clutch master cylinder

[ozzstar]

I recently rebuilt the clutch master cylinder on my '86 FJ.  The slave cylinder has also been rebuilt.  My question is it seems that it takes more than normal pressure to squeeze the lever to release the clutch.  The bike has been sitting for about 13 years.  I'm not sure that the clutch itself is dry and stiff?? Is this at all possible? The lever moves freely but takes some effort to squeeze completely.

I have not been able to start the bike yet (13 years) because i'm waiting on carb parts, and decided to get the clutch system operational in the meantime.

I did manually put the transmission in gear and pull in the clutch hand lever and get the rear wheel to spin by hand.  So the clutch disks are releasing.   

The clutch master cylinder is leaking when i squeeze the lever in and i'm wondering if it is from using so too much pressure to get the clutch to release?  I even took the clutch master cylinder apart a second time and everything was clean and none of the seals were damaged.  Also the cylinder bore has no scratches, nicks or pits.

Thanks

Ozz

[rktmanfj]

The clutch itself rides in an oil bath.

Could someone have done the double spring mod or a coil spring conversion on it?

If the m/c is leaking, something is wrong there.  Perhaps the pushrod seal on backwards, etc.

It's been a while since I rebuilt mine, but IIRC it's possible.

Randy T
Indy

[andyb]

The clutch master should not leak even against a rather lot of pressure.  Rebuild/replace/modify with something else time.

[ozzstar]

The clutch itself rides in an oil bath.

Could someone have done the double spring mod or a coil spring conversion on it?

If the m/c is leaking, something is wrong there.  Perhaps the pushrod seal on backwards, etc.

It's been a while since I rebuilt mine, but IIRC it's possible.

Randy T
Indy

[ozzstar]

I suppose someone could have modified or replaced the springs but not sure.  What is the easiest way to check that?

I just did the clutch master/cyl rebuild the other day with a product from K&L.  It came without any instructions so i went by what i took out of the bore. 

Maybe someone can tell me which way the seal is supposed to face? Looking down into the cylinder i installed the seal so that the 'lip' was facing down.  The 'solid' part of the seal was facing the top of the piston out towards me. 

Thanks,

Ozz

[Arnie]

Glen,

That's right.

Arnie

[ozzstar]

The push rod that has the dust boot over it has a 'LONG' side and a 'SHORT' side.

Reassembling all the parts I installed the pin with the small spring on the short side, facing in towards the piston/seal.  So the long part of the push rod goes into the brass lever bushing with the retainer hole.

Is this correct? I want to make sure i got it all right.

Just to see what happens i put the old seal/piston in and it leaks just as bad as the new rebuild kit.  Both seals seem to sit tightly inside the bore, but they both leak.  There is absolutely no damage to the cylinder bore.  Could i have gotten a bad seal?? Looking at it there is nothing wrong, i have no freakin clue what is wrong here.

Ozz

[Harvy]

I couldn't remember which way it went in either......have a look at the parts catalog..... http://www.yamaha-motor.com/sport/myyamaha/prompt/L3Nwb3J0L3BhcnRzL2hvbWUuYXNweA==/Parts%20Catalog/starthere.aspx.

Looks like it goes in the other way around to me.

Harvy

[ozzstar]

I couldn't remember which way it went in either......have a look at the parts catalog..... http://www.yamaha-motor.com/sport/myyamaha/prompt/L3Nwb3J0L3BhcnRzL2hvbWUuYXNweA==/Parts%20Catalog/starthere.aspx.

Looks like it goes in the other way around to me.

I tried installing it the way it shows in the parts diagram but it just didn't seem right.  When i went to install the lever it really wouldn't fit.  Thats why i was having some confusion.

Not sure why the rebuild kit didn't solve the leak problem.  Which reminds me...

When i removed the slave cylinder and took out the clutch pushrod i never saw that 'tiny' ball on the end.  Its shown in the parts diagram.  Does the ball stay in place or did it drop off into the engine???  Now i'm concerened.

Anyway to know?

Thanks

Ozz

[Harvy]

Ozz, that ball may or may not stick to the end of the pushrod. only way I know to get it if it doesn't come out of its own accord is to start the bike with the slave removed.......be careful though.......it will shoot across the garage floor and disappear behind that pile of junk in the corner, never to be seen again, quickly followed by a bucket of oil!........

It can't fall into the engine as far as I am aware.

If its not there, the pushrod will obviously sit further into its hole, and the clutch in all likelyhood will not disengage at all.

Harvy

[ozzstar]

Ozz, that ball may or may not stick to the end of the pushrod. only way I know to get it if it doesn't come out of its own accord is to start the bike with the slave removed.......be careful though.......it will shoot across the garage floor and disappear behind that pile of junk in the corner, never to be seen again, quickly followed by a bucket of oil!........

It can't fall into the engine as far as I am aware.

If its not there, the pushrod will obviously sit further into its hole, and the clutch in all likelyhood will not disengage at all.

Harvy


Thanks for the info Harvy.  Since i never saw the ball then i'll assume its still in there. I can get the clutch to dissengage.   Just glad to know it can't drop into the engine case on its own.

Ozz

[RichBaker]

Ozz, that ball may or may not stick to the end of the pushrod. only way I know to get it if it doesn't come out of its own accord is to start the bike with the slave removed.......be careful though.......it will shoot across the garage floor and disappear behind that pile of junk in the corner, never to be seen again, quickly followed by a bucket of oil!........

It can't fall into the engine as far as I am aware.

If its not there, the pushrod will obviously sit further into its hole, and the clutch in all likelyhood will not disengage at all.

Harvy

If you remove the pressure plate, the ball can fall into the sump, I've done it. It was pretty easy to find, though.  When I put everything back together after replacing the shifter return spring, I couldn't move the clutch lever. It was SOLID.... I took things back apart and compared what I had to the exploded view and realized the ball wasn't there, so I started looking, found it in the sump under the clutch basket...

[Harvy]

Yes Rich......didn't mention that as Ozz didn't say he was into the clutch side.

While talking clutch.... I recently sold the complete assembly out of my 90 parts bike to a member in Brisbane........ all the steels had tiny indents in them...looked like they had been given a tap with a centre punch over both surfaces..... is this standard? Or maybe a fix to prevent slippage?

The new owner says the clutch is working perfectly with no slip....just wondering?

Harvy

[ozzstar]

[/quote]

If you remove the pressure plate, the ball can fall into the sump, I've done it. It was pretty easy to find, though.  When I put everything back together after replacing the shifter return spring, I couldn't move the clutch lever. It was SOLID.... I took things back apart and compared what I had to the exploded view and realized the ball wasn't there, so I started looking, found it in the sump under the clutch basket...
[/quote]

Thanks, just to see whats going on with the clutch/springs I plan to remove the right side case.  I ordered a new gasket for the cover today from the Yamaha stealer. So your knowledge is well appreciated.

I have been considering purchasing the FJR 1300 clutch master cylinder. I found it online for around $125.  My local stealer wants $190.  Hoping the 14mm bore will work better than the hard to pull leaking stock master.

Ozz

[racerman_27410]

oh yes the FJR master will work quite nicely on the FJ..even with the barnett springs or the doubled up OEM springs.


make sure that price comes with the adjustable lever..... i got mine complete for 150.00 with lever


kookaloo!

Frank