Gasoline (not price of)

[andyb]

To a degree, all air cooled motors struggle when there is no air flow, Harleys are the worst, a BMW boxer twin probably the best....

One could argue that the Ariel square four was worse than the Harley.

How did the Porsche 930's deal with it?  Great big fan?

[mikeholzer]

Hey, Speaking of Iowa, guess where I live? LOL!

I choose NOT to burn the ethanol fuel because of possible problems with the fuel systems on ANY of my vehicles.
Call it superstition, but I feel better knowing that I'm not using it.
Of course, I know other people use it for everything and have no problems with it.
I don't think there are any problems with the valves that I have ever heard of by using ethanol blended fuels.

If that is all you have to burn, you should be fine, but as of now, I still have a choice, so I don't use it, even though it is a little cheaper.

Leon, how is it that you in Iowa get a choice? Here to the north of you we are mandated to 10% year round.

You see, back in the late 1980's the state of Minnesota decided that we had a pollution problem. The solution, they thought at the time, was to spend millions of dollars to build about a dozen "Emissions Testing Stations" in the Twin Cities Metro area and a few in Duluth (the two areas with the most serious polloution issues). They then paid an outside contractor to run the whole thing and thereby gouge the motorist $5.00 per car for a "Testing Fee".

The test was a joke, really. As you lived here at that time, I'm sure you recall the procedure. They opened your fuel cap to verify that the flow inlet restrictor was still present (since up until about 1987 one could still buy leaded gas for about $.10 cheaper per gallon) by jamming a piece of PVC pipe in there. Then they took a shoe mirror to peek at the underside of your car to verify if the catalytic converter was still there. Finally, they shoved a probe up your tailpipe (literally and figuratively, I guess) to see whether you stunk. It was all a farce really; at the end of the first year they determined that the perceived pollution level was still higher in the winter.

It was at that time that the State of Minnesota mandated the seasonal use of "oxygenated" fuel to lower emissions. The first season of that was brutal! The ethanol managed to clean up some of the accumulated crud in the local fuel network, and you couldn't find clean fuel in the metro area. As an interesting footnote to the whole thing, the state ultimately cancelled the whole program in 1997, having determined (2) things:

• That the emission test failure rate was virtually nil after the first year. They determined that they must have removed the serious emissions violators from the streets.
• That if they mandated year round use of ethanol added fuels, that it would supposedly improve both the environment and the economy (as we grow corn here, too).

The end result here is that every pump in the state dispenses a 90%-10% ethanol blend. The only exceptions are at some fuel stations near larger lakes where non-oxygenated fuel is available for off-road use. Interestingly, the state sold off their emissions testing stations at silent auction for about 20% of the cost it took to build them. Who wouldn't love to own a extra-wide double deep six bay shop with offices for about $50k?

I'm just saying, Leon: you're pretty damned lucky to have a choice.

[1tinindian]

I remember the testing Mike, what a joke!
I even went as far as to registering one of my cars back in Iowa to get around the testing.
(car had a modified exhaust that I was not willing to change)

An my other car ran like crap during the winter months, and it was all due to the fuel.
The asses at Main Motors were no help at all!
Can't really say that I miss living up there!

I'll snap a picture at the pumps tonight when I fill the car up, so I'm not talking outa my ass about it.

[RichBaker]

I choose NOT to burn the ethanol fuel

But Leon, The Corn! You have to support the corn! What else would we do with it all?

   

[Travis398]

Reading this didn't make my day, but it seems to explain a lot of the FJ running/starting issues people keep complaining about.

REASONS WHY ETHANOL BLENDED PETROL IS NOT RECOMMENDED FOR USE IN SOME OLDER VEHICLES

Introduction

The following information outlines the key reasons why vehicle manufacturers do not recommend the use of any ethanol/petrol blended fuels in vehicles made before 1986. This information is also applicable to post-1986 vehicles listed as unsuitable to use ethanol blended petrol.

Ethanol has a number of important chemical and physical properties that need to be considered in a vehicle's design.

Carburettor Equipped Engines

Vehicles made before 1986 vehicles were predominantly equipped with carburettors and steel fuel tanks.

The use of ethanol blended petrol in engines impacts the air/fuel ratio because of the additional oxygen molecules within the ethanol's chemical structure.

Vehicles with carburettor fuel systems may experience hot fuel handling concerns. This is because the vapour pressure of fuel with ethanol will be greater (if the base fuel is not chemically adjusted) and probability of vapour lock or hot restartability problems will be increased.

As a solvent, ethanol attacks both the metallic and rubber based fuels lines, and other fuel system components.

Ethanol also has an affinity to water that can result in corrosion of fuel tanks and fuel lines. Rust resulting from this corrosion can ultimately block the fuel supply rendering the engine inoperable.

[1tinindian]

I remember the testing Mike, what a joke!
I even went as far as to registering one of my cars back in Iowa to get around the testing.
(car had a modified exhaust that I was not willing to change)

An my other car ran like crap during the winter months, and it was all due to the fuel.
The asses at Main Motors were no help at all!
Can't really say that I miss living up there!

I'll snap a picture at the pumps tonight when I fill the car up, so I'm not talking outa my ass about it.

Here is that picture I promised.
The 87 is .10 cents higher than the 89 ethanol.

Like I said before, I'll not use ethanol until it's the only fuel availible in my area.

[dbelch]

amazing..thanks for the info and photo's..I'll have to have a closer look at our pumps here in Ontario to see exactly what our options are..should I expect any running differences if I chose to fill-up with the 91 octane non-ethenol, besides a lighter wallet.  (golly, I filled her up today with regular 10% ethenol with the fuel light on and the reserve switched on..cost $24 good Canadian bucks..which would be approximently equal to $25.20 George Washingtons)

Sure is fun blowing that out the tail pipes tho