Black Widow Products

[FJ1200W]

This arrived from across the pond in 5 days, for a lot less money than I expected -



Quality appears great - even came with all gaskets, clamps and "goodies".

I'm going to try and make time to install and review this weekend.

[aviationfred]

I have been eye balling one of those for awhile. It should reduce some weight from the OEM collector and be a bit less restrictive.


Fred

[giantkiller]

How much? Let us know what you think about fit and also If it sounds any different. I still have the stock collector on the 89.
Thanks for posting

Dan

[TexasDave]

I have been eye balling one of those for awhile. It should reduce some weight from the OEM collector and be a bit less restrictive.


Fred

What is the weight difference and is that made of stainless?

[racerrad8]

... and be a bit less restrictive.

Fred

Actually, I believe it will be more restrictive than the collector box. I'm typing from my phone, so I'll explain later.

Randy - RPM
[/quote]

So, the stock collector box is exactly what it is named, a box. The box does have baffles in it, but nothing is inside to restrict the exhaust flow. I think they are there more to prevent the box from expanding in the event of a backfire. All of the header tubes dump into the box and create an equal pressure within. That equal pressure is then is pushed out of both side simultaneously to the mufflers.

With this collector, each side is forced down a specific tube directly to the muffler. Now, the crossover pipe can help equalize the pressures from side to side. But as mentioned by Bezmozek and looking a the photos from this morning, the cross over tube has a smaller hole than the ID of the tube itself. So, now there is a flange on the opposite side where the exhaust is restricted to travel from side to side freely.

This cross over tube is acting more as an expansion joint that a cross over tube.

The higher pressurized exhaust flow is then forced directly to the fully baffled stock muffler which does not flow very well. The sound change is from the exhaust being forced through the mufflers at higher pressures than with the collector box.

Randy - RPM

[Sparky84]

Some say you need their headers for this to work others say they won't fit but they do look nice.

http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=17202.msg173456#msg173456

[Bezmozek]

One question I do have, is that a cross over tube, like the old H pipe used on cars with headers, or is it just a tube there for the mounting tab?

Hopefully you can see an opening where the tube is welded on.

Randy - RPM

There is hole drilled, approx. half diameter of connecting tube on both sides, so it works as H-pipe

[FJ1200W]

How much? Let us know what you think about fit and also If it sounds any different. I still have the stock collector on the 89.
Thanks for posting

Dan

I bought directly from them - $242.69 delivered.

Less than the eBay price, by about the amount of the eBay fee's, imagine that.

[FJ1200W]

Additional pic's















2lb 5.5oz on my scale

Those I've talked with said the sound does change, hopefully that means improves, although I like it as it is.

And I've not heard of any fitment issues, we'll find out this weekend.

Regarding flow, I don't know. Based on how it looks, it sure looks like it is going to flow better than the stock set-up.

If Randy offered one of these made to his specs, I would of bought it from him - American made (hopefully), it should be less expensive (lower shipping, for sure) and of equal quality.

I could not justify $900+ for a full system at this time - especially when it has no performance claims.

Maybe someday someone will post some apples to apples dyno comparisons of difference systems.  

[FJ1100mjk]

2lb 5.5oz on my scale

Those I've talked with said the sound does change, hopefully that means improves, although I like it as it is.

Regarding flow, I don't know. Based on how it looks, it sure looks like it is going to flow better than the stock set-up.

Maybe someday someone will post some apples to apples dyno comparisons of difference systems.  

I don't think that I've really ever seen where an aftermarket exhaust nets more bottem end oomph, or that much of an increase in mid-range gains. Seems like biggest (if you want to call it that sometimes) gains are on the top end. Usually out of the normal, everyday range of riding that most motorcyclists do.

You do most of the time see decent weight loss with an aftermarket system, especially with today's bikes, and of course, the "cool" factor of having an aftermarket system on your bike. Some also come with an increase in sound level, and change of sound itself, which kind of play themselves out with the new owner. They may like it from the git-go, or tire of it after a while. Some even return to OEM.

I can sympathize with you on the cost versus gains too.

[giantkiller]

Yeah for that kind of money I would put it towards buying one of Randy's systems. I just have supertrap slippons on the 89. (I really like the way the duals sound) And thought If it were cheap enough I would get one.

[racerrad8]

I could not justify $900+ for a full system at this time - especially when it has no performance claims.

Maybe someday someone will post some apples to apples dyno comparisons of difference systems.  

Sorry, the dyno was on the planned list of purchases this year, but a different investment came up that I had to take...I bought the building that I had been leasing prior. It was a big step and now I am the landlord with tenants...

So, maybe next year the dyno will be on the purchase list.

But, can we agree there is a horsepower gain just by the fact the RPM exhaust system weighs more than 20 lbs less than the stock system. Unfortunately I will never be able to quantify that horsepower increase since the dyno is a static device.

Randy - RPM

[racerrad8]

... and be a bit less restrictive.

Fred

Actually, I believe it will be more restrictive than the collector box. I'm typing from my phone, so I'll explain later.

Randy - RPM

So, the stock collector box is exactly what it is named, a box. The box does have baffles in it, but nothing is inside to restrict the exhaust flow. I think they are there more to prevent the box from expanding in the event of a backfire. All of the header tubes dump into the box and create an equal pressure within. That equal pressure is then is pushed out of both sides simultaneously to the mufflers.

With this collector, each side is forced down a specific tube directly to the muffler. Now, the crossover pipe can help equalize the pressures from side to side. But as mentioned by Bezmozek and looking at the photos from this morning, the cross over tube has a smaller hole than the ID of the tube itself. So, now there is a flange on the opposite side where the exhaust is restricted to travel from side to side freely.

This cross over tube is acting more as an expansion joint that a cross over tube.

The higher pressurized exhaust flow is then forced directly to the fully baffled stock muffler which does not flow very well. The sound change is from the exhaust being forced through the mufflers at higher pressures than with the collector box.

Randy - RPM

[FJ1200W]

I could not justify $900+ for a full system at this time - especially when it has no performance claims.

Maybe someday someone will post some apples to apples dyno comparisons of difference systems.  

Sorry, the dyno was on the planned list of purchases this year, but a different investment came up that I had to take...I bought the building that I had been leasing prior. It was a big step and now I am the landlord with tenants...

So, maybe next year the dyno will be on the purchase list.

But, can we agree there is a horsepower gain just by the fact the RPM exhaust system weighs more than 20 lbs less than the stock system. Unfortunately I will never be able to quantify that horsepower increase since the dyno is a static device.

Randy - RPM

Sounds like you have again made some smart investments.

I'm not going to agree that just a weight savings does anything to horsepower output, but I don't think that is what you meant.

I'm debating on sending you a motor that I need some work done on (install starter chain and related plus over inspection) or doing it myself. Turn keying it with you would be the easiest way, I'm checking on shipping costs.

Someday I'll order one of your systems. And you might consider developing your own mid-system, I would of gladly paid you nearly the same for something similar.

[FJ1200W]

Yeah for that kind of money I would put it towards buying one of Randy's systems. I just have supertrap slippons on the 89. (I really like the way the duals sound) And thought If it were cheap enough I would get one.

It's easy for me to piss away $300.00 -

Not so much $900.00 -

Especially when the motorcycles only worth $2500 on a good day - with or without it.

I hear you though, thanks for the input