Spring Time

[Burns]

I'm sorting out my "new to me" '89  and the suspension is in need of some attention, beginning with springs.
The bike is intended for 700 + mile days and will never see a race track or bang fairings with crotch rockets. I want a big "sweet spot."  So  I'm thinking that progressively wound springs are the way to go.

I see that there are a lot of RPM fans here but I wonder if those springs are biased to the aggressive rider.  I don't need that last 2% at the edge of the contact patch's adhesion limit and will gladly trade the "cutting edge" for a bit of comfort.  Cost is a factor but real world performance (in my real world) is determinative.

Any Spring suggestions (front or back)?

Anyone have experience with the Patriot Suspension Multirate springs?

Gracias

[FJscott]

Burns,

I have a 92 and swapped out my fork springs, emulator valves and went with the Motul 5w fork oil from RPM. I have done many modifications and improvements on my bike but by far the most significant was RPM's fork valves. I would suggest you go to the files section and read " fork valves explained" other valves have fixed oil orifice whereas the RPM valve has a stacked disc design. what you get is a soft and consistent feel in the forks no matter what you are riding over or braking under.

Installation was simple. I made a mistake by using another brand fork oil and was not happy with the results at first but what I learned was the vast differences in viscosity of different brand oils. RPM's valves are designed with the Motul 5w oil so don't make the same mistake I did by trying another oil.

You get a lot of bang for your buck with the RPM fork setup.

I haven't done the backend yet. Popular rear shock upgrades are RPM's, Penske, Hagon, F4i. here there is a wide range of pricing and ease of installation. I myself don't know which way I will go on this one yet.

Scott

[X-Ray]

You get a lot of bang for your buck with the RPM fork setup.

I haven't done the backend yet. Popular rear shock upgrades are RPM's, Penske, Hagon, F4i. here there is a wide range of pricing and ease of installation. I myself don't know which way I will go on this one yet.

Scott

Exactly my situation. The front end has been transformed with Randys magical goodies, but the poor 'ol rear is not so good.  Money is scarce here so for me I have to go middle of the road with new rear suspension, as much as I would love to have the best.

[Burns]

Well, it sounds like the RPM stacks are the best suspension upgrade since pneumatic tires.

But, I don't think I'll go your route Scott.  It is all about balance, I think. Putting a 21st Century fork in front of a worn out 20th century rea end is asking for a bike with a front end that will write checks that its rear end can't cash.

If your rear-end gets loose despite the front-end telling you "looks good to me" you'll be flat tracking a 600 lb. motorcycle with clip-ons. Instinctively chop the throttle and its a high-side.  Not my kinda movie.

My heartfelt advice to you is to not push that bike anywhere close to as hard as that wonderful front end is begging you to.

But you probably knew that (assuming you're not emailing from a hospital bed)


Going with the saying "better the devil you know," since the stacks don't work with progressive wound springs, until a rear shock that is in the same league as the RPM stacks appears in my future and both ends of my bike are treated to 21st Century technology I've gone the old school "patch" route:

I've added an inch and a tad of PVC preload.  That gives me about an inch of sack (w/o rider) and puts the nose up where Yamaha intended. Slows up the steering a tad of course and initial travel is a stiff but not jittery.  The bike feels absolutely solid and I feel that I can trust what the chassis is telling me.

I'm enjoying getting into my motorcycle and have my first "special tool" for it: A 6" bolt with a 27mm head with two 27mm nuts locktited and torqued as snug to one another as I could get them with a vice and a breaker bar/socket.  That's for the fork caps.


Corbin seat should get here next week.

Along with some sunshine.

[FJscott]

Sounds like you have a good handle on it, enjoy the Bike.

Scott

[Burns]

Thanks, Scott.  Your input was very valuable.

Happy Spring

[ribbert]

Putting a 21st Century fork in front of a worn out 20th century rea end is asking for a bike with a front end that will write checks that its rear end can't cash.

If your rear-end gets loose despite the front-end telling you "looks good to me" you'll be flat tracking a 600 lb. motorcycle with clip-ons. Instinctively chop the throttle and its a high-side.  Not my kinda movie.

My heartfelt advice to you is to not push that bike anywhere close to as hard as that wonderful front end is begging you to.

But you probably knew that (assuming you're not emailing from a hospital bed)

Burns, this would have to be heresay or speculative theory on your part. A standard FJ rear end has a sweet spot for handling, albeit at the expense of comfort, that will handle anything you can throw at it without becoming unsafe. No wallowing, no skipping.
There is a limit to its ability to keep the tyre planted (even motogp bikes suffer from that) but that's at speeds and on particular surfaces that are not often encountered.

Yes, I would love a new shocker but my safety is not compromised in the meantime and I am probably as demanding of my bikes handling as anyone here.

I can't agree with you new front / old rear being a recipe for disaster. Any disparity brought on by upgrading one end only would have a positive effect on the whole.


Lively debate is the life blood (or oil) of the forum and views and counter views are always welcome. You've just had mine.

Noel

[X-Ray]

I've got to say even though the front end is supremely planted now and shows the rear to be less than satisfactory, I've never felt unsafe or come close to having an incident while on the FJ. This is despite some highly *spirited* riding on the recent Jindabyne trip while loaded up, or even out and about on my own. The rear does thud along a bit,  and feels way too soft, but nervous or skittish etc, no. I think these bikes even with sagged out rear suspension are still supremely stable in my opinion.

[TexasDave]

Once again I find myself agreeing with Noel and his view of upgrading either front or rear of the bike. I don't think upgrading one will be detrimental to the other. Upgrading one end would just show how bad the other still is.   Dave

[andyb]

If you only upgrade one end, the bike's handling will be decidedly compromised if either end is pushed too far.  For example, you've got a brilliant fork setup and a trashed shock; if the front goads you to take liberties that are too much for the back, you're going to be having a bad day, absolutely.

But at that point, you probably need to consider just how fast you're riding on the street.  You wouldn't particularly want a mismatched setup on the track where you were pushing the limits, but on the street the limits of the bike are very rarely anything near as slow as the limits of the potential problems that can crop up and do much damage to you.

I kinda prefer a mushy bike on the street myself, that can blow through a fair chunk of travel reasonably quickly.  Helps soak up the potholes and frost heaves and such.  If I'm heading to a racetrack, or a set of known amazing roads, I do have some regrets about my choices once I'm riding there... but it's good to be comfortable on the way to and fro, yes?

Of course, if you're actually interested in pushing the limits (which is clearly not the intent as per the original post), I'll wager that spending money on trackdays and instruction will go rather a lot farther than almost any amount spent on hard parts, with the possible exception of tires.

[yamaha fj rider]

For what you described as you riding style the RPM products should be just what the doctor ordered. Don't be afraid of changing the front and the rear later. As you say you are not riding aggressively anyway. Most riders can handle a little rear end drift but a front wheel push will cause them to fall down. Hope this helps.

Kurt

[Burns]

It is a trust issue for me. While I'm sure that a reasonably fresh OEM shock could keep up with what has been represented as the greatest innovation in front suspension technology ever (los stacks). I'm not at all sure that would hold true for a dogged out 25 year old unit.  I see peril in the half-measure of addressing only one end of the suspension equation.

The sweet-song sung by a fabulous front end might well coax me a bit deeper into turn and lure me into more lean angle than the rear is happy with; a few ripples in the pavement later I might discover the latter's break away point. That is not a path of discovery that I wish to tread.

It's a chorus that I seek in the music of the chassis, not a solo virtuoso.

The rear's job is to lay down a solid predictable bass line and the front makes the melody.  In my experience good music requires good instruments all around and overall quality is always limited by the weakest of them.

As to the path others choose, I judge not, but I  would not dramatically improve only one end of a motorcycle any more than I would air only one tire to its correct pressure or buy only one shoe.

[movenon]

"The rear's job is to lay down a solid predictable bass line and the front makes the melody."

I like that. I need to go out and tune up a little  .
George

[FJscott]

"The rear's job is to lay down a solid predictable bass line and the front makes the melody."

I like that. I need to go out and tune up a little  .
George

That's why the logo is a tuning fork

[FJ_Hooligan]

You ask for advice then argue against it.  Seems you had already made up your mind.

Following your 'logic" installing new springs up front (from your first post) would be an improvement.  But, by your logic, even installing the spacers was an improvement so you're heading for a certain crash beacuse your rear suspension is crap.

How about this logic?  The spacers appear to have made a noticeable improvement without throwing the bike to the ground.  Imagine what even a few good parts would feel like.  But, if you can't control yourself then maybe you've got the wrong bike?