Gasoline in the Oil Pan

[theLeopard]

Step two, while they're off, is to do a compression check.  Leakdown would be good as well.

Can you give me a bit more information on this? What kind of compression? Carburetor? Engine? Spark? And what's a leakdown?

I can manage the rest of your list with the purchase of a few tools.

edit*
NOTE: Valve clearance must be set properly before synchronizing the carburetors.
K so this guy messed up my bike or what? Cause it idled perfectly before I took it there and he's a machinist that specializes in engine rebuilds.

[Steve_in_Florida]

Here's a bit-o-readin' on the subject:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compression_test

Pretty standard stuff in the world of engines.

Steve

Step two, while they're off, is to do a compression check.  Leakdown would be good as well.

Can you give me a bit more information on this? What kind of compression? Carburetor? Engine? Spark? And what's a leakdown?

[andyb]

NOTE: Valve clearance must be set properly before synchronizing the carburetors.
K so this guy messed up my bike or what? Cause it idled perfectly before I took it there and he's a machinist that specializes in engine rebuilds.

The compression check will tell you if the valves are too tight, to a degree.  That's why it's before the synch in the list.  Only one thing in the engine compresses air, and that's the combustion chamber (the interface between piston/rings, head, and valves), so it's a good way to get an overall health indicator.  The leakdown is a way to measure the condition of the valve seal and piston ring-to-cylinder wall seal.  If both of those tests return good numbers, your list of problems gets a lot shorter.

If it sat for as little as a week after he worked on it, or if there's rust in the tank, the symptoms you describe could happen.

What I'm suggesting is a bit of overkill, but gives you a pretty clean bill of health on the motor (excluding main/rod bearing wear, but there's no good way to measure that without a total stripdown, so we'll skip it for the time being).

[theLeopard]

ok here's my list of tasks:
compression check
leakdown test
clean pilot jets & needles
inspect gastank
synch carbs

and here's my list of tools:
petroleum carb cleaner
compressed air
oil filter
spark plugs
micrometer
1mm-10mm sockets (already have a 17mm)

and here's a list of tools I know I need but don't know what to buy:
fuel level gauge
compression gauge
leakdown gauge
tool to put the pistons top dead center

The leakdown is a way to measure the condition of the valve seal and piston ring-to-cylinder wall seal.  If both [the compression and leakdown] tests return good numbers, your list of problems gets a lot shorter.

If it sat for as little as a week after he worked on it, or if there's rust in the tank, the symptoms you describe could happen.

gives you a pretty clean bill of health on the motor

I put both on the list. will get to the autoparts store today if Randy is unavailable.

It did sit for a week, during the repair. Then it was leaking fuel and sat for another half-week, then we got it running; has died since I got it back.

A clean bill of health is exactly what I'm looking for, thanks for the help and advice.

[simi_ed]

As much as Andy would like to have you do a full diagnostic check,  I would really on the 2 most likely areas of attention; valve adjustment & carbs.

To adjust the valves, initially you'll need a set of feeler gauges.  Not too expensive $5-10.  The 10 mm socket (I assume you also ratchet, extensions?).  Remove the valve cover & sparkplugs.  You can use a pen or pencil to find TDC.  Obviously, don't just drop the pencil into the sparkplug hole, but lower it in until it contacts the piston.  If it won't reach, get a longer one!  You'll need a 17 0r 19mm wrench to turn the crank after removing the cover off the left end of the engine. Turn the crank until the piston is at max height.  You've found TDC.
Check valve clearances per your service manual.  Make sure none are too tight!  Too loose will make a bit of noise, but won't cause any problems you're experiencing.  And I'd be pretty surprised if you found a loose valve.  If you need to adjust valves, this just got a bit more complex.  Now you need a valve tool, your micrometer, pick and or small flat screwdriver, maybe a set of needle nose pliers to extract valve shims.  Then measure shim and ORDER a replacement!  This will take some time. (2-3 days?)  At that point, get a valve cover gasket as well.  Maybe the grommets for the valve cover if they're hard, should be soft & pliable.  Insert new shims as needed.  Before you get into a valve adjustment, read up.  You can make a mess if you're not careful!

Carbs:  A simple 6" Steel scale (ruler) will do the trick for a float adjustment.  You'll need to find precisely when each float tang contacts the needle valve, then measure that float height when this happens.  It will take time & patience, so allow enough of each since you need to check all 4 carbs, and get them right.   I typically set them in the center of the range, (IIRC) ~0.85"  or 27/32" or 21-22mm .  Change out the pilot jets.  I'd also check the emulsion tubes unless you saw the mechanic clean them.   Reassemble & cross your fingers!
Sync your carbs?  There is a description somewhere here of how to build a manometer at home for ~ $5-10.  You really need 2 box fans to keep you engine cool while doing this.  a remote gat tank can be cobbled from a radiator overflow kit ($10 at auto parts store).  Otherwise, just a flat blade screwdriver and more patience will get it done.  Balance 1 & 2, then 3 & 4, then balance the 2 pairs.  Nothing to it (not really, but almost).

[theLeopard]

I've got deep-set 5-10mm & 17mm sockets, and socket wrenches.
Guess I'll get started on the valve clearance, seems doable in todays timeframe.
Anything I need to AVOID doing? Like, what is my major fuckup-scenario for this project?

[jscgdunn]

There is not much point in starting to adjust the valves unless you are prepared with the correct tools and an,assortment of replacement shims  it is a simple job for an,experienced mechanic.  But if you have not worked on the inside of a .motor before I would not dive in.  if you can get a forum member to help it would be best


Just sayin

Jeff 

[theLeopard]

Any volunteers?
I'm in Esco.

Need to trip to the store and purchase some feeler gauges, will report results if valves are on/off.

[andyb]

I agree with the above if you're doing a full service, though it's significantly more difficult than just screwing the adapter in and turning the motor over (all there is to a compression check, really).  Because the bike ran fine fairly recently, I wouldn't expect to find big problems, though after an unknown service I suppose anything's possible.

Pulling the plugs is less invasive than pulling the valve cover, and I think we're barking up the wrong tree here, though it's never a bad idea to check the lash.  Bike ran reasonably well prior and now is leaking fuel into the oil; I was thinking more along the lines of ensuring that the cylinder seal hasn't been destroyed by watered-down oil.

[simi_ed]

Make sure you have the needed tools to get the cover off the left end of the motor as well.  Sorry, I'm about 120 mi. to the North.  Mopar Steve?

[andyb]

Make sure you have the needed tools to get the cover off the left end of the motor as well.  Sorry, I'm about 120 mi. to the North.  Mopar Steve?

Big philips screwdriver?

[simi_ed]

Make sure you have the needed tools to get the cover off the left end of the motor as well.  Sorry, I'm about 120 mi. to the North.  Mopar Steve?

Big philips screwdriver?

Maybe a #3 Phillips will do it.  I needed an impact driver the 1st time I removed the cover.  Now mine has Allen screws and a set Renntec bars in the way.  That's why I was a bit vague.

[theLeopard]

working on it.
need to remove the cylinder-head casing.
did some pre-lims, loosened it all up, saw the res' ready to drain and chose to hold up.
gonna drain the oil first, need an 18mm socket first cause spark plugs are.

waiting for Randy's package.
to all you newbies, Randy will treat you right with parts so; IF you need some, buy from him. no bullshit.
#realtalk

[andyb]

Cylinder head casing is what?

Valve cover you mean?  Arguably the cylinder head itself is a casting, I suppose.

The big scary fuckups don't really happen doing this until you decide to just pull the cams out, or start playing with the camchain tensioner.  The horrible, horrible little fuckups include stuff like remembering not to drop shit down the sparkplug holes while working on stuff with the plugs out.  It's a right bitch to get the screws from the throttle cable connector thingy out of there (despite trying for a solid hour, the head will have to come off to get the bastard thing out).

[Lotsokids]

I saw this topic just a few days ago, and yesterday I had the same trouble. I tried to start my bike and it liquid-locked with fuel in the cylinder. I also noticed fuel leaking on the ground, but not sure from where. The engine liquid-locked like this about 3 or 4 times in the 4 years I've owned it. I tapped on the float bowls with a small hammer and long 3/8 extension. Seemed to work fine and correct the problem. But yesterday was more intense. I changed the oil as I saw the oil in the window was foamy, thin, and VERY overfilled. When I drained the oil, it was thin as water with a serious fuel smell.

Got that all done, added a fuel filter, and tapped on the fuel bowls again. Started and worked fine today. Oil level and consistency is good. I'm not saying I permanently corrected the problem, though. Good advice has been given about rebuilding the carbs with new parts.