Ok guys, bare with me. Im an avid rider, but dont know a think about the mechanics of these machines. Let me tell you whats going on.
Im an avid accelleration freak, top end is nice, but the git up and go is what im all about.
Lately, when gassing my FJ through the gears, around 5 to 6000 RPM, its as if the bike isnt getting enough gas, and starts to studder instead of getting me anywhere close to redline fast. It is doing this throughout every gear. If I ride the bike like a daily driver, there doesnt seem to be a problem, however its quite embarrasing having a 750 take me off the line because my bike isnt pushing at all.
The bike is stock at this point, and I plan on getting many upgrades to it as I get the money (someone mentioned displacement of a hayabusa, muaha) But even at stock, my FJ100 with a Dynojet Stage 3 puts my 1200 to shame.
Could someone tell me whats going on? Bigger engine + less get up and go = A very dissapointed FJ Fan.
James
Fuel filter added, or any other restriction?
Gas tank venting (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=2024.0)
hose routing (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=3756.0)
really, really crappy gas (but it wouldn't idle then either)
Do a WOT plug chop and see what the plugs say. Odds are you're right, just starving it for whatever reason.
If it's been in winter storage, have a look inside the airbox...
Randy T
Indy
plus 1 on that
Well, here is the part that has me stumped. I dont believe its related to storage, as ive been riding it for about 2 months now. I know im crazy like that, but love to ride. I just took it in to have the Valve cover gasket replaced as I seen it was leaking a little, and while the guy was in it, I went ahead and had the sparks changed out. This was done about three weeks ago. When it first came out, everything was running great, and no acceleration problems. As far as gas, I guess it could be an issue, but I buy my gas from the same place every time, and only use 93 in my machine. Never had a problem with gas before from there. Yesterday was the first time I noticed that it was 'studdering' around 5 - 6000 RPMs. And today it just seems to be worse then yesterday.
What has me concerned, is when the shop did my Valve cover gasket, to clean all the oil off the outside of the engine, they pressure washed it. Could this have knocked something loose, or put water where water dont belong? If so, why is it just now causing an issue three weeks later?
Any other suggestions?
I have had a similar problem with my 86' (same bike, different color scheme). My problem only occurred during sustained 5K+ RPM. It would start to cut out and continue to lose power till I was stalled on the side of the road. It would not start till it sat for 5 minutes or so. Did this a few times in the rain, really pissed me off. Turns out my problems only happened with my tank bag on. The gravity feed carbs cannot pull gas from a sealed tank, vacuum lock. I opened up the gas cap and cleaned up all the bits (being very careful not to lose the very tiny bearing). Did the dis-assembly in a bucket, no lost parts. Others have just removed the little flapper valves as posted by Andyb.
I believe you may be on to something FJmonkey. The reason I say this, is because of a high pitched 'Whine' that comes out of the gas tank when I shut it off. It sounds kinda like the whine you get from a cars fuel pump when it is starting to go out. I didnt think much of it, because its my belief the FJ doesnt have a fuel pump, so there wouldnt be one to go out on it. However, after your comment, It dawned on me the same noise may be coming from Air trying to get in the tank, kinda like a whistling sound, if the tank is struggling to let air get in. Would make sense to, at least to me... the higher the RPM the more gas its trying to cyphen out, and if it isnt able to.. voila... Other than the gas cap, is there any other fix to this?
Quote from: vpfjames on April 10, 2011, 06:46:53 PM
I believe you may be on to something FJmonkey. The reason I say this, is because of a high pitched 'Whine' that comes out of the gas tank when I shut it off. It sounds kinda like the whine you get from a cars fuel pump when it is starting to go out. I didnt think much of it, because its my belief the FJ doesnt have a fuel pump, so there wouldnt be one to go out on it. However, after your comment, It dawned on me the same noise may be coming from Air trying to get in the tank, kinda like a whistling sound, if the tank is struggling to let air get in. Would make sense to, at least to me... the higher the RPM the more gas its trying to cyphen out, and if it isnt able to.. voila... Other than the gas cap, is there any other fix to this?
Maybe a more complicated air pump wired into the ignition system to positive pressure the tank while the engine is on. Switch over to a fuel pump (means changing the carbs to a fuel pump model) I would just modify the gas cap.
Quote from: vpfjames on April 10, 2011, 06:46:53 PM
I believe you may be on to something FJmonkey. The reason I say this, is because of a high pitched 'Whine' that comes out of the gas tank when I shut it off. It sounds kinda like the whine you get from a cars fuel pump when it is starting to go out. I didnt think much of it, because its my belief the FJ doesnt have a fuel pump, so there wouldnt be one to go out on it. However, after your comment, It dawned on me the same noise may be coming from Air trying to get in the tank, kinda like a whistling sound, if the tank is struggling to let air get in. Would make sense to, at least to me... the higher the RPM the more gas its trying to cyphen out, and if it isnt able to.. voila... Other than the gas cap, is there any other fix to this?
Credit to Klavdy...
(http://i643.photobucket.com/albums/uu159/rktmanfj/gas.jpg)
http://tinyurl.com/6ym2o65 (http://tinyurl.com/6ym2o65)
Ok, you said to modify the gas cap. Bare with my stupidity, but how I would I go about doing that. Does something need to come off, put on, drill holes. lol... im at a loss.
Um... :dash2: I give up...
Quote from: vpfjames on April 10, 2011, 07:22:41 PM
Ok, you said to modify the gas cap. Bare with my stupidity, but how I would I go about doing that. Does something need to come off, put on, drill holes. lol... im at a loss.
See the pic with the toads? Look for the orange colored thingy in a figure 8 shape of white plastic (between the toads but lower in the pic). Remove your fuel cap from the tank. Cover the tank while the cap is off (eliminate all sources of ignition while the cap is off). Slowly and carefully take the cap apart in while in the bottom of and empty bucket. Have plenty of light to see what you are doing and remember how to reassemble it. The orange flapper is the part that sings to you. Once removed it cannot hinder the pressure in the tank. Them toads are smart buggers.
My 89 whistles but not my 86, but the cap doesn't close real tight either. :scratch_one-s_head:
I blame it on the PO it must have been him. :biggrin: ya it's his fault.
Bob W
At a loss?? Did you could read the link that Andy posted in Reply #1 to your original post?
Quote from: Pat Conlon on April 10, 2011, 07:41:41 PM
At a loss?? Did you could read the link that Andy posted in Reply #1 to your original post?
C'mon Pat - give him the link again. Here it is again! (this will fix your problem) http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=2024.0 (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=2024.0)
The old saying about leading a horse to water springs to mind. :lol: Pete.
Quote from: Marsh White on April 10, 2011, 08:49:38 PM
Quote from: Pat Conlon on April 10, 2011, 07:41:41 PM
At a loss?? Did you could read the link that Andy posted in Reply #1 to your original post?
C'mon Pat - give him the link again. Here it is again! (this will fix your problem) http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=2024.0 (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=2024.0)
Just for the record... that's
THREE times... the tinyurl I posted goes to the same .pdf. :dash1:
Randy T
Indy
James,
Your bike is obviously cursed. That noise is the crying of the banshee. Sell me your bike before something awful happens.
I am a poison eater, many bikes with hexes and other ailments find their way to my door and pass their evil spirits to me.
Or you could take the gas cap apart.
Doug is there something you want to share with us, is this motor cursed. :flag_of_truce:
I don't need any bad luck thats why you have old blue. :biggrin:
Bob W
Wow, pretty amazing how these forums go from quite inviting to sarcasting smart ass remarks. My appologies for not looking at the frog picture. It didnt even dawn on me that there was a gas cap in the middle of it. Just assumed it was a random footer at the bottom of a posting. The original posting does lead to a PDF download, again excuse my cautiousness being new to the forums, and quite familiar around a computer for not downloading things from the computer from people I am not accustom to. As far as Tinyurl links, quite popular again with getting nasty little things I clean off computers on a daily basis. FJMonkey, thank you for being patient with me, simply explaining what was needed instead of downing my questions. You have been a great help to me, and its appreciated.
Quote from: vpfjames on April 11, 2011, 12:41:51 AM
Wow, pretty amazing how these forums go from quite inviting to sarcasting smart ass remarks. My appologies for not looking at the frog picture. It didnt even dawn on me that there was a gas cap in the middle of it. Just assumed it was a random footer at the bottom of a posting. The original posting does lead to a PDF download, again excuse my cautiousness being new to the forums, and quite familiar around a computer for not downloading things from the computer from people I am not accustom to. As far as Tinyurl links, quite popular again with getting nasty little things I clean off computers on a daily basis. FJMonkey, thank you for being patient with me, simply explaining what was needed instead of downing my questions. You have been a great help to me, and its appreciated.
Don't get bent out of shape! We were just trying to help. But - as more and more information surfaced from you about your problem - it became more and more apparent to us that if you had just clicked the very first link (answer) posted to you and read it that your problem would have been solved. You failed to heed / read the advice given to you. So it had to be pointed out - again and again. That's all.
BTW: it is pretty hard to get a virus from a pdf... also - it has been downloaded 128 times previously - you would think that if there was a problem that it would have surfaced by now...
Marsh, I know most are trying to help. This is what intrigued me of this site, and my comment wasnt directed towards those, yourself included that simply stated what needs to be done. Even opening the PDF and reading what is there, is simply a diagram of how to disassemble the gas cap, which is great for cleaning, replacing pieces, or of course modifying if you know what you are modifying. However it wasn't until FJMonkey informed me of what part needed to be removed in order to modify it to accomplish what needed to be done. (once again, thank you FJMonkey) Point being, all the unnecessary ridicule of my questioning is probably driving people away from this site that would otherwise stick around. Ive lived by the rule, "the only dumb questions are the ones that aren't asked". Here on this forum, it doesn't seem to be this way, and its a shame because i'm sure there are quite a few people new to the FJ life that would love to learn from you guys. Just my opinion of course.
And not to get off subject, but just to be known. PDF files are used quite frequently to pass along boot sector viruses hidden within gif and jpeg images embedded in them. And yes, I too took note of the amount of times it was downloaded, however using that to judge whether or not something is "safe" is the biggest mistake people make when surfing the web. You use an SMF forum here on the site, which in my experience is quite easy to get in to and change stored files (like PDFs) at will, especially using hosting providers like Siteground.
But enough on this, Ive taken my gas cap assembly off, and will use the provided PDF to remove the piece pointed out to me, and will re-assemble it in the morning and give it a whirl to see if it solves the dilemma.
Bwahahahahha.
QuoteAnd not to get off subject, but just to be known. PDF files are used quite frequently to pass along boot sector viruses hidden within gif and jpeg images embedded in them. And yes, I too took note of the amount of times it was downloaded,
You'd think someone would notice. If you're so comfortable with the dangerous and common viruses, you should be comfortable fixing them as well. And if you're paranoid enough to not click the bloody links when you're given a direct answer, then you should have backups of your files. Though I'll grant that I despise tinyurl, and it's not got any purpose, not even slightly, other than hiding the nature of where a link goes.
But c'mon, you gotta look at the answers provided to get anywhere. Lord knows if we posted immediate links to viruses or nastiness, they'd be moderated out after an outcry.
andyb, not trying to sound as if I'm not appreciative of the diagram you provided, because I am. But realistically, what did that do to help me based off my original question? You mentioned I needed to look at the answers provided, I am in agreement with you there, but the answers were not provided until FJMonkey informed me what needed to be done to modify the cap. Please correct me if i'm wrong here, but all previous posts did not do this. You state that I was given a link with a direct answer? If the question was, "how do I disassemble the gas cap?" then yes, it would have been a direct answer. However that was not the question.
I am quite comfortable fixing computers, as i'm sure you are quite comfortable fixing your FJ, but would you do something you know could be a potential problem for your FJ, just because you know you can fix it? Kind of pointless isn't it?
Lets just stay on topic here, and again, thank you to those that are helping out those of us who don't have a clue when it comes to the mechanics of these great bikes.
Quote from: vpfjames on April 11, 2011, 02:13:03 AM
u are quite comfortable fixing your FJ, but would you do something you know could be a potential problem for your FJ, just because you know you can fix it? Kind of pointless isn't it?
Gas cap venting. Breather assembly is shown in the assembly. Now, it may be possible that it could be left as stock but is filthy and stuck/clogged, or it could be possible that you need additional work to clear it (i.e., a flapperectomy), but without knowing what mods you've done to your 1200, it's hard to guess at what your fuel requirements are, yes? Yes, I probably should have just given you the answer without a link and let you use the search function, but I figured I'd save you some portion of the work. You gotta look at the file to see the pictures, y`know :)
For reference, my FJ's engine is in little bits right now because I'm fixing something that wasn't broken, albeit it leaked a bit.
My computer got the OS reinstalled today, in fact (added a drive to the array), again, fixing things that weren't necessarily broken. Pointless? Take it apart and assume that you've got the skills to fix any problems you may cause, or assume that you've got the ability to find the answers to get it fixed properly. Sure, once in a great while it'll bite you in the ass, but that's how you learn stuff, by working on things that you don't know how to fix... otherwise no one would take anything apart, ever, and we'd treat these as disposable. Don't worry so much, man :)
Quote from: vpfjames on April 11, 2011, 12:41:51 AM
smart ass remarks
James,
My intent was to make you laugh. I appear to have missed the mark. I apologize for piling on when you are frustrated and asking for help. Best of luck with fixing your bike. I still think you should sacrifice a pet (doesn't have to be yours!) to silence the sirens singing from your tank. Now when you've done this and it still runs poorly, we'll be here for you.
Doug
(popcorn)
GAS tank venting -- when this first happened to me on my 86 bak in 87 I did not have the luxury of the internet.... I did the only thing I knew how at the time and cut a notch in the seal on the cap. I was smart and cut the notch near the top so that when I do all those crazy wheelies no gas comes out. Fortunately the brakes aren't too good for the "Stoppies" so no fear going the other way javascript:void(0);
It worked very well by the way --- you cut a v-notch into the seal until the noise stops. I live with the noise on the 90 model because I like the way the FJ sings to me when I park it.
sc2
Pulling the orange breather rubber worked like a charm. No more hesitation going over 5k RPM. Thanks guys for the help.
James