before it, it was a quantum leap. In-line 4, four carbies, four exhausts, hydraulic disc brake, electric start, reliable, went like the clappers and didn't even leak oil, they were perfect.

I can still remember seeing my first one outside the bookshop in my hometown, an old timer who was a common site around town on his BSA 500 bought the first one, in aqua. While he had moved into the future with his new bike he amusingly continued to use his oil skin lap rug, a common form of weather protection for riders dating back many decades earlier. They were cut for purpose and not even attached. It looked strange seeing this tatty, frayed, heavily worn oil skin draped over his shiny new Honda when parked.

I started my apprenticeship at a Honda dealership the year following their release. Working on them but not owning one was killing me. I was riding a 1956 BSA Golden Flash 650 twin. To think these bikes were only 12 years apart was beyond comprehension.
By the time I could afford one, which was a long time on apprentice pay, and after a new Suzuki T500, I opted for the first twin disc GT750. I was still working for Honda and it was not a very popular move. Of the 30 odd bikes I've owned, the GT750 was kept the longest until the FJ many decades later and I will never part with that, it will outlive me, literally. Informing my wife she would likely inherit it one day was met with "don't forget it's garbage night, put the bins out before you come to bed" I guess not everyone shares our passion.

Mike, thanks for the trip down memory lane, your recollections of that time are excellent and brought back a flood of memories of great times, great bikes and great trips.

Noel

[Pat Conlon]

Thanks Mike, thanks Noel, good stuff!  

Speaking of Honda's ...looks like they (replacing the CB1000R) will have a new offering later this month:

[1tinindian]

Thanks Mike, thanks Noel, good stuff! 

Speaking of Honda's ...looks like they (replacing the CB1000R) will have a new offering later this month:

Reminds me of my sons 919.