My Fuel Pump Crapped Out in South Dakota!!!

[Flying Scotsman]

Your fuel filter is in the tank there are also small filters in the carbs at the n/s.
If you want to add a fuel pump thats fine I would rather not have one though.
I have
84 no fuel pump
85 no fuel pump
86 no fuel pump
90 no fuel pump
just one more thing to go wrong if you ask me lol.......

[movenon]

Your fuel filter is in the tank there are also small filters in the carbs at the n/s.
If you want to add a fuel pump thats fine I would rather not have one though.
I have
84 no fuel pump
85 no fuel pump
86 no fuel pump
90 no fuel pump
just one more thing to go wrong if you ask me lol.......

Did you convert your 1990 to gravity feed ?

My 1990 FJ has a fuel pump. I believe they started with the pumps in 1989 (?) up. Someone might correct me on that.

Facet is spin off company of Puorlator.  The filter they recommend is a 71 micron Purolator filter. The Facet makes a lot of low pressure pumps. I don't know which one NAPA sold to Zwartie but the  Facet model 40171 has been used successfully in other motorcycles (KTM, Honda etc.) and has a built in shut off valve when no power is present and reverse flow valve (only a player if the fuel tank is mounted lower than the pump) . The pump is used often as a fuel transfer pump in homebuilt aircraft.

The 40171 can be bought for less than 50.00 and the 71 micron filter less than 10.00 (less than 6.00 in a Purolator box). Input and output threaded for 1/4' pipe thread I believe. I think it is possable to mount the pump and filter where the stock FJ pump is. I would be nice to have the filter out where you can service it with out pulling or lifting the tank.

The pump flows 18 gal per hour at around 3 PSI I think. We have a 5 gallon tank so can we use over 3 tanks full of fuel in one hour even at full throttle?
Randy might weigh in on this. All I can do is throw some information on the table.

The stock FJ (other bikes use the same pump) Mitsubishi fuel pump is a good pump, just a little archaic in its design.  It is a electro mechanical pump with mechanical vibrating points,  kind of belongs with old car radio's with vibrator's IMO. There are mods out there to lower the current passing through the Mitsubishi pumps points to reduce the arcing and burning but I don't think that is the answer. The pump can also fail on the pumping side.

I personally like the fuel pump system. I can always go to gravity feed in an emergency. I think with the fuel tanks getting older (rust and crud) and sometimes bad fuel that having a good filter in the system helps save expensive and time consumming carburetor problems. And then there is the cost/future availability and complexity of the vacuum fuel control system which are also getting long it the tooth.

I like the looks of the pump that Zwartie has and will be anxious to know what model it is and the spec's.

George

[Flying Scotsman]

Did you convert your 1990 to gravity feed ?

No but it had been converted when I bought it.

[movenon]

Did you convert your 1990 to gravity feed ?

No but it had been converted when I bought it.

I can understand why that would happen especially if someone was looking at buying a new Yamaha replacement pump that's for sure. In the conversion what did they use to shut the fuel off when there is no power ? 

George

[Flying Scotsman]

I need to double check next trip out there.I only have the 85 here at the moment.
Gas tank had some dents and has been replaced,I believe its a vacume petcock not the electric reserve petcock.

[Zwartie]

Zwartie,
Hey, no fair!  A search for the "EFT-3" FACET posi-flo electric fuel pump" produces nothing valid.  A search of NAPA gives no results for FACET at all.  NAPA chat techs are equally useless.  What is the FACET Part Number of that gadget, and the NAPA in-house Part Number (they said it would be on the receipt)?  FACET makes a dozen different units.  

My old FJ needs a fuel filter, so it will need a fuel pump.
Nice work, anyway.    

Cheers,
Red

Unfortunately I already tossed the receipt in the garbage. I still have the installation instructions and it indicates that it should be the Posi-Flo 60100 series. When I get a chance I will take a closer look at the pump to see if there's a part number on it.

Zwartie

[Pat Conlon]

I think George is on to something.... Noel has been advocating this mod for awhile and I'm beginning to agree....

1) Fuel filter access without removing the tank....a good thing.
      If the fuel filter does not have a metal body, I would be hesitant about locating a plastic body filter under the tank in the hot environment, where as a plastic body fuel filter located under the right side panel would be a nice solution.

2) Using the newer generation pump.
       From what I have read, the points on the oem fuel pump have been a point of failure.

I am seriously considering installing a fuel pump on my '84.
The only type of fuel filter on my '84 is the filter screen on the inlet to the petcock.
Gravity flow FJ's do not tolerate in line fuel filters. I know this fact first hand, I tried one and it didn't work.

Most of the problems I have had over the last 29 years with my '84 have been related to the vacuum petcock or debris in my gas causing free flow thru my carb bowl vent and choke vent. As George states, much of this can be avoided with a REAL fuel filter and a positive displacement pump.

One time, back in 1992 I had my vacuum petcock stick open when I parked my bike in my garage, something I did not notice (I don't know how I would have noticed)...only to come back and find a *huge* puddle of gas under my bike and my crankcase filled with gasoline.

It could have easily burned down my house. All that was needed was to have my furnace cycle on and...

All of this can be avoided with a fuel pump system.

I have a '92 FJ with a fuel pump system and I have never had a problem with fuel delivery or fuel contamination issues.

[Sabre093]

So what we need is for somebody to do this mod post pictures and see how it works

[Pat Conlon]

Rich...I will do just that...

[red]

Zwartie,
Hey, no fair!  A search for the "EFT-3" FACET posi-flo electric fuel pump" produces nothing valid.  My old FJ needs a fuel filter, so it will need a fuel pump.  Nice work, anyway.  
Cheers, Red

Unfortunately I already tossed the receipt in the garbage. I still have the installation instructions and it indicates that it should be the Posi-Flo 60100 series. When I get a chance I will take a closer look at the pump to see if there's a part number on it.
Zwartie

Zwartie,
Do you remember the price?  NAPA may have each pump priced differently, and if so, I could backtrack from there.  I'd like to do that mod, but no wild rush, here, really.   

Cheers,
Red

[movenon]

Facet 40171    http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/facetpumps.php 48.50 dollars.

Spec's
   
• Fuel Compatibility: The Facet Cube Fuel Pump is compatible with gasoline, blended alcohol fuels and fuel additives.
• Solid State Reliability: Proven on thousands of original equipment applications. No electrical contacts. No bearings or diaphragms to wear out or fatigue. Lasts four to five times longer than many other electric fuel pumps.
• Easy to Install: Two-bolt installation plus the small size makes installation easy. For best results, mount the pump close to the fluid or fuel tank and below the liquid level.
• Eliminates Vapor Lock: When properly installed on most vehicles a constant, smooth, dependable supply of fuel under pressure is assured in the hottest weather or in high altitudes.
• 12 - 84 inches minimum dry lift
• Transient Protection
• State of the art Electronics
• Sealed Electronics
• Reverse Polarity protection
• Built in check valve
• Built in Anti-Siphon Valve (Positive shut-off)
• UL Certified
• ELV Compliant
• 1.6 amp average
• Self Priming and Self Regulating
• 18 ounces and 3 inches
• Corrosion Resistant over 100 hours of salt spray
•Operating Tempearture Range: -40F to 180F

fuel filter http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/facetpumps3.php?clickkey=93726

I stand corrected the inlet and outlet is 1/8 " internal pipe thread not 1/4"



This is the Posi - flo Information:

http://www.facet-purolator.com/posi-flo-pumps.php
http://www.facet-purolator.com/POSI-FLO%20flyer%202011.pdf
I see a check valve but no positive shut off valve ?

George:  adding to the pile    

[Pat Conlon]

Gotta have a positive fuel shut off....gotta  
Don't rely on the float needles to hold back 5.5 gallons of fuel.

I like the large filter area of the oem fuel filters. I want to see if I have room for that under the side cover.
I suspect that I do, due to the removal of the oem air box and the use of UniPods.
Perhaps a longer fuel hose where I can pull the filter can out from the side?
A longer fuel hose would allow a simple bypass of the filter and pump in the event of pump failure.

George, 1/8" inlet/outlet seems rather small....? I know they are rated on flow...but still...

[movenon]

That "positive shut off valve" might just be related to the anti sipon function... If so then that is not to important in the FJ as the tank is higher than the pump.

Here is the list of pumps and spec's from Facet.

http://www.facet-purolator.com/cat_part_finder.php

And yes, the valve might be the latest in medical devices........ Might be a bit bulky and painful to install..... And then the 12v battery problem.
What's the line from "The 12 volt Man" "don't need no credit card, just a Die Hard"......
George

[movenon]

Gotta have a positive fuel shut off....gotta  
Don't rely on the float needles to hold back 5.5 gallons of fuel.

I like the large filter area of the oem fuel filters. I want to see if I have room for that under the side cover.
I suspect that I do, due to the removal of the oem air box and the use of UniPods.
Perhaps a longer fuel hose where I can pull the filter can out from the side?
A longer fuel hose would allow a simple bypass of the filter and pump in the event of pump failure.

Now the wheels are a turning......
George

[Sabre093]

This is a great and safe mod to do ...with a clear filter mounted in a easy  safe place it will show us if we have contaiminents