Wheel Bearing Replacement

[PaulG]

After +100,000 km on OEM wheel bearings I installed in 2008 it seems time to replace them.  Actually no choice... got new Avons put on yesterday and found my front bearings don't want to spin, though the rears "seemed" OK.  So if I'm doing the fronts, then I'll do the rears too.

The main question I have is for installation.  Should the spacer in between be tight, or allow a little bit of movement to prevent any side load that may prematurely wear out the bearing.  I saw this on the University of YouTube so was wondering if that is possible with the FJ setup.  At present the spacer is tight for both F&R, but since I've got +100K km on them, then that's ok?  The Clymer and Haynes manuals don't mention this.

I already bought a front OEM set with seals (~$25), but the rear sprocket hub bearing is up to 3 weeks backorder from Japan.  I'm going to check a local SKF supplier to see if they have all three rears, barring that I'll order from RPM.  (...CDN dollar - shipping-blah-blah-blah)

I found the post in the files section regarding SKF replacements and Yamaha seals, but I'll pop out my OEMs and bring them in just in case these numbers are no longer current.

Rear SKF 6304 2RS1 (2 pcs)
       SKF 6305 2RS1 (1 pc) - sprocket hub

[Pat Conlon]

Upon bearing installation I noticed that the spacer was loose, however a year later when I removed my front wheel, the spacer was snug.

[FJmonkey]

Upon bearing installation I noticed that the spacer was loose, however a year later when I removed my front wheel, the spacer was snug.

It most likely snugged up when you tightened the axle and has been snug the entire time.

[markmartin]

I found that the spacers are machined longer than the distance between the hubs, I'm assuming by design.  I'd suggest using the axle as a guide to center the spacer as you finish setting the 2nd bearing into the hub. Go until the bearing touches the spacer and call it good.

I had similar concerns when I replaced mine.  This link may help http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=6163.15

[4everFJ]

I have just done the bearings.

The spacer should just touch the inner race. It shoud be possible to wiggle it a little from side to side without too much force.

[PaulG]

Thanks everyone for the quick responses.   

Nice having an international forum.  No matter what time you post or how urgent the need, theres usually somebody out there ready-willing-and able.   

BTW - how this post ended up in the Modifications section is beyond me...   

[FJ_Hooligan]

I see you're getting the -2RS bearings.  That means they have rubber seals on both sides.  Before installation, gently pry off one of the seals and pack the bearing with waterproof grease.  I've seen a few brand new sealed bearings that had almost no grease in them at all.

The seals pop off and on easily.  Use a pick or a small knife.

[PaulG]

From the above mentioned link http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=6163.15 I saw this reply from FJmonkey:

"...The inner race of the bearings should rest against the spacer inside the wheel. When properly sized it lets you torque down solid against the two inner races against the spacer in between and still allow the wheel to spin freely."

That would make sense why I couldn't spin the bearing from the inner race.    Some days you wonder just how fucking stupid you can get!    (Wait 'til I post my engine mount bushing adventure...)  I compared the fronts to the bearing in the sprocket hub which of course does spin - not realizing the spacer shaft is doing what it's designed to do.  These are the things that happen when you are up for over 24hrs by that time.  Got off work in the morning and didn't sleep all day...   

Well upon removal of the fronts today they looked kinda grungy with some light oxidation on the ouside edges. The outside of the left bearing (speedo side) had some black gunk on it.  Probably from the seal wearing on it?  The rears didn't seem to have any visual defects.  I did notice the new OEM bearings for the front had more resistance to spinning while in my hands than the old ones.  I assume that's because the old ones being worn and the grease broken down allows them to spin with a little less resistance?

So now off to SKF supplier tomorrow.

Thx to everyone.

[CutterBill]

...Before installation, gently pry off one of the seals and pack the bearing with waterproof grease.  I've seen a few brand new sealed bearings that had almost no grease in them at all...

Negative Ghostrider...
Every bearing manufacturer's engineering manual that I've read says that the proper amount of grease for a sealed bearing should be only enough to fill about 1/3 of the empty space.  It really doesn't take much.  Over-filling a sealed bearing leads to churning, which overheats the grease.  Then the oil runs out of the base carrier and the bearing has essentially no lubrication.  Then the bearing fails and you mumble something about "crap bearings ain't no good..."

Or another way to look at it... Exactly what problem are you trying to solve?  Millions of bikes and cars are running around on bearings that have "almost no grease" and they don't seem to have any problems.  Don't over-think it.  Just take the bearing out of the box, install it, and ride.
Bill

[4everFJ]

...Before installation, gently pry off one of the seals and pack the bearing with waterproof grease.  I've seen a few brand new sealed bearings that had almost no grease in them at all...

Negative Ghostrider...
Every bearing manufacturer's engineering manual that I've read says that the proper amount of grease for a sealed bearing should be only enough to fill about 1/3 of the empty space.  It really doesn't take much.  Over-filling a sealed bearing leads to churning, which overheats the grease.  Then the oil runs out of the base carrier and the bearing has essentially no lubrication.  Then the bearing fails and you mumble something about "crap bearings ain't no good..."

Or another way to look at it... Exactly what problem are you trying to solve?  Millions of bikes and cars are running around on bearings that have "almost no grease" and they don't seem to have any problems.  Don't over-think it.  Just take the bearing out of the box, install it, and ride.
Bill

+1 

[FJ_Hooligan]

Negative Ghostrider...
Every bearing manufacturer's engineering manual that I've read says that the proper amount of grease for a sealed bearing should be only enough to fill about 1/3 of the empty space.  It really doesn't take much.  Over-filling a sealed bearing leads to churning, which overheats the grease.  Then the oil runs out of the base carrier and the bearing has essentially no lubrication.  Then the bearing fails and you mumble something about "crap bearings ain't no good..."

Or another way to look at it... Exactly what problem are you trying to solve?  Millions of bikes and cars are running around on bearings that have "almost no grease" and they don't seem to have any problems.  Don't over-think it.  Just take the bearing out of the box, install it, and ride.
Bill

The problem I was trying to solve was a set of bearings that didn't have nearly enough grease in them.  Granted, that is my opinion, but if I see a bearing that has hardly any grease at all, I'm not going to use it in my son's bicycle much less my FJ.

I am among the millions that have never had a bearing failure but I've helped friends fix a few.  Most failed due to corrosion but a few were bone dry.  Call me paranoid, compulsive, or obsessive, and it wouldn't be the first time.  I'll never install another bearing without first removing a seal and inspecting the amount of grease and I'd encourage others to do the same.  I also change my oil well before its guaranteed 15000 mile change interval and would encourage others to do the same (maybe let it go only 12500 miles just in case).

The 1/3 fill you site typically applies to a high speed application.  I think I could argue that the auto wheel bearing application is not a high speed application.  A little math shows that a 17 inch wheel with a 180/55 tire has an approximate radius of 12 inches.  At 100 MPH, the wheel bearing is rotating at approx 1355 RPM.  That's probably why I've never had a wheel bearing go bad on my truck or trailer even though they are packed 100% with grease. 

Perhaps the bearings that I got came through the assembly line just after the grease cartridge was changed and there was an air bubble in the line.  Even though millions are running out there without failure, someone has to be the one to get the bad ones. 

[CutterBill]

Do whatever you want.  My concern is that some youngster, new to FJ's and learning the ways of maintenance and repair, might read your bad advice and think it's true.  Because it SOUNDS like good advice.  But it's not.  "More" is not always "Better."

Or still another way to look at it:  You're smarter than some bearing engineer that has dedicated his life to designing, testing, and evaluating bearings?  Nah, I don't think so...   

[Nova]

Me personally? I'm going to add some grease, but not pack it full. Why? Because I may not be smarter than a bearing engineer, but I am smarter than the subcontracted temporary independent contractor bearing packer machine operator making minimum wage who doesn't give two shits because it's almost lunchtime and it's taco tuesday.

[PaulG]

Play nice guys...   

... but I am smarter than the subcontracted temporary independent contractor bearing packer machine operator making minimum wage who doesn't give two shits ....

Sounds exactly like some people where I work.  Good thing we don't make any moving parts, just your cosmetic bling that you pay $400 for a $30 part.   

BTW - bike is 99% ready for the road, just need to fiddle with the front fender and luggage rack.   Tales of sturm und drang to follow...

[Nova]

I'm a QC Inspector. Trust me. That is some people where everyone works.