Off road FJ

[tqmx1]

To my way of thinking, every liberty is an essential liberty.  If you let one liberty be taken away, what's to stop more from being taken?

AMEN!

I've been down and i know exactly what it feels like and what it does to you....i made a decision (yes all by myself) to buy the best/safest riding gear i could and to ride with all the gear all the time ..... even if i'm just going a few miles.

Pain IS real!

KOokaloo!

+1 And you don't have to be going real fast to get REAL HURT. D.A.M.H.I.K. 

I am to a point if I am going someplace with in 10Min. I tale the car (it's quicker)

[SlowOldGuy]

I buy and use gear with a Murphy's Law point of view.

"The more I spend on it, the less likely I am to use it (hopefully!)."

Same reason for a CHL, better to have it and not need it than the other way around.

DavidR.

[TheRadBaron]

As much energy as I've been spending railing against mandatory safety gear, I'm actually not at all against using it.  I will admit that I did a lot of riding without a helmet or any other type of safety gear other than jeans and work boots for a lot of years.  It has nothing to do with "image", I just enjoyed riding more that way.  I went down a few times and beat myself up pretty good a few times, and as it's been said on this thread, as you progress as a rider, proper gear becomes more attractive.
Now that I'm accustomed to riding in a good FF helmet and proper riding jacket, I really like them and wish that I would have made the switch sooner.  Plus, knowing that I'm at least somewhat prepared for a crash, I've been slowly pushing the envelope of my riding past my comfort zone and challenging myself, and becoming a lot better rider.  That being said, I still really enjoy the occasional high-speed ride in jeans and a t-shirt with no helmet.  I understand that I'll probably die in the event of a crash, and I accept and even embrace that.  The closer that you are to the edge, the better the view.
I like good gear, I wear it, and I would encourage others to wear it.  I just just wouldn't nag or lecture them, or tell them that they had to whether they wanted to or not.

[Dan Filetti]

"Common sense" is a very subjective term and really has no bearing on freedom.  Common sense means very different things to different people.  Still, it's interesting that you bring the common sense vs. freedom point up since that very argument is regularly used by legislators to deprive us of our freedoms.

No one is legislating any freedoms away from you.  There is nothing wrong with choosing not to ride with someone you perceive not to have enough common sense to not hurt themselves and/or someone else.  I'll say it again:  If you dress like a squid, I'm not riding with you.  Said another way, wear your gear or ride with someone else.

I have that choice, unless you want a law that forces me to ride with squids?

Just say no, to riding with squids.

Dan

[FJmonkey]

No one is legislating any freedoms away from you.  There is nothing wrong with choosing not to ride with someone you perceive not to have enough common sense to not hurt themselves and/or someone else.  I'll say it again:  If you dress like a squid, I'm not riding with you.  Said another way, wear your gear or ride with someone else.
I have that choice, unless you want a law that forces me to ride with squids?
Just say no, to riding with squids.
Dan

Helmet, gloves, jacket, Jeans....? Were is the Squid line? Not picking on you Dan, just hijacking your post. No offense intended. Until the last two years I rode with jeans as my best pants. I have leather now. I went down with jeans, low speed and the jeans took took all that was dealt to my legs. As a club, should we define proper gear and draw lines? The thread has been riddled with Left, Right and Center on this. I do not think that collectively as a club we are ready to draw and or hold a line. Having been down many times I will strongly offer my personal experience that good gear provides good protection. Better gear provides better protection. Great gear offers the best protection. The quality of gear is not directly related to the cost of the gear. Klavdy pointed out some good boots, he even wore them as footwear on the plane. My limited funds go to protecting my body first, the bike second. Think of protecting you first, the bike second, and looking great last. Getting really busted up in a crash with a cool T-Shirt and flip-flops will not look good after the fact. But as many have said. It is a personal choice.

[rktmanfj]

I buy and use gear with a Murphy's Law point of view.

"The more I spend on it, the less likely I am to use it (hopefully!)."

Same reason for a CHL, better to have it and not need it than the other way around.

DavidR.

[FJmonkey]

Plus, knowing that I'm at least somewhat prepared for a crash, I've been slowly pushing the envelope of my riding past my comfort zone and challenging myself, and becoming a lot better rider.

I can comment on the Superman Effect. I borrowed a friends full race leathers and rode home through the hills. I forgot the Monkey and went Ape!!!! I was bullet proof. Glad I survived, I was mostly past the "Young and Foolish" stage till that moment, I was a kid again with an JF at my beck and call....Full leathers no longer have that same effect...but man O' man, I loved that feeling. The older I get, the faster I was.......

[1tinindian]

As much energy as I've been spending railing against mandatory safety gear, I'm actually not at all against using it.  I will admit that I did a lot of riding without a helmet or any other type of safety gear other than jeans and work boots for a lot of years.  It has nothing to do with "image", I just enjoyed riding more that way.  I went down a few times and beat myself up pretty good a few times, and as it's been said on this thread, as you progress as a rider, proper gear becomes more attractive.
Now that I'm accustomed to riding in a good FF helmet and proper riding jacket, I really like them and wish that I would have made the switch sooner.  Plus, knowing that I'm at least somewhat prepared for a crash, I've been slowly pushing the envelope of my riding past my comfort zone and challenging myself, and becoming a lot better rider.  That being said, I still really enjoy the occasional high-speed ride in jeans and a t-shirt with no helmet.  I understand that I'll probably die in the event of a crash, and I accept and even embrace that.  The closer that you are to the edge, the better the view.
I like good gear, I wear it, and I would encourage others to wear it.  I just just wouldn't nag or lecture them, or tell them that they had to whether they wanted to or not.

From what you have said here, it's as if I could have wrote the very same thing.
I rode for years with no more protection on than a light jacket over my every day clothes.

But since buying my FJ , and riding with my son, I have been more serious about what I wear while I ride, when I ride.
It's for my own safety and comfort, but I'm trying to set a good example for my son, and he has adapted very good riding gear habits, and I'm most proud of him for that.

He NEVER leaves without his helmet, jacket and gloves, but like I said, we are both still working on the footwear, but that too will come.

But on the issue of freedom of choice, I 100% believe that it's up to the individual and no one else. If properly educated on the dangers and risks involved in the hobby of motorcycling, then I think that should be enough.
After all, a licenced rider has had the training, so if he/she is operating within the letter of the law for that riders state, I don't see that it should be anyone else's concern how they are dressed for riding.

I am NOT anti-gear, more pro choice.
Live and let live.
I really don't have any concerns about showing up at a rally either, as I know everyone here just wants everyone to ride safe and not get hurt.

I just feel that we have some people here that think they need to be the safety officer where none is really needed.
Habits, (good or bad), are hard to change, for any of us, but if we are to make a good point to wear the right gear for riding, I think positive reinforcement is what is need here, instead of telling people they are a, (for the lack of a better word),  fool, for not following the generally accepted way to gear up for a ride.
And saying you don't want to ride with someone  based on how they are dressed just sounds stuck up to me.

I have seen both sides of the argument, and can see positives in both points of view, but for myself, I ride with as much  gear as I have, and will continue to add to the collect as time/money permit, but at the same time, I like to know I have the freedom to take a short spin around the block, without having to prepare myself as if I were blasting off for a mission to the moon.

There, I shot my face off well enough on this subject, let the shit-grenades fly!

Leon

[FJmonkey]

There, I shot my face off well enough on this subject, let the shit-grenades fly!
Leon

There is brave lad, knowing we have all been there and done that. Good on ya mate. My first jacket was a joke. It was leather....but quite thin, I thought I was covered properly....The fool I was.

[Dan Filetti]

Helmet, gloves, jacket, Jeans....? Were is the Squid line? 

No offense taken. 

It's subjective, but I know it when I see it.  For instants, most of the knuckleheads that ride the bike I ride, dress and ride/ act like squids.  It's as much attitude as manner of dress; little or no regard for safety, nor respect for the power and speed with witch the machine they ride, can get them in real trouble.  I choose not to take part.  No laws, no legislation.  If more folks were to do that, (opt out of riding with idiots without enough sense to protect themselves) then I suspect there'd be fewer squids.

To your point, by virtue of the fact that I ride a sport bike, some would call me a squid.  In the end, it is a continuum and generally, I think I fall right of center on the squid scale, in terms of the gear I wear, my riding style and the respect I have for the machine, and it's abilities.  People to the right of me would likely call me a Squid, to the left, a pipe and slippers grandpa.  Whatever. 

I see nothing wrong with advocating for, even encouraging folks to be more safety conscious, and backing up that position with opting out of riding with idiots.

[FJmonkey]

I see nothing wrong with advocating for, even encouraging folks to be more safety conscious, and backing up that position with opting out of riding with idiots.

I am with you Dan, I will quote the safety side to as many that will listen, cuz my ass is much better off with the proper gear. I have been down with good gear more often than no gear and I am happy to tell the tale. The cost to fix the bike did not change. My last low side had me late for work, not off work. I may not refuse to ride with others without gear, but they are more likely to sprint off and leave the group. Or they may choose to just enjoy the ride and take less risks and chances of gravity defining moments.. Koookaloooo.

[Dan Filetti]

I just feel that we have some people here that think they need to be the safety officer where none is really needed.
<snip>
And saying you don't want to ride with someone  based on how they are dressed just sounds stuck up to me.

Leon

Indirect jab at me.  Fine.  You can be a prick all you want, Leon.  I'll sleep just fine tonight.  But for the record, safety officers would say "don't do it"  I have not said that.  Not once.  In fact, I've said the opposite, do it if you want, I'm just not going to take part.  Go back and read my posts.

You are of course, welcome to ride with idiots -it's a free country.

Dan  

[SlowOldGuy]

What Dan said!

Stuck up has nothing to do with it.  I'm free to ride with who I choose to.  I just don't want to be there to see a bunch of road rash, or worse. 

I got tired of being the safety nazi of my local group.  One idiot was pissed that he hadn't gotten a knee down yet on his week old CBR1000RR.  I deleted a rant about how stupid I thought he was acting.  The next weekend he planted himself into the grill of an F-150.  I felt far sorrier for the poor guy in the truck than the dickhead that was too stupid to ride within his limits.

Probably has nothing to do with safety gear, but I find that safe gear and safe riding are usually related.

DavidR.

[1tinindian]

I just feel that we have some people here that think they need to be the safety officer where none is really needed.
<snip>
And saying you don't want to ride with someone  based on how they are dressed just sounds stuck up to me.

Leon

Indirect jab at me.  Fine.  You can be a prick all you want, Leon.  I'll sleep just fine tonight.  But for the record, safety officers would say "don't do it"  I have not said that.  Not once.  In fact, I've said the opposite, do it if you want, I'm just not going to take part.  Go back and read my posts.

You are of course, welcome to ride with idiots -it's a free country.

Dan   

I see, so now I'm a prick for speaking my mind, no different than you speaking yours?
Why don't you get off your high horse, buy an FJ, and stop trying so hard to look like the hero here. I'm not impressed!

You could go back and read my last post and see it as the positive message it was meant to be, but I doubt you are as interested in that, as you are in trying to figure out some "hidden" meaning to it.

[Kopfjaeger]

As I said, I meant no disrespect I was just merely curious. TheRedBaron, Interesting view, I can understand where your coming from but in a different aspect,and as i have stated yes , wear what you want. I wear my safety gear, tho more often than not work pants boots and jacket FF helmet, 15 Min ride to work. Going out will be full gear ( need new Boots!!).. I started to wear jacket when i got my 750 on my P's, figured I'm taller, if I look the part the police wont bug me. Don't know if it worked I never got booked so.... But having come off a DT175 flat in 3rd with no brakes.. was wearing 3/4 pants and jeans over the top, rugby jersey  and FF helmet and boots. Lost skin from fore arms palms of hands  ribs and both knees and hips. I figure that its not a "safety officer" issue, we all would hate to see someone come off and really scrape 'em selves off clean of pink...and as we all have had an acco or two it seems..