Want to upgrade my front suspension - Noob needs tech help

[Tigger4x]

Recently acquired an '89 1200 from an devastatingly clueless owner and figure while I bring her back to snuff I may as well get the most bang for my buck and get some upgrades done, and done right.  With that said it's time to ditch the flat dead front springs; I'd like to improve the overall handling a few ticks.  I found a guy that has a NIB "gold valve" kit and an Ohlins rear.  Back in the day I remember hearing that Race Tech was the one to go for, but from a couple local mechanics was pointed towards Eibach as they were the springs the gold valve set up was originally designed with.  Not sure if I have fact or fiction here, but would like to know.  I did some initial poking around the interwebs and found a good number of Race Tech springs to choose from and am clueless in how to know which ones will serve me right, if they are even the ones to run.  This is where all you guru types come in.   

[Tigger4x]

Finally figured out why I can't Edit my post or Delete it and then repost it with corrections ... You can't!  So with no edit feature or mod to delete my screw up I sit here with egg on my face.       


The springs I mentioned in error were not Race Tech, but Progressive brand.  The mechanic suggested Eibach, but I am still not seeing where that could be possible as Race Tech is the brand of the Gold Valve kit.  Maybe they didn't make springs back then?  Although I highly doubt that.

Soooo, now my question is how do I choose the correct spring rate for me?


Some further digging and I found an old Ohlins chart that shows the rear spring for my '89 is the YA8350 that features the 1093-79 spring with 44mm of stroke.  I currently taunt the scale at just under 250lbs and am 5' 10".  The seller says that he is about 6' 4" and weighs about 230lbs.  Supposedly the spring hasn't seen that many miles, is in good shape, and had been rebuilt by a factory authorized shop before he installed it on his FJ.   I sent him a text asking for the actual numbers off of the shock and spring; hopefully I'll have them soon.

Question #2a is will this set up perform well for me?  #2b is how much weight can it take with a passenger?


And the all important Question 3 is what is a good price for it?  He is open to an offer.


Thanks!

[Bones]

Randy at RPM sells fork valves and rear shock designed for the FJ as well as Race Tech springs. I've got the valves and .85 springs in mine, and they are the ducks nuts.

https://www.rpmracingca.com/proddetail.asp?prod=M/C:RPMForkValve

[copper]

You can edit a post ur to 10 minutes? May be wrong on limit... After the initial post. Don't use Randy's chart if you are using the race tech emulators they are completely different and springs rates are different as well as I found out when changing from my emulators to the RPM valves I tried to stay with my old springs but ended up having to go softer.

[movenon]

The spring rate depends on the emulator you use. With RPM's which are probably the best RPM seems to recommend a lighter spring rate.  If you buy his valve Randy or Robert will tell you what spring rate to use.  With RT emulators you can go to there WEB site and use there calculator for spring rate. http://racetech.com/ProductSearch/2/Yamaha/FJ1200/1986-89  A straight rate spring is what you probably need.  Progressives are at best a compromise of evils.  I converted from progressives to straight rate springs and thought they might be stiff etc. but they are perfect.  Highly recommended.  I run an similar emulator to what RT has and am happy with it.  But if I had to buy an emulator new and my choices were RT or RPM's I would probably buy RPM's.

As to what you want to buy the big variable is that rear shock.  I don't have a clue but make sure that shock actually fits your bike.  Not all years of FJ's will interchange. Your shock has to be an 89 or 1990 shock.  IMO for the RT emulator I wouldn't pay over 75-100.00 if it is new.  You can buy them new for 150.00. The RPM unit is slightly higher but considering you will probably use it for many years it is not a bad deal. Yen and yang. Not trying to sell anything.

Back onto the spring rate I run 220-235 lbs and run a .95kg spring.  But above that weight I would go up to 1kg. That is just my opinion. Check the RT spring rate calculator.

Hope some of this helps.
George

[Tigger4x]

Randy at RPM sells fork valves and rear shock designed for the FJ as well as Race Tech springs. I've got the valves and .85 springs in mine, and they are the ducks nuts.

https://www.rpmracingca.com/proddetail.asp?prod=M/C:RPMForkValve

I'm not doubting RPMs quality, but the fork valves and springs are definitely more spendy than RT.  Buying good condition used is more my speed, for now, so hopefully I can figure out what to do with what the seller I found has on hand.  Using RT's calculator it looks like the 1.0 rate is what I'll need for a while.  When I drop some weight and have more cash on hand I'll give RPM another look.  Thanks for your input!

[Tigger4x]

The spring rate depends on the emulator you use. With RPM's which are probably the best RPM seems to recommend a lighter spring rate.  If you buy his valve Randy or Robert will tell you what spring rate to use.  With RT emulators you can go to there WEB site and use there calculator for spring rate. http://racetech.com/ProductSearch/2/Yamaha/FJ1200/1986-89  A straight rate spring is what you probably need.  Progressives are at best a compromise of evils.  I converted from progressives to straight rate springs and thought they might be stiff etc. but they are perfect.  Highly recommended.  I run an similar emulator to what RT has and am happy with it.  But if I had to buy an emulator new and my choices were RT or RPM's I would probably buy RPM's.

As to what you want to buy the big variable is that rear shock.  I don't have a clue but make sure that shock actually fits your bike.  Not all years of FJ's will interchange. Your shock has to be an 89 or 1990 shock.  IMO for the RT emulator I wouldn't pay over 75-100.00 if it is new.  You can buy them new for 150.00. The RPM unit is slightly higher but considering you will probably use it for many years it is not a bad deal. Yen and yang. Not trying to sell anything.

Back onto the spring rate I run 220-235 lbs and run a .95kg spring.  But above that weight I would go up to 1kg. That is just my opinion. Check the RT spring rate calculator.

Hope some of this helps.
George

When you say "emulator" I am guessing that translates to "fork valve" on RPMs website.  In looking at the chart it looks like they suggest the .85kg springs which is definitely lighter than the 1.0 that RT suggests, of course its right in line with what you said.  In looking at the chart on RTs site they list the same valve kit that the seller has in hand.  According to RPMs chart they don't offer a rear shock for '89 & '90 and if they did it is static set whereas with the Ohlins I'll have some adjustability.  Providing the seller comes back with the same part # as the Ohlins chart I will know if its a bolt in or not.  RT's chart didn't seem to have anything available for a rear shock other than what looks to be a custom unit with no available price tag.  Doubtful they are open tomorrow, but I'll try giving them a call.  If they are open I just might make the 100 mile ride one way and check 'em out in person.



I'm still out there trying to figure out what to offer they guy for the Ohlins.   

[movenon]

You need more information on the Ohlins for sure.  My knowledge on them is real thin.  I assume they can be rebuilt and springs are available for your set up. I would guess there are different "models or grades" of Ohlin's also. Like I said make sure it fits 89-90 FJ.  Some sellers think they are all the same and some don't know what the heck they have, even some of the "professionals".  Trust but verify......

Yes I am referring to the fork valves. There are at least 4 or 5 different manufactures of fork valves but generally all of them fit into two different designs.  I only have experience with the RT type.  I will say that the RT style valves will take some fine tuning on your part.  They are not plug and play.  I probably had mine out and back in at least 6 times over a few months zeroing them it.  It takes time.  RT makes a statement that "1/2 turn is significant"  When I stopped adjusting mine I was down to an eye ball 1/8 turn on the nut.  It takes time so keep that in mind.  They come with a "recommended" setting but you will need to trim them in to be really happy with them.  Don't expect to drop them in and live happly ever after.  Adjusted correctly they work good.  A big improvement over stock.  If nothing else get rid of those crappy front fork springs. The stock ones were not that great to start with and after 28 years they haven't gotten any better IMO.

Down in the "Files" section there is a lot of good reading in the suspension section that might be of interest at least to get some ideas.
George

[FJ1200W]

Finally figured out why I can't Edit my post or Delete it and then repost it with corrections ... You can't!  So with no edit feature or mod to delete my screw up I sit here with egg on my face.   

Don't complain about the software - you'll get banned.

Note the name on the bottom, the fellow asking for donations - Marsh.

Rumor is that he is some big time software dude.

I've been told he wears leathers to protect his thin skin, you've been warned.

[Arnie]

1. Marsh is a good guy.  I've been on this board since almost its beginning and I've never heard of anyone being banned except for being a total, complete, flaming asshole who refused to mend their ways after numerous suggestions and warnings.  I would be much less tolerant.

2. I have R-T Emulators and .90 springs and am very happy with them.  I've never tried the RPM valves, so can't tell you if they are better than the R-T Emulators or not.  Many here like them.
I'm not quite as 'solid' as you so you the .95 or 1.0 Kg/mm springs might be better suited to your heft.  How hard do you ride?  If you attack every corner and can give Rossi or Marquez or even Hayden a run, then go for the harder springs.

3. On the rear you'll want a spring rate of 1000 to 1100 lbs/in.

Just about anything is better than stock.
And, my advice is worth exactly what you've paid for it.
Only you can determine exactly what will be "best" for you.

[copper]

Randy at RPM sells fork valves and rear shock designed for the FJ as well as Race Tech springs. I've got the valves and .85 springs in mine, and they are the ducks nuts.

https://www.rpmracingca.com/proddetail.asp?prod=M/C:RPMForkValve

I'm not doubting RPMs quality, but the fork valves and springs are definitely more spendy than RT.  Buying good condition used is more my speed, for now, so hopefully I can figure out what to do with what the seller I found has on hand.  Using RT's calculator it looks like the 1.0 rate is what I'll need for a while.  When I drop some weight and have more cash on hand I'll give RPM another look.  Thanks for your input!

No worries. Yes you do have to run a much lighter spring I am about 215 with gear on and I was at a .95 with the RT and now am at a .85 with the RPM, the ride is much smoother and I find mu self riding better and with more confidence since the switch.0 As I said I went from the RT to the RPM form valves and haven't looked back. The RPM shock has been put on to the 89-90 I have read on here by a few people. With a small modification to allow the shock port to clear. I believe someone posted up pics of this but can't see too find it through the search function. That said the RPM form valve does take some adjusting but you do it with shims, no removing the valve like you have to with the emulators. You can make the adjustment in about a minute. The emulators a bit longer and I always seemed to get fork oil all over the place pulling the emulators out.

[movenon]

Use the springs to set your sag. Up front you should have 37-50mm of SAG with what ever spring you are using with you on your bike.
The fork springs will come out without making a mess if you twist the fork springs as you remove them and do it slowly.
George