Anti-Seize. Is it supposed to dry out? Or does it always remain slippery?

[FJ_Hooligan]

Back in my days of working on Sprint Cars, we used a/s on everything.  I specifically remember using it on the large rear wheel nuts.  But I also remember having to spray the threads with WD-40 because the a/s dried out and I could barely turn the nut by hand.

As anyone who has ever used it can attest, it only takes a small amount and the typical container of the stuff can last 100 years or more.  It also gets everywhere and spreads itself like a virus!  Days later, I'd scrub traces of it off of the back of my hand, or elbow, or other location that it migrated to.  I swear that the stuff would leap off of the car when you walked by.

Has anyone else had a problem with the a/s drying up on them?  The a/s that I used on my spark plugs had definitely dried up.  I have used it on the caliper mounting bolts and also observed that it dries out in that application over time.  Becoming a gooey substance that makes the bolts difficult to turn. 

Do I need to throw my batch away and get a new 100 year jar of it?  Maybe I can hand it down to my son.  :-)

[FJmonkey]

I don't have an answer to your question as I rarely use a/s. But I am confident that a/s comes in different qualities from top notch stuff to boogers in a jar. And can also attest that the copper stuff used where I used to work got everywhere. It never washes out, stains the skin, and will likely still be trace elements found years later during my autopsy.

[Country Joe]

Hooligan,
I had a can of anti seize that dried out some. I mixed in a few ounces of Marvel Mystery Oil and added the oil in until I got the consistency that I was looking for. It is once again ready to "mysteriously" find its way to unexpected spots in my world.

[aviationfred]

Not all anti-seize are the same. I have three types of non copper anti-seize in my tool box. Each one has a different consistency. The Loctite stick is the driest and the Misty is the wettest. The Permatex and the Misty both state they work up to 2000+F degrees. The Misty is interesting as it is in an aerosol can and uses a foam pressure applicator similar to a liquid shoe shine bottle. I have never used any on my spark plugs.

The photo shows the consistency difference.

Fred

[Charlie-brm]

I use a crayon stick version that I've had beyond memory. There is enough of the wrapper left that I could make out the product name Thread Magic and I'm pleased to find they are still in business because I don't see it in my local stores. Just one or two light drags at right angles to the threads of my spark plugs in cars, vans and motorcycles, never more. Not much else I use if for.

http://agscompany.com/product/thread-magic-anti-seize-wax-stick-43-oz-card/

[CutterBill]

The only anti-seize that I have ever used is the Permatex High-Temp stuff, and I've never had it dry out on me.
Bill

[rlucas]

...boogers in a jar.

https://www.google.com/search?q=boogers+in+a+jar&rlz=1C1CHBD_enUS706US706&oq=boogers+in+a+jar&aqs=chrome..69i57.5783j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

[ribbert]

A budding career as a mechanic in ruins after this young lad fell into the grip of Anti Seize at a young age.

Noel

[Dads_FJ]

Back in my days of working on Sprint Cars, we used a/s on everything.  I specifically remember using it on the large rear wheel nuts.  But I also remember having to spray the threads with WD-40 because the a/s dried out and I could barely turn the nut by hand.

As anyone who has ever used it can attest, it only takes a small amount and the typical container of the stuff can last 100 years or more.  It also gets everywhere and spreads itself like a virus!  Days later, I'd scrub traces of it off of the back of my hand, or elbow, or other location that it migrated to.  I swear that the stuff would leap off of the car when you walked by.

Has anyone else had a problem with the a/s drying up on them?  The a/s that I used on my spark plugs had definitely dried up.  I have used it on the caliper mounting bolts and also observed that it dries out in that application over time.  Becoming a gooey substance that makes the bolts difficult to turn. 

Do I need to throw my batch away and get a new 100 year jar of it?  Maybe I can hand it down to my son.  :-)

Yup

[TexasDave]

Anti seize does have good applications just not in high temp environments. I used copper based anti seize on stone working machines with great success. These machines were exposed to direct water stream for cooling and dust removal but no high temps. On the other hand EVERY time I purchase spark plugs at any auto parts store the kid behind the counter informs me I also need the small package of anti seize for a buck or two more. Most of these kids don't know anything about cars, trucks or bikes.

Dave

[racerrad8]

David,

It is funny this topic should come up now. Just this past week I weighed in on the use of anti-seize on spark plugs and how I do not recommend it: http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=16749.msg169510#msg169510

I think you might have seen that post too. In that post is has been said the anti-seize does not separate or break down in high temperature applications such as spark plugs or exhaust systems.

In fact I had a race car customer at the shop on last Friday for a valve adjustment. This guy is some "rocket scientist/quantum engineer" working at the Lawrence Livermore Lab (https://www.llnl.gov/). He does everything on his race car with a torque wrench as we worked on his car. He torqued the valve cover bolts, spark plugs, cylinder head studs and lug nuts by his request so he "knew they are right" instead of having me tighten everything. After his two stripped spark plug holes, he is going to follow my advice and not use it on the spark plugs.

But, then there is this post where it has been said their anti-seize has separated and they have had to add oil to it to regain the consistency they are needing.

I have a bottle of Permatex "Advanced Formula" anti-size that I have had for only two or three years. But, even sitting on the bench for a couple of days, when I open the lid and remove the brush I can see the oil "pooled" on top of the compound. Obviously this is more prominent during the hotter summer months.

I will continue to use the anti-seize on the idle mixture screws of the FJ carbs to prevent the brass screw from seizing in the aluminum carb body, but that is where I limit the usage.

The only thing I can say is, I guess not all "anti-seize" compounds are created equally, but I do confer the stuff does get everywhere...

Randy - RPM

[CutterBill]

...He torqued the valve cover bolts, spark plugs...  After his two stripped spark plug holes, he is going to follow my advice and not use it on the spark plugs.

Which is exactly what I said. Working from memory here, most bolt torque values are for "clean, dry threads." If you oil the threads, you must reduce the torque valve by (roughly) 25%.  If you use anti-seize, you must reduce the torque value by 50%.

By torquing the plugs to the book value, your customer over-tensioned the plugs.
Bill

[racerrad8]

By torquing the plugs to the book value, your customer over-tensioned the plugs.
Bill

Perfect, the mystery has been solved but the question still remains...

     The threads do not "strip", like those being over-torqued. The aluminum galls in the steel threads of the spark plug and the threads are then "pulled" out of the head. So....

What causes the aluminum to gall in the spark plug threads?

Thus my original statement; "

The problem I see with anti-seize is as the combustion temps are enough to carbonize the oil of the anti-seize, the only thing left in the threads is the powered metal component. That then galls the threads on the way out, pulling the weaker aluminum from the head.

Randy - RPM

I will have to snap a photo of the next spark plug I see with the aluminum transfer into the spark plug threads.

I have never used anti-seize on my spark plugs in my 23+ years of racing and working on the FJ engine and I have never had a spark plug thread issue on any of my engines.

In fact, if the anti-seize was the best application for the spark plugs, I would believe it would be listed in the GYSM.  But the GYSM says, "clean the grime from the threads"...(see pics) The guy this past week was torquing to 150 inch pounds since his foot pound torque wrench does not go down low enough for accurate torque measurement. They also have the "compression" method of torque as well.

Randy - RPM

[Mark Olson]

well , as having followed this particular topic as it travels thru different threads..ha ha.. see what I did there? 

Having worked as an engine machinist in a previous career I have found that the Anti-sieze in debate currently MAY cause pulled threads in Aluminum heads where the spark plugs are concerned.

I have repaired numerous heads where this was the issue. now , having said that you will be elated to learn that this particular problem only occurs with . extreme abuse of the engine.

so unless you are always at redline on your FJ and never check your sparkplugs you have nothing to worry about.
some members here don't rev above 6k.
 

[PaulG]

some members here don't rev above 6k.