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General Category => Maintenance => Topic started by: Dazza57 on October 02, 2013, 05:09:21 AM

Title: Carb rebuild
Post by: Dazza57 on October 02, 2013, 05:09:21 AM
Hi all, well after having the kits I bought from Randy sitting in the fridge for about 18 months, I finally had to bite the bullet and "DO THE JOB". It was precipitated by my mate taking EFFY for a ride and on the return she decided to drop what was left of the tank onto the ground, which I assumed would be a jammed float or some gunk in there somewhere. Parts of the bike look like they didn't see much TLC in her previous life, so rebuild the carbs it is.

We all has gone mostly well. The pilot jet with it's tiny little washer and "O" ring had me bamboozled a bit until I shone a torch down the hole and saw some bits that looked like they should come out. All good. Now reassembling the carbs into the bike, I find I have 2 lots of larger "O" rings, one set came with the new intake manifold, the other set came with the carb rebuild kits. I inserted one set into the intake manifolds in the face that meets the metal of the engine intake, and I have a spare set.

Then I got to wondering why there was a groove around the outside of the carb, the part that is inserted into the intake manifold. So I put an "O" ring on it and it fit. There wasn't an "O" ring around this part of the carb when I pulled it apart, and I cannot find anything in the parts drawings etc showing an "O" ring used here.

Can anyone tell me whether it is good/bad to use one here? I had quite a back firing problem before this rebuild, and had cleared the exhaust side from being the culprit, so wonder whether this might help.

Cheers Dazza

PS I do have a photo of the bit where I put the "O" ring, so if needed I will battle through posting it :)
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: FJ1100mjk on October 02, 2013, 07:11:23 AM
There's no o-ring used on the groove of the carb body that you described. You have a redundant set of o-rings for the intake mankfolds (for the groove on their backsides). One set came with the carb rebuild kit, and the other with the intake manifolds.
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: racerrad8 on October 02, 2013, 11:18:44 AM
Quote from: FJ1100mjk on October 02, 2013, 07:11:23 AM
There's no o-ring used on the groove of the carb body that you described. You have a redundant set of o-rings for the intake mankfolds (for the groove on their backsides). One set came with the carb rebuild kit, and the other with the intake manifolds.

+1

Randy - RPM
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Bminder on October 02, 2013, 04:24:10 PM
Randy made me clean my pilot jets so many times now I have nightmares about it...  :cray:
The doctor said I have PJSD - Pilot Jet Stress Disorder.

Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: RichBaker on October 02, 2013, 06:42:55 PM
Quote from: Dazza57 on October 02, 2013, 05:09:21 AM
Hi all, well after having the kits I bought from Randy sitting in the fridge for about 18 months, I finally had to bite the bullet and "DO THE JOB". It was precipitated by my mate taking EFFY for a ride and on the return she decided to drop what was left of the tank onto the ground, which I assumed would be a jammed float or some gunk in there somewhere. Parts of the bike look like they didn't see much TLC in her previous life, so rebuild the carbs it is.

We all has gone mostly well. The pilot jet with it's tiny little washer and "O" ring had me bamboozled a bit until I shone a torch down the hole and saw some bits that looked like they should come out. That is the mixture screw, NOT the pilot jet.

All good. Now reassembling the carbs into the bike, I find I have 2 lots of larger "O" rings, one set came with the new intake manifold, the other set came with the carb rebuild kits. I inserted one set into the intake manifolds in the face that meets the metal of the engine intake, and I have a spare set.

Then I got to wondering why there was a groove around the outside of the carb, the part that is inserted into the intake manifold. So I put an "O" ring on it and it fit. There wasn't an "O" ring around this part of the carb when I pulled it apart, and I cannot find anything in the parts drawings etc showing an "O" ring used here. No O-rings on the carb bells...

Can anyone tell me whether it is good/bad to use one here? I had quite a back firing problem before this rebuild, and had cleared the exhaust side from being the culprit, so wonder whether this might help.

Cheers Dazza

PS I do have a photo of the bit where I put the "O" ring, so if needed I will battle through posting it :)
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Dazza57 on October 03, 2013, 05:49:31 AM
Thanks everyone for the clarification, seems when ever I do something to this beautiful beast I learn something more. Of course it certainly helps when the people on this site share their vast amount of knowledge so freely with us FJ newbies.

Cheers everyone, Dazza
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: FJ1100mjk on October 03, 2013, 06:58:11 AM
Quote from: RichBaker on October 02, 2013, 06:42:55 PM

No O-rings on the carb bells...


True statement. No o-rings needed on the bell side, but I believe Dassa57 is referring to the "spigot" end of the carb.
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: ELIMINATOR on October 03, 2013, 03:06:02 PM
OK, no one else has asked. Why were the parts in the fridge?
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Harvy on October 03, 2013, 03:36:59 PM
Quote from: ELIMINATOR on October 03, 2013, 03:06:02 PM
OK, no one else has asked. Why were the parts in the fridge?


Because Randys parts are pretty cool!    :biggrin:
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Dazza57 on October 04, 2013, 02:44:39 AM
I keep all my rubber bits (lol) in the fridge because of the hot climate up here, also dehumidifies, so keeps the rubber in better shape longer, so I am told. We do it with our speargun rubbers, so that's where I got it from.
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Dazza57 on October 12, 2013, 03:22:13 AM
First up, thanks Randy and Rich  for setting me straight on the O rings.
Well the carb rebuild saga continues. Checked and adjusted the valve shims, only 3 required changing. Put in new spark plugs. Completed reassembling the carbs and put back into the bike.
Got everything ready to do a synch with the motion pro, and found that the blue liquid is full of bubbles, so ordered some replacement fluid.
Got the motor warmed up, started first go with no choke, and when I did the blip test it was hanging and only slowly coming down, so closed up the pilot screws, the ones closest to the engine (that's what they are called in the Clymer manual), so they are now at 2 full turns out from seated. Blips OK now. Seems to idle OK without the synch, so took her for a run.
Well all seemed OK til I gave her a handful, and she started popping and stuttering like she wasn't getting enough fuel. Was OK when only slowly accelerating to about 5k, then I could hear the starving starting.
When I put the carbs back together I set the float levels with calipers, 22mm. All the jets from Randy's rebuild kit were exactly the same size as what I took out of them.
The only things that have changed are the float level and replacing the paper air filter with a K&N filter, but I wouldn't have thought that would have changed things so much. Also changed out the fuel filter.
The one big plus is that the back firing has gone, suspect the inlet manifolds were cactus, which I had also replaced.
Can anyone suggest where I might start to fix the apparent starving? Do I need to set the floats higher, or is there something else I have missed? Would I be advised to do the fuel level check before pulling the carbs out again (not looking forward to that, although I think I have found some better ways of doing it after the first time)
As ever, all help much appreciated.

Cheers, Dazza
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: andyb on October 12, 2013, 08:54:41 AM
Thanks Rich for pointing out the different between a screw and a jet :)

Doublecheck the fuel line routing if you've recently been in the carbs and are having possible starvation.  Possibly a stuck float, but mine always stuck open, not closed.
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Dazza57 on October 14, 2013, 07:33:23 AM
OK, not many responses over the weekend, too many more interesting posts :shout:
So I've got this problem, rebuilt carbs etc, not much has really changed. Bit more diagnostic info (wow big words for a Monday night, whew!)
Yesterday, I tried checking a few things without taking the carbs off.
Fuel line to the carbs OK, no kinks.
Tried to do the carb fuel level test with some clear tube, even with the engine running couldn't get the fuel level to come up into the tube :( only did #1 carb, maybe should do the others as well?)
I did set the floats with verniers at 22mm. Set the balance as close as could be by eye (still haven't balanced, don't think this is the problem, but correct me if I'm wrong)
So the problem:
can increase revs slowly in gear right up to about 6k, and all good, then starts to splutter and fart. If I do the same thing with load, it starts to immediately splutter etc, for me it really sounds like it is starving for fuel. A handful of throttle and it immediately starts stuttering, no power, just sick sounding.
OK, observations, yesterday, fuel pump did something different. Before, it used to tick when I turned on the ignition, yet this time it ticked more loudly, then stopped (which it used to do, stop that is), I started the engine and it started again (the ticking) Today I tried the same test, but the ticking wasn't nearly so loud.
Starting to suspect the fuel pump, but after checking Randy's site, I see there is also a fuel pump point set.
Can someone tell me whether the point set is separate to the pump?
To get this all into perspective, I have planned a tour down south on  Effy in 4 weeks time. If I need to order parts from Randy then I only have a short time to get it all happening.
I have had 2 suggestions today on possible causes of my problems.
1. spark plug caps arcing
2. too rich? (can't see how this would happen, exactly same jets all through, only change was the K&N filter and higher float levels measured by vernier)
3. Question here, I used slightly over the half amount of oil for the K&N filter, would this have as much influence?
4.Coils dying?
I know someone has  an answer out there that will help me get away on my holiday on Effy, just need to find it quick, please  :wacko1: really stumped

Dazza
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: FJ1100mjk on October 14, 2013, 08:00:45 AM
Dazza57:

Sounds like you may need to pull the carb bank. Again.

I re-read your previous posts, and I can't see where you actually did set the fuel levels properly in the float bowls. You mentioned that you couldn't get the fuel into the clear tube to begin with, and could only do #1 carb. When you had your carbs apart, did you make sure that the drain openings were clear, so that when you loosened the drain screws, fuel would flow out of the bowls? If they are plugged, that would be a reason no fuel would go into the clear tubing for checking the float bowls' fuel levels. I have found that just doing the float height adjustment is a starting point, but the clear tube to check the fuel level in the carbs' float bowls is a must. And don't be suprised if the float height adjustment varies my a marked amount to get the fuel levels within specification either.

One last thing, did you try running the bike with the gas tank's cap loose (or open, but not with a lot of fuel in the tank, for obvious reasons)? It's a long shot, but maybe your fuel tank's cap is not venting fast enough, and you're drawing a vacuum in your tank, which would cause fuel starvation too.

Marty
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: movenon on October 14, 2013, 09:03:49 AM
Here is some fuel system information for the 89 -93 FJ's.

OK, as a test you might run an 8mm fuel line directly from the petcock (bypass the fuel filter) to the carb inlet (you will need a few feet of fuel line and a barbed splice). Unplug your fuel pump wiring. And see if it runs any better. Now without a fuel pump at some point it will starve out so don't be alarmed. But you could get a couple of test runs. When was the last time the fuel filter was changed ? If you look into your fuel tank is it fairly clean looking ? If it is "crappy" inside the tank then be aware there is a small filter screen inside the tank at the petcock. Just something to know about.

With the above hose and fitting you will have an emergency fix for a bad fuel pump while in the outback.... :good2: Only use this for an emergency or a test....... If you use this for an "emergency kit" then also buy a cheap manual turn on and off valve. So you can shut the fuel off for an overnight stay or store it until it can be repaired properly.

As mentioned by FJ1100mjk you can get a vacuum lock in the tank because the vent flapper can stick shut. A simple test is to just crack open your fuel tank filler and let atmospheric pressure work for you and see if it clears up. Usually shows up after running down the road for a bit, sucking fuel out of the tank with no air coming in to replace the volume it will eventually slow the fuel flow down. More of a problem with gravity feed systems but can happen with any FJ.

The points your are referring to are located in the end of the fuel pump. If you need to replace the fuel pump there are a number of non stock, after market pumps that will work for 50 to 100.00 USD. Randy at RPM also has a pump that will work.

Here is a post on a KTM site that shows you what the points look like in the Mitsubishi fuel pump and one of the options to replace it with.

http://www.ktm950.info/how/Orange%20Garage/Engine/fuel_pump/facet_40171/facet_40171_install.HTML (http://www.ktm950.info/how/Orange%20Garage/Engine/fuel_pump/facet_40171/facet_40171_install.html)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4

Just for info this shows you the points in action. The pump is used in many different bikes. What varies a bit is the inlet and outlet locations.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77S2VVLupTY

If it is the fuel pump then be aware that the pump itself has 3 areas of fail er. the points, the diaphragm, or the motor. What I am saying is that the points might not fix it.

George

Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: ribbert on October 14, 2013, 09:21:37 AM
Quote from: movenon on October 14, 2013, 09:03:49 AM
...... If you use this for an "emergency kit" then also buy a cheap manual turn on and off valve. So you can shut the fuel off for an overnight stay or store it until it can be repaired properly.


I use these on fuel lines (or if I can't find them, vice grips)

(http://www.samstagsales.com/images/sw12975st.jpg)''

Noel
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: ribbert on October 14, 2013, 09:36:06 AM
Dazza, there's an FJ owner on every corner in QL, or so it seems. Can't someone help you?

I'd put a bit more time into diagnosing before you consider replacing parts willy nilly.

Did this only happen after the carb rebuild? It sounds like a fueling problem from your description.

Noel
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: movenon on October 14, 2013, 09:42:16 AM
Quote from: ribbert on October 14, 2013, 09:21:37 AM
Quote from: movenon on October 14, 2013, 09:03:49 AM
...... If you use this for an "emergency kit" then also buy a cheap manual turn on and off valve. So you can shut the fuel off for an overnight stay or store it until it can be repaired properly.


I use these on fuel lines (or if I can't find them, vice grips)

(http://www.samstagsales.com/images/sw12975st.jpg)''

Noel

On the road (or home) vice grips are king ! One of the better inventions in life... They have saved my ass more than once.
George
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Capn Ron on October 14, 2013, 03:54:36 PM
Quote from: movenon on October 14, 2013, 09:42:16 AM
Quote from: ribbert on October 14, 2013, 09:21:37 AM
Quote from: movenon on October 14, 2013, 09:03:49 AM
...... If you use this for an "emergency kit" then also buy a cheap manual turn on and off valve. So you can shut the fuel off for an overnight stay or store it until it can be repaired properly.


I use these on fuel lines (or if I can't find them, vice grips)

(http://www.samstagsales.com/images/sw12975st.jpg)''

Noel

On the road (or home) vice grips are king ! One of the better inventions in life... They have saved my ass more than once.
George

Got a brand/model of those manual clamps Noel?  I can see many uses for those...

I've used vice grips on the rock crawler to pinch a ruptured brake line to get pedal pressure back for the other three wheels.  priceless!

Cap'n Ron. . .
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: ribbert on October 14, 2013, 05:29:26 PM
Quote from: Capn Ron on October 14, 2013, 03:54:36 PM

Got a brand/model of those manual clamps Noel?  I can see many uses for those...

Cap'n Ron. . .

No, had them for years but they are readily available from auto parts stores. The more serious ones not the accessory ones. Fuel line clamping is what they are made for and what they are called.

Noel
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: movenon on October 14, 2013, 06:04:14 PM
Quote from: ribbert on October 14, 2013, 05:29:26 PM
Quote from: Capn Ron on October 14, 2013, 03:54:36 PM

Got a brand/model of those manual clamps Noel?  I can see many uses for those...

Cap'n Ron. . .

No, had them for years but they are readily available from auto parts stores. The more serious ones not the accessory ones. Fuel line clamping is what they are made for and what they are called.

Noel

I located them on line at 29.00 a pair / 15.30 for one..... Kind of expensive but you probably don't need two of them. I think a trip to the hardware store and a little time I could make something similar.  :pardon:
http://www.samstagsales.com/stahlwille.htm#Fuel (http://www.samstagsales.com/stahlwille.htm#Fuel)
George
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: ribbert on October 14, 2013, 07:08:15 PM
Quote from: movenon on October 14, 2013, 06:04:14 PM
I located them on line at 29.00 a pair / 15.30 for one..... Kind of expensive but you probably don't need two of them. I think a trip to the hardware store and a little time I could make something similar.  George


If space isn't an issue and it's for workshop use, these are the best.
You can also use them on brake hoses. One handed operation.

(http://images.esellerpro.com/2873/I/25/3698.jpg)

If you are going to make one, those small push bike vulcanising clamps that everyone has somewhere in the garage make a good starting point.

Noel
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Dazza57 on October 15, 2013, 04:30:00 AM
Wow, after a quiet weekend response-wise, this morning I get up to so many that I don't know where to start. :flag_of_truce:
First, Marty, I stripped the carbs completely, including the drain plugs, cleaned and cleaned with carb cleaner, washed out with water then blew every orifice out several times with air before reassembling with all new brass and O rings. Checked the new jets were all the same as what was taken out, and even set the needles at the same height (middle).

When I installed the float I used verniers to set the height at 22mm (spec says 21.3-23.3). Once I had reassembled all the carbs I bolted them all together and did an eyeball throttle slide setup. Set the idle mixture screws to 2.5 turns out and put the carbs back into the bike with new inlet manifolds.

I installed a new K&N filter element, and was concerned I may have over oiled as I used about 2/3 of the little plastic sachet, but this arvo I took it out and reinstalled the paper one and the same thing is happening, so no luck there.

George, I changed the fuel filter at the same time all this work was done and the inside of the tank is pristine, so I'm not suspecting the petock screen. I don't think it is the flapper valve either, as the engine does this right from start off as soon as I load her up, only 50 metres down the road with the tank only half full.
Thanks also for the info on the fuel pump. I intend to try your fuel pump bypass tomorrow night, and try to see the fuel level as well, but plan to order a new pump from Randy anyway, as I don't want to miss out on my bike holiday down south in 3.5 weeks time, and figure Effy is 13 years old so is probably ready for a new pump  :yes:

Noel, thanks for the hint about all the Queensland FJers, but I live about 3500 kms away in the NW of Western Australia, 1500 kms north of Perth. It would be nice to have some of them a bit closer. Yes this has only happened since the carb rebuild. The reason I did it was one of the floats had jammed and emptied the tank over night. Couldn't be bothered waiting for it to happen again and since I had already purchased the kits, decided to bite the bullet and do the job. This wasn't the first time for me inside carbs, and I have never had problems before.

So tomorrow night after work I'll be scratching the head again and hopefully find the problem. Thanks as always for everyone's help and advice. Can't help but love this community.

Cheers, Dazza
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: movenon on October 15, 2013, 10:34:01 AM
Thanks for the information. It is difficult to trouble shoot via the internet sometimes. In reading your post you indicated that the needle (or needles) stuck and drained all your fuel out of the tank.

The fuel pump should have prevented that from happening. The fuel pump should have a built in check valve to stop fuel flow when there there is no power to it. It is a safety feature. If things were working correctly the only fuel that would leak with no power on,  is the fuel in your carb bowel. If you get a pump from RPM then I would swap your old pump out.  I would also recommend you hang on to your old pump, you might be able to repair it later and have a spare.

If you drained out all the fuel in the tank also check that fuel did not leak forward into the engine and end up diluting the engine oil. It sounds strange but can happen.
George  :good2: :morning2:





Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Capn Ron on October 15, 2013, 04:07:19 PM
Quote from: movenon on October 15, 2013, 10:34:01 AM
If you drained out all the fuel in the tank also check that fuel did not leak forward into the engine and end up diluting the engine oil. It sounds strange but can happen.
George  :good2: :morning2:


I bought my first bike in '86...it was a new '82 Yamaha Seca 550 sold as a "leftover."  Because it had been sitting in a crate for four years, the tank had surface rust.  The day I took delivery of it, something seemed off.  Was stumbling, running very rich.  I turned around and rode it right into the service department.  The sediment from the fuel tank had kept the needles from seating, this flooded the carbs, the excess fuel had run into the cylinders.  From there, the fuel trickled down around the piston rings and FILLED the crankcase with gasoline!  When they drained the "oil", it was more gas than oil!  I thought I was riding around on a potential bomb!   :shok:  Not to mention the engine damage from lack of lubrication.

Cap'n Ron. . .
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: movenon on October 15, 2013, 06:48:49 PM
It has never happened to me (knowingly) but I have heard about it a number of times so I thought it might be worth mentioning as good information to others that might be reading the thread.

Ron your story highlights an opinion that I believe is more of a concern now with older bikes that have no fuel filtering system in place. Tanks really don't get cleaner with age.. The FJ tank in particular has a pretty big "crap trap" in it's design. The left and right side of the fuel tank where your knees rest there are two voids that are below the petcock level. Probably could hold a pint of fuel, rust, water, anything heaver than gas etc..

If you use a bunch of bolts, nuts, sheet rock screws etc with a cleaning agent to "scrub" the inside if the FJ fuel tank, when you are done fishing out all the screws with a magnet, for about a half a day....the last SOB screw will be jammed down in the double wall tapered wing area....  :dash2: :dash2: :lol:

The user manual mentions to only fuel up to the bottom of what I will call the "fill tube". We all know if you go any higher you most likely will leak some fuel around the cap area. Really nice if you have a tank bag..... Between the bottom of the "fill tube" and the actual inside top of the tank there is at least 3/4 inch plus or minus of air space. This air space is good for condensing water etc. especially during long storage periods. Rust and crud can build up on the tank roof to later be washed off and dropping to the bottom of the tank. This problem is enhanced if you let outside free air into the fuel tank. By removing the flapper valve it could aggravate the problem?  I guess that's something to think about anyhow.  :morning2:

And that was today's project, remove,disassemble and clean as required the fuel vent system in the cap. All went well thanks to the excellent posting in the files section http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=2024.0 (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=2024.0).

If you have the tank off and all the fittings are out it is still hard to inspect inside of the tank. Having gone though this very recently I noticed while checking out at the local Wally World yesterday that they had a rack with one of those "as seen on TV" deals and noticed a small inspection light with a flexable stem that would have been handy during my cleaning process for less than 10.00. Like this one http://www.rakuten.com/prod/as-seen-on-tv-bell-howell-iscope-compact-led-magnetic-telescopic-light/247809309.html?listingId=271288661 (http://www.rakuten.com/prod/as-seen-on-tv-bell-howell-iscope-compact-led-magnetic-telescopic-light/247809309.html?listingId=271288661). Cheaper at Wally World.

George
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: The General on October 15, 2013, 07:32:17 PM
Quote from: Dazza57 on October 15, 2013, 04:30:00 AM
Noel, thanks for the hint about all the Queensland FJers, but I live about 3500 kms away in the NW of Western Australia, 1500 kms north of Perth. It would be nice to have some of them a bit closer...Can't help but love this community...

Cheers, Dazza
....So I guess we`ll see ya at Jindabyne then?...Would you like coffee with that steel butt trophy?  :drinks:
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Dazza57 on October 16, 2013, 03:48:54 AM
Mate, I was seriously tempted believe me! Did Pannawonica (look that one up) to Bathurst in 83 for the bike races, 17,000 kms in 3 weeks :)
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: NJona86FJ on October 16, 2013, 04:47:36 AM
 :shok: 17000 ks in 3 weeks!! Nice work.! It's not in the same league but I miss my Brisvegas to Newcastle night runs. Not to steal the thread but what were you on bike wise?
Cheers
Neil
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Dan Filetti on October 16, 2013, 09:20:56 PM
Quote from: Capn Ron on October 15, 2013, 04:07:19 PM

I bought my first bike in '86...it was a new '82 Yamaha Seca 550 sold as a "leftover." 
Cap'n Ron. . .

My first [street] bike was a Yamaha Maxim -almost certainly nearly the same bike as your Seca -lovely bike that was.

Dan
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: FJmonkey on October 16, 2013, 09:47:06 PM
Quote from: Dan Filetti on October 16, 2013, 09:20:56 PM
My first [street] bike was a Yamaha Maxim -almost certainly nearly the same bike as your Seca -lovely bike that was.

Dan
Really? Was it a Maxim 400???? That was my first bike... Boy did it need work for it to run... Good learning there....
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Dan Filetti on October 16, 2013, 09:56:04 PM
Quote from: FJmonkey on October 16, 2013, 09:47:06 PM
Really? Was it a Maxim 400???? That was my first bike... Boy did it need work for it to run... Good learning there....

Mine was the 550, (1982 vintage) but it was nearly the same bike as the 400 though.  By comparison, mine did need work, (which it never really got) but it still ran like stink nonetheless.

Looked like this:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v509/feelergaugephil/SDC10538.jpg)

Dan
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Capn Ron on October 16, 2013, 11:25:56 PM
Quote from: Dan Filetti on October 16, 2013, 09:56:04 PM
Mine was the 550, (1982 vintage) but it was nearly the same bike as the 400 though.  By comparison, mine did need work, (which it never really got) but it still ran like stink nonetheless.

Looked like this:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v509/feelergaugephil/SDC10538.jpg)

Dan

Yep, same engine they used in my '82 Seca 550.  Dead-simple and got me hooked on the Yamaha in-line fours.  I have a lot of great memories on that bike!

Cap'n Ron. . .
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: ribbert on October 17, 2013, 09:13:28 AM
Dazza, I don't trust my carbs. They perform flawlessly for 20,000km then have a fuel dumping episode, it might repeat itself an hour later, a day or a year. They might do it repeatedly for a couple of days and then not for the next two years.

It's not always the same one, I have the fuel pump model with good filtration, It runs on Aussie fuel, my tank is pristine, I regularly rinse it out, the carbs had never been fiddled with by the p o. They have been done once by me and the pattern is the same now as it always has been.

I carry one of these in each of my bike bags (so I always have one with me) to give the offending carby a few quick raps on the bowl and it stops immediately. It's a 300x10mm length of rod. Must be steel with a bit of weight to be effective. Screw driver handles won't do it.
Numbering the vent pipes (which I haven't done) makes it easy to identify which one is the culprit.

(http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3794/10327847075_408c74b615_c.jpg)

Yes, I know they shouldn't do it and yours probably won't but it's easy to carry and beats the hell out of pulling the carbs on the side of the road, particularly in your neck of the woods.

Noel
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Dazza57 on October 18, 2013, 06:00:55 PM
Neil, the bike for the Bathurst run was a 80 GS1000G Suzi shaft drive. She was a nice ride, could do 1500km days one after the other, very comfy.

Further to the carb saga, pulled the petock out of the tank, filter clean as. Checked the suppressors were tight in the plug leads. Took her for a spin with the fuel tank cap open, still the same problem.
I've taken the carbs off again, checked all the fuel lines were clear, all OK.
Today I'm going to take the bowls off and check the floats are all moving OK and try to set the levels with a clear tube. Not sure how I'll get fuel to them for that bit yet, still thinking about it.
I have bought some more fuel line, and after putting everything back today and testing again, if the problem is still there I'll try the direct fuel line bypassing the pump and see if that cures it.
The other thing I need to check today is whether the non-return valve for the fuel line is working, I have a funny feeling that it might not be, although at least she hasn't filled the sump with fuel.

Anyway, I'll let you know how I go tonight.

Cheers
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: RichBaker on October 18, 2013, 07:08:44 PM
Quote from: Dazza57 on October 18, 2013, 06:00:55 PM
The other thing I need to check today is whether the non-return valve for the fuel line is working, I have a funny feeling that it might not be, although at least she hasn't filled the sump with fuel.

Anyway, I'll let you know how I go tonight.

Cheers

The WHAT???
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: racerrad8 on October 18, 2013, 07:29:39 PM
Quote from: RichBaker on October 18, 2013, 07:08:44 PM
The WHAT???

C'mon Rich... :unknown:





















































That is what works in conjunction with the high-speed slobber valve.

Randy - RPM :biggrin:
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: movenon on October 18, 2013, 08:04:19 PM
 non-return valve ?? . 
If you bypass the fuel pump then also bypass the fuel filter for a test. The filter is to restrictive for gravity feed.
George
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: ribbert on October 19, 2013, 01:35:41 AM
Quote from: Dazza57 on October 18, 2013, 06:00:55 PM

The other thing I need to check today is whether the non-return valve for the fuel line is working

Cheers

I imagine you are referring to the "valve'' that stops the fuel flow when it's turned off?
That is the fuel pump's job.

Noel
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: Dazza57 on October 19, 2013, 11:49:20 PM
Well, I feel like a total knob head :dash2:
I took off all the float bowls to check I had set the float levels correctly. All seemed OK until I opened up carb #3. Hello, bit of brass lying there, the main jet had broken off. :flag_of_truce:

I thought I had been very careful not to over tighten the brass fittings, but evidently not  :dash2: Managed to get the bit of thread out :yahoo:, then used some air to make sure there were no bits left in there. Replaced the jet with one of the old ones, put everything back together, and hey presto  :yahoo:
Took her for a quick run and she's running, but still needs the carb synch
This morning did the carb synch and adjusted the idle mixture and took her for another run, awesome  :dance2:
Very happy with the results after being very concerned that I wouldn't be able to make my bike holiday in November.

So after all this Effy got a birthday wash, and after the MotoGP, she'll get a polish ready to remount the gearsack rack for the trip.

Thanks again everyone for all the help and patience with me, and Randy, I had to laugh at your quip "That is what works in conjunction with the high-speed slobber valve." Haha. My misuse of some names has to be laughable, but I made it after all thanks to the great people and experience on this site :good2:

Cheers, Dazza
Title: Re: Carb rebuild
Post by: racerrad8 on October 20, 2013, 12:30:58 AM
Quote from: Dazza57 on October 19, 2013, 11:49:20 PM
...and Randy, I had to laugh at your quip "That is what works in conjunction with the high-speed slobber valve." Haha. My misuse of some names has to be laughable, but I made it after all thanks to the great people and experience on this site :good2:

Cheers, Dazza

Glad you found it and I am glad I was able to enlighten your day just a little.

Enjoy the ride.

Randy - RPM