Bringing the old girl into the new millennia

[FJmonkey]

I used rivet nuts to mount the arm anchor point. The aluminum swing arms already have some installed from the factory. Installing them without the tool is a little tricky but it can be done.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-rivet-nuts/=yj8ygy

[aviationfred]

All this talk about drilling holes in swing arms, cutting tabs and welding, and adding rivnuts. 

Why are we re-inventing the wheel here?

There is a great thread in the files section for the GSXR wheel mod. If you follow it word for word, it is not any more difficult than removing and installing the OEM wheel. For the torque arm, use the LONG torque arm as the mod file suggests. The torque arm comes with a Heim joint type end that a 6mm bolt and a 3/8 inch thick spacer will attach to a already threaded hole in the main steel frame.


Fred

[giantkiller]

See if I can post a picture of the Swingarm with the tab I cut off the top(ready made and cleans up the Swingarm) and welded to the bottom. I also used the arm from my bent FZR1000.




Or you can use 92 gsxr-600 wheel. With the brake bracket from the 92 gsxr 600 and eliminate the torque arm altogether. Like I did later on both the 86fj1350r, and the 89 fj1200. I have enough of the bar that I had made for the tab that goes on the inside of the Swingarm. For several more Swingarms.

Here is a picture of the fj1350r with the 600 brake no torque arm

[Urban_Legend]

Hi all. To allay everyone's fears.for my safety (mine also now) the bike is booked in on Thursday the have a lug welded onto the swing arm for a secure mounting point. Happy days. 

Mark

[Country Joe]

Good decision.

[ribbert]

All this talk about drilling holes in swing arms, cutting tabs and welding, and adding rivnuts. 

Why are we re-inventing the wheel here?

There is a great thread in the files section for the GSXR wheel mod. If you follow it word for word, it is not any more difficult than removing and installing the OEM wheel. For the torque arm, use the LONG torque arm as the mod file suggests. The torque arm comes with a Heim joint type end that a 6mm bolt and a 3/8 inch thick spacer will attach to a already threaded hole in the main steel frame.


Fred

OK Fred, I've never been able to get my head around this. To my thinking, if the brake stay is mounted to the frame, the caliper will rotate as the swing arm rises and falls, but isn't that clamped solidly between the hub and the swing arm - or is that just on mine or am I missing something?

Noel

[Arnie]

OK Fred, I've never been able to get my head around this. To my thinking, if the brake stay is mounted to the frame, the caliper will rotate as the swing arm rises and falls, but isn't that clamped solidly between the hub and the swing arm - or is that just on mine or am I missing something?

Noel

Actually the brake hanger is able to rotate on the spacer that is concentric to the axle.
This is supposed to isolate the braking from the rise and fall of the wheel.  I think its a carryover from the internally expanding drum brakes that had solid rod actuation.

Arnie

[ribbert]

OK Fred, I've never been able to get my head around this. To my thinking, if the brake stay is mounted to the frame, the caliper will rotate as the swing arm rises and falls, but isn't that clamped solidly between the hub and the swing arm - or is that just on mine or am I missing something?

Noel

Actually the brake hanger is able to rotate on the spacer that is concentric to the axle.
This is supposed to isolate the braking from the rise and fall of the wheel.  I think its a carryover from the internally expanding drum brakes that had solid rod actuation.

Arnie

Haha, clear as mud Arnie. I can see how it would rotate on the wheel side, but what about the swing arm side. When I tighten the axle, the hanger is clamped tight against the swing arm.

Noel

[aviationfred]

OK Fred, I've never been able to get my head around this. To my thinking, if the brake stay is mounted to the frame, the caliper will rotate as the swing arm rises and falls, but isn't that clamped solidly between the hub and the swing arm - or is that just on mine or am I missing something?

Noel

I did a minute of research and so far have come up with not much to answer your question. I did find this.

Rear brake torque link
   A link is generally used to anchor the backing plate or caliper against rotation. This link can be in either direction in theory, but operating in tension is stronger, more reliable, and safer. A tension link is attached to the backing plate below the axle center, and runs forward. Heim (rose) joints are only needed to permit minor misalignment without cocking if the backing plate can move axially, but the link is attached to the swing-arm. If the backing plate is floated on a bushing or bearing and only rotates, the link can be simply bolted in place. However, the forward ("dead") end of the link will exert bending force on the swing-arm, which is why the link is generally long enough to almost reach the forward end of the swing-arm, which reduces the deflection.  
   A better method is to "float" the forward end of the link as well, with a second Heim joint bolted to the chassis itself. This will affect the rear suspension under braking and the link is generally parallel to the swing-arm to minimize the effect, although alternate positions for the forward attachment bracket giving slight departure angle (non-parallel) will allow subtle changes in rear suspension for more tuning choices.
   Below is the same link made adjustable with a simple fabricated bracket welded to the chassis at a conventinet point. The hole pattern should be a shallow arc to maintain link length in all positions. Click to see larger views.  

Fred

[Bones]

This was answered earlier this year Noel, Oldtimers must be setting in


http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=13658.msg138354#msg138354

[giantkiller]

Yes Noel I'm with you. If the front mounting point is not exactly in line with the pivot point of the Swingarm. It will push and pull on the brake bracket as the Swingarm goes to through it's arc.
And the length how far forward or back of the pivot point would change how much it would push pull.

Let's try a little exercise. Take 3 dowels (pencils, pens whatever) one being the Swingarm longer, shorter for the torque arm . and a really short one for the brake bracket. Tape them together with the short (brake bracket) in-between the mid (torque arm) and long (Swingarm). With the torque arm slightly forward of the Swingarm arm pivot end. (Like it would be on the fj) now rotate Swingarm on its pivot.the front mounting point on the torque arm will push forward and backward significantly.

Now Fred's explanation mounting the arrm so it has pivot ends  might work. If you make bracket. With the correct offset from the pivot point of the Swingarm. But trying to replicate that with dowels. Still seems to push forward and backward some.
Besides I bet no one ever bothered to figure that out.
If the brake bracket had a bearing between it and the Swingarm it wouldn't matter.

Maybe it's not that much. And the rubber bushing on the pivot mount for the torque arm and the brake bracket gives enough forward and backward enough.

So maybe I'm missing something and am completely wrong.
So I'll just mount it to the Swingarm so I don't have to worry about it.

[jscgdunn]

See if I can post a picture of the Swingarm with the tab I cut off the top(ready made and cleans up the Swingarm) and welded to the bottom. I also used the arm from my bent FZR1000.




Or you can use 92 gsxr-600 wheel. With the brake bracket from the 92 gsxr 600 and eliminate the torque arm altogether. Like I did later on both the 86fj1350r, and the 89 fj1200. I have enough of the bar that I had made for the tab that goes on the inside of the Swingarm. For several more Swingarms.

Here is a picture of the fj1350r with the 600 brake no torque arm

Just reposted so everyone can see again that perfect 86

Jeff

[giantkiller]

Thanks Jeff, not so perfect. It's no trailer queen. I beat the crap out of it. And not done changing it yet. But it is definitely an awesome machine.
I have moditis really bad. 

[fj johnnie]

 Initially I held the same opinion as Noel regarding the caliper bracket. Some of them pivot and others don't. So if you have a mounting bracket without a bearing, it will not rotate on the axle. One of the members of this forum, who shall remain nameless, kept breaking his caliper stay bolt. It was because the stay was attached to the frame of the bike. When the swing arm moved through its travel, it overloaded the bolt and it snapped. When the proper caliper stay was installed, ( The one with a bearing) the bolts no longer snapped , as it allowed the caliper to pivot.  I have a complete FZ 1 swing arm with underslung caliper and the stay ( arm ) is attached to the swing arm. This caliper bracket will NOT rotate.

[Urban_Legend]

Thanks Jeff, not so perfect. It's no trailer queen. I beat the crap out of it. And not done changing it yet. But it is definitely an awesome machine.
I have moditis really bad. 

Moditis is so easy to catch and very hard to shake. I am getting to the stage where there is not of the original bike left. After the front end swp next weekend the only original bits will be the frame and the fuel tank. Everything else is either from a different FJ or different type of bike or aftermarket.

Mark