Wanted to buy- OEM clutch spring or Barnett spring conversion

[momodasaint]

Hello everyone,  hope everyone is doin great.     Im still getting around on my 2000 XJR1300 SP.    I recenty took it to Pro-Cycle Dyno and gt a reading of 116 HP however the reading was not its full potential as the clutch started to slip on the dyno.   We simply could not get the clutch to slip on the road, but on the dyno under full load in fifth gear it would slip therefore not giving an accurate measuement.    So I am looking at doubling up the OEM spring or perhaps getting the Barnett coil spring conversion if someone has a spare....??
I have just put my seven new wide fibre plates in oil bath, so I'm on the hunt for anyones extra springs getting around. Happy to reward with some cash and some pure raw honey from my beehives.

Im currently in Chermside area of Brisbane QLD.

Thanks,     Steve/Bender

[Tuned forks]

Steve, my FJ would slip under Kookaloo situations.  That seventh clutch disc and one, new Yamaha spring solved the slippage issue.  Food for thought.

Joe

[momodasaint]

Hey Joe,  I have the seven discs currently sitting in oil overnight, I ordered the extra spring but its on backorder out of japan.   So Im looking for a local with an extra spring if possible.

[Sparky84]

Sort of Local, Steve

I do have the Barnett coil spring but haven't yet fitted it yet and in no rush at present, it was for a FJ1100 but I'm sure it's the same.

Cheers
Alan

[ribbert]

Hey Joe,  I have the seven discs currently sitting in oil overnight, I ordered the extra spring but its on backorder out of japan.   So Im looking for a local with an extra spring if possible.

With a standard motor, one spring is enough, even your old one is probably enough.

Put it back together and ride it. If you still want to add another spring at some point, it's only a clutch cover gasket and if you're careful, not even that.

These clutches' didn't slip from the factory with only a single spring nor did they for many, many tens of thousands of miles following. The clutch life of an FJ /XJR is no shorter than any other comparable bike. As Joe said, one is enough.

A clutch is a consumeable and when they wear out (slip) you replace the worn out parts (the fibre plates) with new ones, you do not need to re-engineer it with modified parts to get it to work as it did previously. Yamaha made a perfectly good clutch with a nice light pull with enough bite to handle all the power the engine could throw at it.


Noel

[ribbert]

......I have the seven discs currently sitting in oil overnight...........

This has been the subject of much discussion recently, anyone game to hazard a guess as to why this practice is so common.


Noel

[Flynt]

Hey Joe,  I have the seven discs currently sitting in oil overnight, I ordered the extra spring but its on backorder out of japan.   So Im looking for a local with an extra spring if possible.

With a standard motor, one spring is enough, even your old one is probably enough.

Put it back together and ride it. If you still want to add another spring at some point, it's only a clutch cover gasket and if you're careful, not even that.

These clutches' didn't slip from the factory with only a single spring nor did they for many, many tens of thousands of miles following. The clutch life of an FJ /XJR is no shorter than any other comparable bike. As Joe said, one is enough.

A clutch is a consumeable and when they wear out (slip) you replace the worn out parts (the fibre plates) with new ones, you do not need to re-engineer it with modified parts to get it to work as it did previously. Yamaha made a perfectly good clutch with a nice light pull with enough bite to handle all the power the engine could throw at it.


Noel

Should be noted this is one man's opinion.  I personally have had 2 very stock FJs ('84 and '89) with ~8K miles on the clock slip their stock clutches at 6K rpm...  second spring fixed it, but I could have tried replacing all the barely worn discs and one spring might have worked...  my opinion is the second spring is needed, especially on the heavier FJs, to compensate for a marginal clutch design.

Frank

[RPM - Robert]

Hey Joe,  I have the seven discs currently sitting in oil overnight, I ordered the extra spring but its on backorder out of japan.   So Im looking for a local with an extra spring if possible.

We have hundreds in stock and we ship world wide daily

Yamaha Clutch Spring

[ribbert]

......I have the seven discs currently sitting in oil overnight...........

This has been the subject of much discussion recently, anyone game to hazard a guess as to why this practice is so common.


Noel

I see no one wants to have a crack at this. C'mon, I promise I won't respond, it would just be good to get a few opinions.

Noel

[ribbert]

Should be noted this is one man's opinion.  I personally have had 2 very stock FJs ('84 and '89) with ~8K miles on the clock slip their stock clutches at 6K rpm...  second spring fixed it, but I could have tried replacing all the barely worn discs and one spring might have worked...  my opinion is the second spring is needed, especially on the heavier FJs, to compensate for a marginal clutch design.

Frank

Frank, with all due respect it is you who has offered one man's opinion. What I passed on was the opinion of the motorcycle dealer and repair industry. The fact that my own experience falls in line with that is irrelevant and I would never be so bold as to make such a sweeping claim from my experience alone nor do I need to.

Your first FJ was second hand and came with a slipping clutch (previous treatment unknown)
Your second makes 160 rwhp which exceeds what could be reasonably expected of standard clutch.
Your third you had Randy fit a double spring just to make it feel right!

.... I doubled the clutch spring on the '84 just to make it feel "right". 
Frank

I see no evidence of a weak clutch trend here.

Anyway Frank, in hindsight I should never have posted on this subject on this forum, I had forgotten just how vigorously the status quo is defended here.  After reading a few old posts and re acquainting myself with this I thought it best to delete it but was too late.











Noel

[momodasaint]

I just wanted to let everyone know I have tracked down an OEM spring locally.
I rode the bike today with the seven wide discs, no clutch slip but it wouldn't slip on the road with previous stock setup anyways. The true test would need to go back on the Dyno and see if it slips in fifth under full load again.

[Flynt]

I had forgotten just how vigorously the status quo is defended here.

huh?  I'm just saying that if your clutch slips and you want it to stop, adding a second spring is a proven way to do it...  or you can try to get the clutch back to design specifications and maybe that will work too...  I don't know.  

I have experience with the second spring path and know it works.  I'd also offer that the suggestion to add the second spring came from Randy and his experience with getting FJ clutches not to slip.  As long as your grip isn't a limitation, a second spring is a cheap and effective way to get your FJ clutch to stop slipping...  that's my only point.

btw - '84 got second spring proactively, but then I was having some trouble getting it to disengage and tried several things concurrent with my street tuning of the carbs... (at this point I had added Unipods and RPM exhaust along with advancing the timing, so technically no longer stock).  The actual problem tuned out to be in the clutch lever assembly, but taking out one of the clutch springs did induce slipping above 6K.  

also - '92 (Wiz) has never slipped the clutch...  it has the wider plate and 2 clutch springs and holds well against a very powerful motor carrying well north of 300 pounds of passengers and gear.  To me this offers strong proof the second spring vastly improves the holding power of the clutch...

Frank

[racerrad8]

......I have the seven discs currently sitting in oil overnight...........

This has been the subject of much discussion recently, anyone game to hazard a guess as to why this practice is so common.

Noel

Sorry, no guessing here, only common fact after working on 1000's of FJ clutch packs in everything from the FJ to the much heavier and 100% more traction area of the race car.

Well, it should be common knowledge that the Yamaha clutch frictions have a cork component embedded in the friction material. The reason the plate should be soaked is to allow the cork time to absorb oil before installation.

The clutch pack is 100% a sling oil lubricated wet system. There is not a direct oil pressure port to lubricate the clutch pack.

So, if the frictions are not soaked, the chance of burning the cork component of the friction disc is almost 100% of occurrence.

Do other friction materials need to be soaked, I don't know. The  aftermarket manufactures installation instructions should be followed.

Should be noted this is one man's opinion.  I personally have had 2 very stock FJs ('84 and '89) with ~8K miles on the clock slip their stock clutches at 6K rpm...  second spring fixed it, but I could have tried replacing all the barely worn discs and one spring might have worked...  my opinion is the second spring is needed, especially on the heavier FJs, to compensate for a marginal clutch design.

Frank

Frank, with all due respect it is you who has offered one man's opinion. What I passed on was the opinion of the motorcycle dealer and repair industry. The fact that my own experience falls in line with that is irrelevant and I would never be so bold as to make such a sweeping claim from my experience alone nor do I need to.

I see no evidence of a weak clutch trend here.

Anyway Frank, in hindsight I should never have posted on this subject on this forum, I had forgotten just how vigorously the status quo is defended here.  After reading a few old posts and re acquainting myself with this I thought it best to delete it but was too late.

Noel

Motorcycle dealer and repair industry...

1) Do you have the dealers opinion in writing to ensure you are quoting them properly? I doubt you do, so all we know it is your one man opinion...
   a) I mean most Yamaha dealers won't even work on the FJ because they are "too old", you think they know what they are talking about when it comes to a 30+ year old bike? (oh wait, your opinion aligns)

2) Repair industry... Again, what are you talking about? Do you have anything is writing as to support the "Repair Industries" position of whether to soak the clutch disc before installation or not?
   Once again, all you have offer to the forum members is one man's opinion...

Now, based on your "own experience", I have to ask, how many Yamaha FJ clutches have you really worked on? I mean seriously, can the number be more than 10 or 20? Just the FJ clutch, not any other clutch.

You have said recently, the clutch is a consumable/wear item...

So, in your FJ clutch experience, which is "inline with the dealer and repair industry" are there any other consumable parts in the clutch that should be replaced?

Please grace us with the knowledge you have, I would also love to hear from the "dealer and repair industry" in writing since you are quoting their "opinion"...

Just like the ol' saving, "pictures or it didn't happen". Well, without the written opinions you have quoted, you have only offer your opinion.

While I offer my opinion, I am an expert in the FJ engine. Just in case some forum members do not know, I built my first FJ engine back in 1996 and I have been building them ever since. In the years of 2000-2008 I was building 30-40 engines a year. Plus I was working on many more on top of the builds. While the engine building has slowed, I have built three this year I just sent the latest one out the door a couple of weeks ago. The next one is out of the bike and ready for tear down.

So, I am 100% confident to offer my "Expert Opinion" to all of the forum members based on more than twenty years of building and working on this specific engine.

I doubt you will respond...

But I will anxiously await the answers to my questions above. (There is four questions above) The collective of the forum could benefit you our opinion too, even though it is "One man's opinion".

Randy - RPM