Better Riding Techniques - Introduction

[Burns]

Zwartie, if you wanted to open a can of worms, you could have just mentioned oil and saved yourself a lot of typing. Great idea for a discussion though. I am curious why, with so many topics to discuss about motorcycling safely, you would choose one that has so little bearing on staying alive (one foot vs two)

Anyway, you were no doubt expecting responses to this.

Added Benefits:  Other than being able to balance the bike more securely, there are a few other key benefits to stopping in the ready position. They include (but are not limited to):

To me, the bike is balanced when it is the neutral position, that is upright, not leaning to one side and having to hold it up with one leg. With both feet down the bike offers almost no resistance to staying where it is, leaned to one side, it feels like it wants to fall over.

1.  Now that your right foot is on the peg and not on the ground, you can use it to apply the rear brake. This lets traffic behind you know that you are intending to stop or remain stopped. It also leads into the next point.

How does this differ from the front brake?

2.  Since you have the rear brake applied, you can keep your right hand on the throttle. This means that once that light turns green, you can roll on the throttle and you're ready to go!

Being sufficiently dexterous and able to use the full range of brake and throttle with your right hand without the operation of one effecting the other I would have thought was a pretty basic skill for all but a newbie. Such as throttle blips on down changes while maintaining perfectly smooth braking, no matter how hard.

3.  Once you do get moving, you just have to put that left foot back on the peg and you're off. Once you have both feet on the pegs you are lowering the overall center of gravity of you and the bike vs. having both legs dangle like a pendulum as you ride through the intersection. The bike will roll through the intersection without weaving side to side.

You assume that both feet on the ground leads to trailing feet as you take off. I, as I'm sure most others do, have their feet back on the pegs before the bikes gone half a length.
The effect of C of G at this point I would think was minuscule in terms of stability.
Even if you did trail your legs, why would this cause weaving?

4.  Ever roll off when the light turns green and then you suddenly have to come to a quick stop because someone pulled in front of you or the car/bike in front suddenly came to a stop? If you started with both feet on the ground and didn't get them up on the pegs yet, guess what – you only have one brake to apply. In slow speed maneuvers the front brake is often exactly the wrong brake to apply, especially if you are in the middle of a left or right turn.

Back to my previous point, both feet are back on the pegs before the bikes gone half a length.
Your scenario assumes the rider is trailing his right leg all the way around the corner(by suggesting that the only foot on the peg is the one that was there back at the intersection)

I always have my bike in gear. The only time it is ever in neutral is first start of the day ( because of the clutch) The thought of sitting in traffic, in neutral, hand off the clutch makes me feel very vulnerable, I know I'm a couple of seconds away from regaining control over the bike. I like to know I can move in an instant if need be. I have lane split / filtered all my life so more often than not at an intersection I am between two cars or pulled ahead of the first car, not somewhere you want to be slower off the mark than the cars around you because you were distracted and missed the lights changing.
If you are sitting at an intersection in neutral with you hand off the clutch when the vehicles around start moving, it's amazing how far they travel by the time you've pulled / reached the clutch and mashed it into first and started moving. Anticipating this moment doesn't always work, especially if you're taking the in the vehicle movements around you and checking you mirrors.

Also, if you only have one leg down, the bike is leaned over, this means when you take off the bike will initially weave in that direction, not good when close to other traffic or between two cars. Both feet down allows a dead straight launch.

It doesn't have to be exclusively one or the other either. If I'm on a tall bike, I use one foot, you adapt to whatever you're riding. If I'm on a slope and I suspect one foot won't reach the ground, I just use the other one. A bike that is leaning to one side is off balance and doesn't feel right and the greater the load the worse it feels and the easier it is to lose it because it's already wanting to fall but you're stopping it with your leg rather than gently maintaining the balance point.

I also like to get the jump on all the other traffic at an intersection, not difficult on most bikes 250cc or above, and leave the pack behind, now that makes me feel safe.

Zwartie, as an instructor you must have a million stories and some great techniques to pass on but I find this an odd and almost irrelevant subject when it comes to safety. It's right up there with which hand do you scratch your arse with.

Noel

10-4 and Roger That

- plus "drag racing" from a rear-ender is gonna get ya killed by cross traffic.

[theLeopard]

• don't brake in corners
• get comfortable riding while looking behind you without mirrors (empty road, 10second challenge)
• learn to ride in a straight line - use the lanemarkers as guides
• lean forward when you accelerate, sit up when you brake
• don't wave at other cyclists
• know your limits.

your limits begin where your experience ends.

[Pat Conlon]

If the road conditions warrant, depending on your experience level and equipment, it's ok to ride fast...

...but never be in a hurry....never.

[Burns]

• don't brake in corners
• get comfortable riding while looking behind you without mirrors (empty road, 10second challenge)
• learn to ride in a straight line - use the lanemarkers as guides
• lean forward when you accelerate, sit up when you brake
• don't wave at other cyclists
• know your limits.

your limits begin where your experience ends.

and tighten your damn oil drain plug.

[simi_ed]

• don't brake in corners
• get comfortable riding while looking behind you without mirrors (empty road, 10second challenge)
• learn to ride in a straight line - use the lanemarkers as guides
• lean forward when you accelerate, sit up when you brake
• don't wave at other cyclists
• know your limits.

your limits begin where your experience ends.

"your limits begin where your experience ends."

I guess that explains the above.

I've been braking in corners for years.
I don't try to look behind, that's what mirrors are for.
I don't need lane markers to ride in a straight line.
I've been leaning forward, sitting up and hanging off for at LEAST 30 years.
I wave at will (except for Harley types)
I always ride UNDER my LIMITS.  Street ≠ Track.

[theLeopard]

I tailwhipped my turn at the light last week on accident.
made sure my bike wasn't broken and kept on goin 

[Country Joe]

I tailwhipped my turn at the light last week on accident.
made sure my bike wasn't broken and kept on goin 

[Flynt]

I always ride UNDER my LIMITS.  Street ≠ Track.

I'd only add "WAY" to "under my limits".  I never intentionally get past 80% on street, or 70% with Diane aboard. I'm a big believer in taking your bike onto a track where you have safe runout and can push your fear a bit in relative safety...  damned fun too.

Track is where you understand your limits in a controlled fashion.  Street is where you want to be able to brake pretty hard in a corner if needed... practice + experience = control, but you're still gonna crash sometimes.

Frank

[bcguide]

OK Ill play to
1 foot down gives you 3 point contact for good control for sudden moves

If you have a near miss don't waste your time blaming the other guy, instead try to think of what you could have done to avoid or antispate so you are ahead of the curve next time

Be brutaly honest with your friends and co riders

A friend of mine stopped by one day and told me that three times that day he had been cut off by drivers pulling out in front of him. We went for a ride and I watched Rob get cut off once more heres the thing. Rob was tailgating the car in front of him and the merging driver could not have seen him

On waving
My nearest miss came from this I waved and looked at a group of riders as I was entering a blind curve when I refocused on the road all I could see was the back doors of a white van. I jumped on the brakes got slowed down and could see that I was not going to be able to stop so went around him and a long line of traffic on the right hand shoulder I was actully headed for the ditch but it was full of jagged rock
At the front of the line was a dumb ass trying to make a illeagle left turn
Whos fault would it have been if I had had a wreck yep mine for not keeping my mind on what I was doing

[magge52]

I always ride UNDER my LIMITS.  Street ≠ Track.

I'd only add "WAY" to "under my limits".  I never intentionally get past 80% on street, or 70% with Diane aboard. I'm a big believer in taking your bike onto a track where you have safe runout and can push your fear a bit in relative safety...  damned fun too.

Track is where you understand your limits in a controlled fashion.  Street is where you want to be able to brake pretty hard in a corner if needed... practice + experience = control, but you're still gonna crash sometimes.

Frank

++1

[squidley63]

I am definitely a fan of constantly trying to upgrade my riding skills. I have always put one foot down and in gear at lights. If I am at a light for a while I may put it in neutral but only if I have another vehicle behind me to act as a blocker.  I stay vigilant in my mirrors until a car is stopped behind me. For the record the idea of staying vigilant in gear to avoid the car behind me is not to outrun the car but to simply get out of the way so that it can hit someone else. I've had to pull my bike up on a sidewalk to get out of the way on a couple of occasions over the years.

The other thing that has come in handy over the years is to staying in a lower gear so the bike has instant acceleration available. I had to learn this one the hard way.  I was rolling through town at 20 mph in fifth gear and when a truck took a left in front of me and by the time I got it in a useable gear I couldn't get to the inside of the  trucks turn and got to go flying through the air and spend a luxurious week in the hospital getting used to the metal the doc put in my leg.

Lastly when riding with others I make sure everyone knows the route we are going on and that everybody should stick to their comfortable pace. I've had to do first aide to way too many guys that were going to keep up no matter what and dumped their bikes in the process. If people are lagging behind I slow my pace to keep an eye on them as they are usually the new riders. I also don't sugar coat the answer when somebody asks me what I think of their technique. Its not about puffing up egos its about giving honest feedback. I know I am not the best rider but I do try and learn something new every time I go out.

[The General]

Fellow FJers,

It seems to me that there's been quite a bit of bad/sad news on this site over the past few months. Too many crashes (even one is too many) and also too many deaths from motorcycle-related accidents. I offer my condolences to all those who have been affected. Whenever I hear news about a motorcycle accident or fatality it makes me pause and think about the risks involved and what I can do to minimize them. Motorcycling is something that we do because we enjoy it, because it's fun. That being said, it does require skill, focus and practice, practice, practice. You may think "I've been riding for 10, 20, 30 or 40 years and x-thousand kms or miles without incident so I must be riding well" but unless you are actively working on your technique, maybe you've just been lucky. Think back to the past season or two – how many close calls have you had? Did someone cut you off or blow through an intersection and you had to take evasive maneuvers at the last second? What could you have done to have prevented that scenario in the first place? Maybe not every single accident is preventable, but I believe that in most cases, even the party that is not at fault could have done something to avoid the situation in the first place. Maybe you're riding at the posted speed limit but is it possible that's too fast for the situation at hand? Or you're in a hurry to get by a slow driver and they make a last second left turn forcing you into the shoulder – sure, they didn't have their left signal on but did you notice that driveway on the left and that they were slowing down just before it? What I'm attempting to get at here is that ALL of us can improve some aspect of our riding and in turn make it a safer experience.

I would like to post some "Better Riding Techniques" on this forum and I encourage others to do the same and to join in the conversation. If it means anything, I've been a Canada Safety Council certified motorcycle riding instructor since 2002 and for the past year and a half have been one of the Chief Motorcycle Instructors at Fanshawe College (London, ON).  The training that we do includes the typical weekend-long course for new riders in which we provide the bikes (125cc) and do the course on the College parking lot. This is known as the Basic, or M1Exit course. We also run an M2Exit course for those upgrading to their full M licence and that involves the rider (with 18 months to 5 years' experience) riding their own motorcycle on the street (residential, business and expressway sections) while we follow behind in a vehicle and critique their riding and then test them after 3-4 hours of practice.

https://www.ontario.ca/driving-and-roads/get-motorcycle-licence

http://www.fanshawec.ca/driversed

I'm often amazed at how much the students have "unlearned" between the Basic and M2Exit course. Unfortunately we don't have enough time available to reteach the basics but we do remind them whenever possible. Being an instructor I am always watching other riders on the street and it blows me away at how many crappy riders there are out there – and I'm not just talking about Harley and/or cruiser riders. There are plenty of riders and all kinds of bikes who just aren't that good at it. Oh, they're good enough to go out for an afternoon ride but if something should happen, do they have the skills to stay out of harm's way?

I already have an idea for the first topic and will likely post it later today. I hope you find it helpful.

Thanks, and stay safe out there!

Zwartie

Well.....The first topic really got us going. I wonder how many of YOU blokes have now tried riding a straight line following one foot down!......(I gotta tell ya I`ve even managed to use the front brake to stop while sitting on the handlebars, but only in the driveway!)

Is there a second topic? Can we have them filed under this one heading Mr Moderator. Following a motorcycle accident, how many times have we heard the phrase "I just didn`t see you/him".....

C`mon zwartie, bring on your next topic that might save us a bit of skin. 

[Zwartie]

C`mon zwartie, bring on your next topic that might save us a bit of skin. 

Sorry for the delay. It's been a busy summer and I haven't had a chance to keep up with the forum. I'm glad to see that the first topic generated quite a debate, which is a good thing. I just finished the next one and am looking forward to the discussion and feedback.

Zwartie