Confession of an old fart

[StatDoc]

Ok - a number of years ago I had a bad crash - hit a ground hog going around a corner at about 75MPH - saved it - only to have the front tire blow off the rim - went into tank slaps and did, for lack of a better term, a "superman" over the bars.  The bike (XS750 tripple with full bags) bounced along behind me and landed on me - I staggered away with a fractured femur thanks to a helmet and full leathers.  Fast forward to last spring - bought another bike - a VStar 650 (seemed a gentle bike) - got spooked by the lack of front end feel - traded it for my FJ1100 - no real improvement.  As I'm riding, rather than enjoying the corners or speed I feel more like I'm, for lack of a better term, trying "not to crash" - perhaps it's over analysis on my part (I have a BS in Psychology, a BS in math, an MS in computer science and a PhD in statistics - I tend to be a bit grounded in analysis) - anyhow - any suggestions?  I'd recall the joy I felt while riding before my crash (wasn't my only crash ever - just the worst) but I just seem "stuck" on "not crashing" rather than riding - all suggestions considered and appreciated.
If I can't get a handle on this perhaps I'll sell the FJ and get a more harsh coach - like a Kawasaki 750CC 2 stroke ....

thanks

Steve

[tmkaos]

I know that a big part of whether or not I enjoy any ride is the level of confidence I feel in my riding ability on that particular day - if I've been off the bike for a while it takes a hour or so to settle back in.. I'm wondering maybe some advanced rider training days might help get your mind off the crashing bit and back in the groove.. I've done one and I found it hugely helpful, focusses you on what you are doing right, not wrong..

My 2 cents anyway..

Hope you find a way past it 

James

[Flyover Country Joe]

Steve,
Good advice from James. If you become more aware of what you bike is trying to tell you, and how interpret that feedback, I think you will enjoy riding more. I would recommend getting a copy of "Total Control" by Lee Parks, I found mine on Amazon for about $20.00. Get familiar with Lee's coaching style and philosophy and try to get to a Total Control school near you. They have one scheduled in Nashville, TN next spring, I'm making every effort to get to it. If you are anywhere near a track school, that would be well worth looking into as well. BTW, on that 750 Kawasaki, sometimes even when you do everything thing right.........
                                                                                          Joe 

[terryk]

This seems natural to me. Some people just take a little more time to adjust. It will get better with practice.

[SkyFive]

Lack of confidence in your ability is a dangerous thing and too much confidence is just as dangerous. I have a moderate level of confidence and riding ability so I try to ride in middle of those parameters, mixed with a high level of caution or defensive riding. I'm always watching for something to jump out in front of me. Is this a phobia?
Anyhow, motorcycles are inherently dangerous, so you manage your risks as best you can and even this is not enough sometimes.

[Pat Conlon]

....Fast forward to last spring - bought another bike - a VStar 650 (seemed a gentle bike) - got spooked by the lack of front end feel - traded it for my FJ1100 - no real improvement.....

Something is wrong. To compare the front end feel between a VStar cruiser and your FJ1100 means,
1)  Your perception is flawed
2)  Your FJ1100 needs some suspension work.
3)  A combination of the above.

So Let's try and narrow it down.
1) Since your accident have you ridden *any* motorcycle which gives you the desired level of comfort on front end feedback?
Hint: It will absolutely not be the Flexi-Flyer Kawasaki 750 H2. That had to be a PhD's attempt at a joke.

 If you have ridden other motorcycles and;
a) You *have* found a bike you are comfortable with (what bike was it?) Conclusion: Your FJ is the culprit.
b) You *have not* found a bike you are comfortable with..................... Conclusion: Your perception is flawed (or you rode some dogs)

2) If you have not ridden any other bike since your accident (besides your FJ) You need to do so.

To be sure, you need to ride a properly set up FJ. I am not saying that your bike is not properly set up.
A FJ with the front end conversion 3.5" wide rim, modern 120/70-17 radial rubber, proper forks springs, proper sag settings and cartridge emulators will blow away the soft oem front end set up. A night and day difference. Then factor in some R-1 brakes on top of that.
Strangely enough, for a real improvement on the FJ's front end feel/feedback, it has nothing at all to do with the FJ's front end.
It's installing an adjustable rear shock (or shorter dogbones on the '89+) Getting the rear end raised up and placing more weight on the front tire enhances turn in and feel. This works well with the oem 16" 120/80 bias ply donut and it works even better with a modern sticky radial tires.

Perhaps it's all in your head and your FJ is just fine.

Here's where I'm coming from: 4 months ago I had a minor low side accident. Happened on a beautiful day, tires warm, bike singing, leaned over in a corner, and the front tire hit a patch of sand and whammo.....I'm sliding down the highway, face down, with the asphalt grinding away at my face shield like a pissed off belt sander...ATGATT literally saved my hide. A paradox: I was unlucky yet very fortunate.
The guys here really helped me recover. My friend Mark Olson reminded me of the "yips" which would happen when I started riding again and the first time I leaned my bike into a corner.
So I'm riding my blue '92 FJ and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that bike. Cartridge forks, 3.5" rim, sticky Pilot Power radial, the full set up.
Yet when I lean her over in a corner something does not feel right.,,,It's the yips Mark warned me about.
It's all in my head. It will just take time and practice for me to regain confidence and trust the bike like I used to... Hope this helps. Pat

[andyb]

Honestly, the biggest change to sharpen and improve feel through the front end is going to be a good, racy tire, with an aggressive profile.  Which isn't available for the FJ's antique rims.

Definitely you need to ride some other machines and see if they're better for you, as a semi-sporty bike and a cruiser shouldn't feel anything close to each other in terms of feedback and grip.  Saying that makes me think that most likely, it's you, not the machine.  And that's okay, you're mentally fixable with a little training and trust games with your bike.

Rather than convert the front end to YZF600 spec, I'd suggest converting the entire bike, and probably to something that fits you as well as possible.  Something that you know has vastly more grip than you'll ever be able to use, so that you can learn to trust it.  Then come back to the heavier machine once you've built your confidence back up.

Pat's right about having the yips.  And they're very hard to shake without a ton of practice, and equipment that you have absolute faith in (be it a putter or a bike!).  After throwing a bike against a curb and demolishing my shoulder, I found it very, very difficult to take corners with any sort of vigor for a long time.  Putting ultrasticky street rubber on that bike helped me trust it again, and then it just was a matter of working to trusting myself again, a little more each ride--but to this day, I prize tires that stick even when cold.  What you're describing is the feeling I get when I ride someone else's bike, a constant stream of "don't crash!" rather than enjoyment.

[JMR]

....Fast forward to last spring - bought another bike - a VStar 650 (seemed a gentle bike) - got spooked by the lack of front end feel - traded it for my FJ1100 - no real improvement.....

Something is wrong. To compare the front end feel between a VStar cruiser and your FJ1100 means,
1)  Your perception is flawed
2)  Your FJ1100 needs some suspension work.  3)  A combination of the above.

So Let's try and narrow it down.
1) Since your accident have you ridden *any* motorcycle which gives you the desired level of comfort on front end feedback?
Hint: It will absolutely not be the Flexi-Flyer Kawasaki 750 H2. That had to be a PhD's attempt at a joke.

 If you have ridden other motorcycles and;
a) You *have* found a bike you are comfortable with (what bike was it?) Conclusion: Your FJ is the culprit.
b) You *have not* found a bike you are comfortable with..................... Conclusion: Your perception is flawed (or you rode some dogs)

2) If you have not ridden any other bike since your accident (besides your FJ) You need to do so.

To be sure, you need to ride a properly set up FJ. I am not saying that your bike is not properly set up.
A FJ with the front end conversion 3.5" wide rim, modern 120/70-17 radial rubber, proper forks springs, proper sag settings and cartridge emulators will blow away the soft oem front end set up. A night and day difference. Then factor in some R-1 brakes on top of that.
Strangely enough, for a real improvement on the FJ's front end feel/feedback, it has nothing at all to do with the FJ's front end.
It's installing an adjustable rear shock (or shorter dogbones on the '89+) Getting the rear end raised up and placing more weight on the front tire enhances turn in and feel. This works even well with the oem 16" 120/80 bias ply donut and it works even better with a modern sticky radial tires.

Perhaps it's all in your head and your FJ is just fine.

Here's where I'm coming from: 4 months ago I had a minor low side accident. Happened on a beautiful day, tires warm, bike singing, leaned over in a corner, and the front tire hit a patch of sand and whammo.....I'm sliding down the highway, face down, with the asphalt grinding away at my face shield like a pissed off belt sander...ATGATT literally saved my hide. A paradox: I was unlucky yet very fortunate.
The guys here really helped me recover. My friend Mark Olsen reminded me of the "yips" which would happen when I started riding again and the first time I leaned my bike into a corner.
So I'm riding my blue '92 FJ and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that bike. Cartridge forks, 3.5" rim, sticky Pilot Power radial, the full set up.
Yet when I lean her over in a corner something does not feel right.,,,It's the yips Mark warned me about.
It's all in my head. It will just take time and practice for me to regain confidence and trust the bike like I used to... Hope this helps. Pat

My thought exactly. There is a real possibility that the fork oil has never even been changed.

[Flyover Country Joe]

JMR,
That too! I was amazed how much more planted that my FJ felt just from installing new bushings and fork oil. And now I know how much difference the right fork springs, Gold Valves, and rear shock all make! So much to buy......

[Mark Olson]

Ok - a number of years ago I had a bad crash - hit a ground hog going around a corner at about 75MPH - saved it - only to have the front tire blow off the rim - went into tank slaps and did, for lack of a better term, a "superman" over the bars.  The bike (XS750 tripple with full bags) bounced along behind me and landed on me - I staggered away with a fractured femur thanks to a helmet and full leathers.  Fast forward to last spring - bought another bike - a VStar 650 (seemed a gentle bike) - got spooked by the lack of front end feel - traded it for my FJ1100 - no real improvement.  As I'm riding, rather than enjoying the corners or speed I feel more like I'm, for lack of a better term, trying "not to crash" - perhaps it's over analysis on my part (I have a BS in Psychology, a BS in math, an MS in computer science and a PhD in statistics - I tend to be a bit grounded in analysis) - anyhow - any suggestions?  I'd recall the joy I felt while riding before my crash (wasn't my only crash ever - just the worst) but I just seem "stuck" on "not crashing" rather than riding - all suggestions considered and appreciated.
If I can't get a handle on this perhaps I'll sell the FJ and get a more harsh coach - like a Kawasaki 750CC 2 stroke ....

thanks

Steve

Wheew Steve , lets see , Ya got your BS=bullshit, and MS=more shit,and PHD=piled high and deep.  you are neck deep my friend.

If you do not feel comfortable on your fj , your head is in the way.

A simple way to overcome this is to get a new motorcycle with anti-lock brakes and traction control and one piece race suit and go do some track days.

A more better way is to modify your fj so it becomes part of you.

put some 89 forks on it with emulators and springs and a 17" front wheel and you will have a very planted front end.  3-400 bucks including tire.

just changing your fork oil will do wonders.

read this book and apply it.    sport riding techniques , by Nick Ienatsch who is also the author of "the pace" and "ridecraft".
this will feed your head.

very simply , get out and ride and shake the  .

see if there is a fj riding buddy out there to get ya thru it.  some times it helps to see what a fj can do.

movie Quote: "so you are a bullshit artist. Did you try to bullshit today?"

[craigo]

It may just be as simple as the air pressure in your tires, or, if you ride alone.

The tire pressure is so important as to how the bike feels.  When the pressure is low, it just wants to drop into corners, and both ends feel so vague.

Riding alone causes me some worry here in SoCal.  You go off the road here, no one will find you for a long time.  That little nagging voice worries me to no end going fast around blind corners, causing bad braking points and unsteady handling.

Thing is, I know it's not the bike.  It's me.

When I am riding with others, my riding greatly improves.  When I ride alone, I ride over cautious. 

Take care,

CraigO

[rktmanfj]

Riding alone causes me some worry here in SoCal.  You go off the road here, no one will find you for a long time.  That little nagging voice worries me to no end going fast around blind corners, causing bad braking points and unsteady handling.
CraigO

One of these might be for you, then.

http://www.findmespot.com/en/

Garth's seems to work pretty well.

They may not look for you right away if you couldn't get to the button, but at least they'd know where to find you when they did look.

[terryk]

+1 on the find me device. SoCal, yeah, run off a road and fall into a canyon, deep trouble indeed. Pretty rare event happily.

[StatDoc]

movie Quote: "so you are a bullshit artist. Did you try to bullshit today?"

I've got two words for you - second one is "you" - see if your californicated brain can figure out the first.

[Pat Conlon]

I've got two words for you....

I've got two words back at 'cha...You're welcome.