The Germans - Tops???

[FJTillDeath]

So I was reading my local superbike magazine and they were doing a reveiw on the top 5 litre superbikes from 2011. namely the BMW s1000RR, kawasaki zxr1000, honda cbr1000, yamaha yzf r1 and the suzuki gsxr1000. and last year the BMW(unchanged) won the review and yet again it has won the review. I was looking at the specs of the bikes across the board and the bmw definitely looks like the best but since when did germans manufacture bikes better than the japs??

anybody got their own opinions they wanna share or any other light on this topic?

My veiw on the matter I have always been a fan of the n inja and in the reveiw they rate it second to the other bikes, but I still dont understand how BMW functions so well as a sport bike I have always seen them as tourers?

[WestOzXJR]

but since when did germans manufacture bikes better than the japs??

Well I'd be willing to put money on it that BMW will be the first to put direct cylinder head injection on their motorcycle engines and then you won't see which way they went... they're already honing their technical knowledge in this area by doing it on some of their cars...

[axiom-r]

If they would take a second to sort out the traction control on Troy Corser's bike they would have a World Super Bike Title by now.......

They have been tourers and now for the past few years they are creating performance oriented motorcycles...  been a few years not a surprise really.

[WestOzXJR]

If they would take a second to sort out the traction control...

You reckon his bike needs traction control... A couple of months ago someone sent me a link to an article about one of those 1000RR's that was running 380 bhp with 1 bar boost... Now that'd lay down some pretty good skid marks... In more ways than one.

[ribbert]

It used to be said of the Japanese that they are "imitators" not "innovators" and very good they are at it.  For example, every Jap bike manufacturer has being trying unsuccessfully for decades to knock the GS of its perch with copycat models.  Most big Jap sports bikes are models evolved over decades that get tweaked every year  or so to freshen them up with many components shared across the model range.
BMW started with a clean sheet for a whole new bike. No parts bin special dressed up to look sporty.
It may interest you to know that Aus's premier sport/racing magazine had only 2 Jap bikes in its top 10 sports bikes for 2010!

[big r]

I got to test a 1600 gt, the freakin thing was amazing. The power was so smooth and even and for a bike as heavey as this you did not notice it because of the great balance. Had a drag race from a light and the thing just blew my fj away

[Klavdy]

The Sausage Eaters make fine sporting machinery,,,

[Dan Filetti]

It says something that California Superbike school has switched over to using S1000RRs  -makes it pretty darn attractive to spend that $700 for a days' instruction, on one.

Pardon the duplication Klavdy, if that picture is from such a class.

Dan

[ddlewis]

I got to test a 1600 gt, the freakin thing was amazing. The power was so smooth and even and for a bike as heavey as this you did not notice it because of the great balance. Had a drag race from a light and the thing just blew my fj away

I'd like to ride one of those new K1600's, all I hear is how awesome they are. 

A 700# bike with 66" wheel base is not my idea of a sport tourer, but "they" say it's like magic.

[Flynt]

I got to test a 1600 gt, the freakin thing was amazing. The power was so smooth and even and for a bike as heavey as this you did not notice it because of the great balance. Had a drag race from a light and the thing just blew my fj away

I'd like to ride one of those new K1600's, all I hear is how awesome they are. 

A 700# bike with 66" wheel base is not my idea of a sport tourer, but "they" say it's like magic.

Go ride a K13S...  magic is an appropriate description.  The K13S bikes are sport bike fast, deceptively quick for how big they are, and touring comfortable for a few hundred miles at least and with a w/pillion adjustment available through the touch of a button.  I love my FJ for the longer distances (K16GT likely kicks ass here though), the more aggressive tossing (definitely feel the street more than the K13 lets you), and for the attitude of that air cooled four... however, the BMW is a really excellent performing machine and deserves some recognition. 

The S1000RR is a spectacular application of engineering dollars and technology options to produce a dominant package for its segment.  BMW does this fairly routinely and wants to be "the ultimate" machine for the job of driving or riding.  Their M cars have held strong position in multiple segments for years.  They just decided to make a bike with these constraints.  Also interesting is that they didn't try to BMW it up too much (Ohlin's suspension, chain drive, brembo brakes, etc... instead of Duolever/Paralever, shaft drive, BMW brakes, etc...) and they kept the price low...  f'ing great job if you ask me.

I think they set out to enter the high performance segment in early 2000s, then introduced the K12S which was the most powerful mass produced street bike for a couple of years.  The K13S was introduced in '09 to close some gaps in the K12S design and it works quite well.  The S1000RR was their topper and has ruled the class for 2 years.  The '11/12 Japanese bikes are pretty much all new because of it.  Sent them all back to school...  cool move from a marketing perspective.

BTW - I think the S1000RR was chosen for the track schools based on some slick marketing that demonstrated far fewer incidents could be expected due to the RR's advanced traction control, ABS, and built in programs to control the whole thing and keep you on your tires.  A friend has one and says the you really can't get it out of sorts in "rain" mode for example.  There is a body of data apparently that supports how safe these bikes are in high speed situations.

Frank

[Klavdy]

It says something that California Superbike school has switched over to using S1000RRs  -makes it pretty darn attractive to spend that $700 for a days' instruction, on one.

Pardon the duplication Klavdy, if that picture is from such a class.

Dan

Yes mate!
That is from the California Superbike School.
Fluffy and I have done courses there, it's brilliant, the best money I've spent on bike stuff.

[axiom-r]

It used to be said of the Japanese that they are "imitators" not "innovators" and very good they are at it.  For example, every Jap bike manufacturer has being trying unsuccessfully for decades to knock the GS of its perch with copycat models.  Most big Jap sports bikes are models evolved over decades that get tweaked every year  or so to freshen them up with many components shared across the model range.
BMW started with a clean sheet for a whole new bike. No parts bin special dressed up to look sporty.
It may interest you to know that Aus's premier sport/racing magazine had only 2 Jap bikes in its top 10 sports bikes for 2010!

In my mind, BMW had to start on a fresh page because nothing they had made previously was truly sporting. Or should I say nothing that they had could be made competitive for their intention to go racing and subsequently sell sport bikes.

The S1000RR is a spectacular application of engineering dollars and technology options to produce a dominant package for its segment.  BMW does this fairly routinely and wants to be "the ultimate" machine for the job of driving or riding.  Their M cars have held strong position in multiple segments for years.  They just decided to make a bike with these constraints.  Also interesting is that they didn't try to BMW it up too much (Ohlin's suspension, chain drive, brembo brakes, etc... instead of Duolever/Paralever, shaft drive, BMW brakes, etc...) and they kept the price low...  f'ing great job if you ask me.

I think they set out to enter the high performance segment in early 2000s, then introduced the K12S which was the most powerful mass produced street bike for a couple of years.  The K13S was introduced in '09 to close some gaps in the K12S design and it works quite well.  The S1000RR was their topper and has ruled the class for 2 years.  The '11/12 Japanese bikes are pretty much all new because of it.  Sent them all back to school...  cool move from a marketing perspective.

Totally agree Flynt they did a tremendous job.  That they didn't try to "BMW it up" is what allowed it to become a competitive sportbike - shaft drive will simply never be sporty to me. It's still a BMW through and through just not in the tradition of BMW...the clearest departure from the lineage of BMW engineering is far and away the in-line 4 engine, something the Japanese pioneered.  BMW may well have improved on the in-line four concept with the S1000RR's but they are still standing on the decades of development done by the Japanese...

[Dan Filetti]

...the clearest departure from the lineage of BMW engineering is far and away the in-line 4 engine, something the Japanese pioneered. 

Not to quibble with you, but doing away with the dorky two-sided turn signals had to be among the clearest departures...    I had a K75 "Flying Brick" -never did get used to those turn signal controls.

Dan

[Arnie]

BMW has been making inline 4's for many decades.  In BMW bikes, maybe just since the K100s in mid '80s.
And, as for the Japanese pioneering inline 4's.... What about MV Agusta ?  Yes, it was racing only but so were Honda's 4s up unitl 1969.  I also seem to remember that Henderson made inline 4's way back when, too.

Arnie

[WestOzXJR]

BMW has been making inline 4's for many decades.  In BMW bikes, maybe just since the K100s in mid '80s.
And, as for the Japanese pioneering inline 4's.... What about MV Agusta ?  Yes, it was racing only but so were Honda's 4s up unitl 1969.  I also seem to remember that Henderson made inline 4's way back when, too.

Arnie

Yep, and talking about MV, what about their fabulous 1958 500cc transversely mounted v-8 powered motorcycle? What a ball-tearer...

And something else some future "historians" will probably want attribute to Japanese pioneering is the odd-fire big bang crankshaft that was actually originally pioneered (by someone who's name eludes me right now) in a custom made in-line four cylinder, eight inlet port, odd-fire engine he ran and cleaned up with in sidecars back in the 50's.