RPM oil cooler & riding temperature

[Alf]

I've fitted a secondhand bought RPM oil cooler to my 1TX. (I promise, Randy, that I thought buy a new one, but I get a good offer from a forum member)

With just only one week fresh out from a big refurbished, at everyday transport duty I noticed that the bike temperature is similar that those registered in my 3CV equipped with a 10 row cooler. The built-in thermostat in the RPM cooler do its job keeping the temperature above 90ºC (194 F), I imagine, because the air temperature here is always around 20-30ºC (70-90 F), so in not too much occasions you read less than 90ºC at the oil temperature gauge

The problem has emerged today, first time of hard riding on my 1TX. The gauge has shown between 115-118ºC (240-245 F) all the time while when riding similar on my 3CV and even with a hotter day, the temperature never go up 110ºC (230F)

Must I be worried?

Could it be a problem with the built thermostat?

Both bikes have exactly the same gauge and sensor fitted

Thanks, guys

[Alf]

I missed

1TX: KN air filter in STD airbox, OE carb settings, 5º ignition advancer, XJR cans completely open, NGK DPR 8 EA 9 plugs
3CV: KN air filter in open airbox, Dynojet kit, 4º ignition advancer, free flowing exhaust pan, XJR cans 42 mm. open, NGK DPR 9 EA 9 plugs

And the oil light flashes a lot of times with the RPM cooler installed, even althought the level is correct. Must I add more oil because the bigger capacity rad?

Thanks

[Bezmozek]

..., because the air temperature here is always around 20-30ºC (70-90 F),...

Easiest and cheapest way IMHO is to lower air temperature coming to cooling fins.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Exhaust-Manifolds-Fiberglass-Heat-Wrap-Tape-Thermal-Wrap-Black-1-5-X-5M-Ties-/152623297514?hash=item23890eb3ea:g:f24AAOSwARZXmGiN&vxp=mtr
As I plan to cower my engine into full fairing, already have this on my to do list 

[Pat Conlon]

The problem has emerged today, first time of hard riding on my 1TX. The gauge has shown between 115-118ºC (240-245 F) all the time while when riding similar on my 3CV and even with a hotter day, the temperature never go up 110ºC (230F)

1TX: KN air filter in STD airbox, OE carb settings, 5º ignition advancer, XJR cans completely open, NGK DPR 8 EA 9 plugs
3CV: KN air filter in open airbox, Dynojet kit, 4º ignition advancer, free flowing exhaust pan, XJR cans 42 mm. open, NGK DPR 9 EA 9 plugs

Hola amigo! One word: Jetting.

The issue is not with the RPM oil cooler, the issue is your jetting.....jetting, jetting, jetting....Want a cooler running bike? Change your jetting.

[Alf]

Good idea, Pat

I´ll try a shim under the needles

Anyway, today I´ve been riding side to side with my friend Mingo inmaculate 1TX. KN, NGK 8 plugs, Dynojet needles, STD mains and Neta cans. Not too different. And all the time there were around 15 ºC difference between them. Too much

Std cooler too

[Pat Conlon]

Anyway, today I´ve been riding side to side with my friend Mingo inmaculate 1TX. KN, NGK 8 plugs, Dynojet needles, STD mains and Neta cans.  

Interesting Alf, so Mingo's running the skinny DynoJet needles with STD (standard?) main jets? That is significantly different than your stock jetting.

I have found that the skinny DynoJet needles do not play well with the standard Mikuni main jets (too rich)
The DynoJet needles are designed for proper flow when used with the DynoJet main jets.

Re: Oil temps: Even though it may be warmer than you're used to, you are still fine @ 240-245*F
That's what I run here in the desert during the hot summer months.
(1380cc #42 pilots, Mikuni needles fully raised (lowest notch) 130 mains, 160 air bleeds 5* advance Redline ester based synthetic 20w-50)
Remember the oil cooler works only with air flow. It's the stop and go driving that's a bitch. I have found that the RPM oil cooler shaved at least 10*F (more like 15*) off the oil temp vs. using the oem FJ oil cooler. IOW the RPM cooler helps, and never hurts.

Cheers  Pat

[Alf]

Anyway, today I've been riding side to side with my friend Mingo inmaculate 1TX. KN, NGK 8 plugs, Dynojet needles, STD mains and Neta cans.  

Interesting Alf, so Mingo's running the skinny DynoJet needles with STD (standard?) main jets?

I have found that the skinny DynoJet needles do not play well with the standard Mikuni main jets (too rich)
The DynoJet needles are designed for proper flow when used with the DynoJet main jets.

Yes, that is. And the bike run from 0 to the redline in any gear without hesitation. In fact, tested today, it have better low down between 3.000-6.000 rpm that my 1TX

Remember the oil cooler works only with air flow. It's the stop and go driving that's a bitch. I have found that the RPM oil cooler shaved at least 10*F (more like 15*) off the oil temp vs. using the oem FJ oil cooler. IOW the RPM cooler helps, and never hurts.

Cheers  Pat

For that I'm asking why with a 10 row cooler in the same road, tight & slow, at the same sport riding style, my 3CV run cooler that my 1TX with 12 rows. And my friend Mingo´s 1TX run cooler too with an STD cooler

Maybe the thermostat could be wrong?

Many thanks, Pat

[Pat Conlon]

Sorry Alf, I was editing when you responded.
Mingo's jetting using the DynoJet needles and STD mains is significantly different than your STD jetting.

[Old Rider]

Have you tryed running the 1TX with dpr-9 plugs?  it should be running cooler .

[Alf]

Have you tryed running the 1TX with dpr-9 plugs?  it should be running cooler .

Yes, of course I will do. But I wanted to know if there is any report about problems with the cooler

[Alf]

I've got a laser heat gun to check temps and accuracy of both oil thermometers, the digital one taking temps at the sump and the oil fill crankcase

But... where would I get temps?. If I get at the sump, the heat gun will give me the temp at the crankcase, i.e.

I've been thinking about and I believe that the best place is the oil filter with the engine running

What do you think?

[ribbert]

I've got a laser heat gun to check temps and accuracy of both oil thermometers, the digital one taking temps at the sump and the oil fill crankcase

But... where would I get temps?. If I get at the sump, the heat gun will give me the temp at the crankcase, i.e.

I've been thinking about and I believe that the best place is the oil filter with the engine running

What do you think?

Alf, why do you not trust the two existing temp gauges and why do you think the third will be any more accurate, and if they differ, which one is wrong?

The easiest way to check the gauges against each other is to remove the sender units and put them in a container of hot water and then read that with the gun, all three in the same temp water at the same time. No need to remove it from the bike, just unscrew it and place it in the container while it is still connected.

Cars and aircraft that have oil temp gauges rarely have numbers anyway, just red and green arcs showing relative, not actual, temps. Why the need for such accuracy?

Noel

[Alf]

Like I explained before my 2 oil thermometers take oil temp from different places: one at the oil fill crankcase and the other with the sender inside a RPM pan plug o´ring

I've already checked temps from both in different environments and only the same temp is shown in concrete situations, mainly on fast open roads and after at least half and hour riding in those roads (not in tight ones, i.e.). So I wanted to know which one shows the correct running temperature in order to recommend one of them.

The question is not which one is correct, that both I imagine are right, but which one is more orientative about the real running temp (In fact I have fitted 4 oil temps, 2 in each bike, to compare between different carb settings and oil coolers.)

I don't need such accuracy, you're right. But it is an info that I want to obtain in order to recommend one temp or another and different aftermarket coolers. And it must be an objective analysis, with the most objective figures that I could get.

People read my website, where all the info that I write has been checked & tested by myself (when not for myself, in rare occasions, It is said), so I pretend to obtain the best test. I think nobody have done it until today, and people have bought different temp gauges and cooler not knowing in fact which is better

And it is fun performing it  

And it is good to know that my bikes don't overheat too, important where I live

Thanks, Noel  

[racerrad8]

Alf,

I use the spin on oil filter or the output oil cooler line to read the temps of the oil collected by the oil pump for distribution for the engine.

Using the pan, clutch cover or stock oil filter housing can give some erroneous readings due to heat saturation in the the aluminum.

It has been discussed several time about the temp sender needing to protrude into the oil flow. if the temp sender is shrouded by the galley adapter that offer erroneous reading from heat saturation in the case/adapter.

The cooler line just before the oil cooler and the spin on oil filter offer the best point of reading the oil temp leaving the engine prior to doing its work and being heated.

Randy - RPM

[Alf]

Thanks Randy

When I asked about to collect the oil temp and speak about to obtain it of the oil filter, I missed to mention that both bikes are fitted with spin-ons, so I will get the dates from these

I know the discussion about the temp sender. But like the screw where is embedded the sender is not heat insulated from the crankcase, it is logical the supposition that the crank heat go through the sender anyway

Full report is on the way