Clutch - how hard or smooth should the gearshift be?

[bwanapete]

Hi,

I'm wondering how hard the gearshift should be on my 1992 FJ - it just clocked 70,000 miles

Into first gear, it jumps, not too much but it seems more than other bikes I have owned. Then up shifting while accelerating you can hear the gears shift and contact pretty hard.

Downshifting is quiet and smoother.

There is no slipping it just seems the clutch needs adjustment. I drained and bled the system so it has fresh fluid.

I guess the place to start is a rebuild kit for the master and slave?

How would I know when the clutch needs replacement? I read on the forum that the springs might need changing out?

Many thanks
Pete

[great white]

My 89 is pretty much the same way.

So is my Venture. Although not as bad as my FJ.

Pretty much every Yamaha I've ever owned has had that clunk into first and a ratchety gearbox.

Even my old RD350/400's were that way.

Come to think of it, so's my 85 V45 Interceptor....

[TexasDave]

My 89 is pretty much the same way.

So is my Venture.

Pretty much every yamaha I've ever owned has had that clunk into first and a ratchety gearbox.

Even my old RD350/400's were that way.....

Agreed. My RD350 also. XS650 is clunky and a little worse than the 84FJ. Hate to say it but the Hardly shifts easier but is still clunky. Best shifter I ever had was a Kawasaki Vulcan. Very smooth and positive shifting with no missed shifts or false neutrals. Sold the Vulcan for the Hardly. Talk about a down grade. RPM's shifter mod did help with quicker more positive shifts on the FJ but still clunky.  Dave

[fj1289]

Hi,

I'm wondering how hard the gearshift should be on my 1992 FJ - it just clocked 70,000 miles

Into first gear, it jumps, not too much but it seems more than other bikes I have owned. Then up shifting while accelerating you can hear the gears shift and contact pretty hard.

Downshifting is quiet and smoother.

There is no slipping it just seems the clutch needs adjustment. I drained and bled the system so it has fresh fluid.

I guess the place to start is a rebuild kit for the master and slave?

How would I know when the clutch needs replacement? I read on the forum that the springs might need changing out?

Many thanks
Pete

What are the other bikes you are comparing to?

I'd simply consider a new slave cylinder and a rebuild kit - install the new one and tear down the old one - IF it's rebuildable, then rebuild it and put it on the shelf.  If it's not rebuildable then put the rebuild kit on the shelf 

[The General]

Is the fluid in the fluid in the master cyl reservoir low? Did you have to top it up? Did the oil change make any difference at all after at least a 100 miles of riding? Is the chain too tight?  If the answers are a "no" to all questions it does sound like the clutch is not disengaging properly which will probly not be a spring prob either (If it`s the stock spring).

If it`s been like it since you first started riding it, might be time to have a run on a mates bike (or vice versa) for a comparison.     

[bwanapete]

Thanks for the pointers and advice -

I'm comparing it to the Yamaha xt 500  and 550's although they do jump into first gear I guess it could be that I'm dealing with an engine twice that size.

I'm going to check the chain tension, thanks for that pointer and will ride it like this for a while and see if it gets worse

The master cylinder seems sound, no dropping of fluid levels and no visible leaks around the hoses and slave.

maybe it is just the Yamaha transmission and a much larger cycle I'm dealing with.

I was worried that I would have to start looking at redoing the clutch but as of now the bike rides fine, just clunky
Thanks to all
Pete

[Pat Conlon]

This is why you need to go to a FJ Rally.

When a gaggle of FJ's are stopped at a signal, it seems most of us have our bikes in neutral (I know we shouldn't but we do. It must be a double spring type deal)

Anyhoo, it's amusing to hear (almost) everyone clunk their bike into first gear as the signal starts it's green cycle.

Clunk, clunk, clunk....

[dayta]

clunk into first comes with the bike for free...

What I have found however is that certain engine oils seem to make shifting a lot easier... like night and day difference.

Make and type seem to be machine specific - so you will need to experiment and find what works for you.

For me its synthetic 15w 50 as we live is a hotter climate... others like different weights and makes.

All I can say is that it is worth the effort trying different weights and types to see what works for you.

When you find the sweet spot.. you will know as apart from first - your gear box will be silky smooth.

good luck.

[TexasDave]

clunk into first comes with the bike for free...

What I have found however is that certain engine oils seem to make shifting a lot easier... like night and day difference.

Make and type seem to be machine specific - so you will need to experiment and find what works for you.

For me its synthetic 15w 50 as we live is a hotter climate... others like different weights and makes.

All I can say is that it is worth the effort trying different weights and types to see what works for you.

When you find the sweet spot.. you will know as apart from first - your gear box will be silky smooth.

good luck.

I have had six different Yamahas manufactured between 1968 and 1984 and none of them had transmissions that were "silky smooth". Can't comment on the newer models.  Dave

[FJmonkey]

The clutch that came with my '86 over 17 years ago was always hard to shift and CLUNKED really hard on the first sift into 1st before leaving the dive. After I replaced it with a stock set of steels and fibers along with the roller shift kit from RPM, it shifted like warm butter. Night and day difference.

[red]

The clutch that came with my '86 over 17 years ago was always hard to shift and CLUNKED really hard on the first sift into 1st before leaving the dive. After I replaced it with a stock set of steels and fibers along with the roller shift kit from RPM, it shifted like warm butter. Night and day difference.

Pete,

I agree, here.  As you pull the clutch lever, it should disengage the clutch, then have at least another 1/4" (5mm) of lever movement, before it hits the grip.  A good system bleed may be needed, and it may take several tries to get out all the air.  A worn clutch handle or master cylinder assembly may not push enough fluid.  Inspect the clutch handle pivot bushing, the pushrod, and the part of the lever that pushes the pushrod for wear.  A new master cylinder with a slightly larger piston can also be one answer, there.

Beyond that, you may have clutch plates that are warped or sticky.  It's not too difficult to remove them, inspect, and maybe clean them.  Inspect the plates for overall flatness using a plate of glass or heavy metal flat plate stock, and check at the drive points.  If the metal is mushroomed there, I'd suggest getting new plates.  An all-new clutch pack may be close to the price of buying just a number of plates.  The clutch basket and center drive should be smooth, where they drive the clutch plates.  Any worn (gouged) surfaces there can prevent the clutch from releasing easily.  Soak any new or used fiber plates in a pan of clean oil for the night, before they get installed.  Keep in touch with the crew here.

Cheers,
Red

[Shane4371]

Had kinda the same issue.I chances to 20/50 ansol.it helped mine a lot.the automobile 10/30 the pervious owner used ruined the clutch.the oul switch helped till my clutch died

[Earl Svorks]

  On the subject of the first gear clunk. One of the very few areas of the FJ performance issue,in general terms that has pissed me off, no end is that annoying crash into first gear. We all agree this is simply an issue of clutch drag. It seems this condition  affects some FJs more than others. On my own 90, it has persisted through assorted clutch sets, various engine oil types , varying amounts of wear in related mechanical bits. Something that also seems to remain constant , is that when I start the bike from cold,if I drop it into gear right away, without waiting for warm up, it snicks into gear without any clunk at all.After the motor comes up a bit in temperature, going into gear will produce the nasty clunk every time. If I hold the clutch lever in for 10 or 20  seconds, the box still clunks. I know this is not an issue of hydraulics, my thinking leans more to how much oil the clutch is being fed. We know that the clutch gets oil from the hole the pushrod resides in, maybe from some other feed point too, but what provision is there to drain that oil from the clutch pack at a rate sufficient to not allow the clutch to act like a fluid coupler.. I recall seeing an article years ago about how to drill some holes in the clutch hub that would help  disperse what amounts to surplus oil within the assembly. Does anyone here recall anything  about this article or this as a possible cure ?

[Shane4371]

After changing my oil a few times and installing a new clutch and my idle at 1000 rpm.first gear is smooth as butter,i dont use the clutch after first gear.

[Arnie]

Earl,

Here are a couple of pics that show clutch hub/basket drilling.
These are NOT pics of FJ parts.





Arnie