Fuel leaking through the bottom, after going down. 1990 FJ1200

[Pat Conlon]

I don't know why nobody is saying this, but your fuel pump should be blocking fuel flow, when the pump is shut off (no key on).  If it passes fuel then (siphoning), the pump is not working correctly.....

Aww hell, how did we miss that?

[movenon]

I don't know why nobody is saying this, but your fuel pump should be blocking fuel flow, when the pump is shut off (no key on).  If it passes fuel then (siphoning), the pump is not working correctly.....

Aww hell, how did we miss that?

ummmm  ...
George

[itsdrock]

do i need to drain out the carbs before i crank it with spark plugs off? and if so, i'm not too sure how to do that. also, is it ok to crank the motor with no oil in it? wouldn't grind or something?

[movenon]

Do not crack it with no oil it...... Don't worry about draining your float bowels. Don't grind on it...  Just a revolution or two is all you would need. I suspect when you drained your oil any gas if any in the cylinders drained out.

Just for education while you have the fuel tank off take a look at the petcock. You will see a flat square white plastic end on it with a slot for a screwdriver. That will turn your fuel off and on at the tank manually. I just mention that because you are new to the FJ. 
George

[movenon]

Do not crack it with no oil it...... Don't worry about draining your float bowels. Don't grind on it...  Just a revolution or two is all you would need. I suspect when you drained your oil any gas if any in the cylinders drained out.

Just for education while you have the fuel tank off take a look at the petcock. You will see a flat square white plastic end on it with a slot for a screwdriver. That will turn your fuel off and on at the tank manually. I just mention that because you are new to the FJ. 
George

I misspoke on the manual shut off, because of where it is located you will have to use a 10mm wrench to turn the valve off or on... Might be handy to know as you trouble shoot your fuel leak, so you quickly know what it takes.  .
George

[itsdrock]

thanks for the responses guys. it's gonna be a late start for me today(had a bunch of stuff to do). So i should just barely hit the starter with no oil and no filter huh? 
also, if the fuel pump is busted, can it be repaired or do i need to replace it? and is it spendy? i'm a student so every dollar counts 

[itsdrock]

and another thing. is it alright to use the seafoam? because i read in the owner's manual to not add any additives, as it may cause clutch slippage. and if so, where do i put it in? in the tank, into the oil filler?

[movenon]

thanks for the responses guys. it's gonna be a late start for me today(had a bunch of stuff to do). So i should just barely hit the starter with no oil and no filter huh? 
also, if the fuel pump is busted, can it be repaired or do i need to replace it? and is it spendy? i'm a student so every dollar counts 

In my opinion DO NOT turn the engine over until you have oil back in it.... Please... In fact the odds of any fuel remaining in the upper cylinders is remote since you have drained the oil out. I personally wouldn't bother except to squirt a little oil in the cylinders if I was convinced fuel went down that way.

If the fuel pump is leaking fuel then it is toast. Non repairable. It is replaceable. But going down that path at this point is a waist of time. From the point you are right now:

Change the oil and filter (do not turn the engine over without oil in it)
Optional: squirt some oil in the cylinders
Check all your hoses and fittings.
Manually turn the fuel off at the petcock
Put in at least 2 or 3 gallons of fuel
Have flashlight in hand
Do not start the engine
Turn on the petcock and start looking for your fuel leak. Start at the top and work your way down.
If you find the leak turn off your petcock (unless you want to change oil again or have a mess on the ground) and repair as required

Stop there and report what you find... That's the best I can explain it. If it is leaking as fast as you say then it should be easy to locate.

As a suggestion also before you start looking for the leak try to locate the 2 larger black drain hoses from under your carb's.  You just want to know where they are so you can have a look at them in your trouble shooting. You will have 4 small vent hoses and the 2 larger overflow hoses. All you want to locate is the 2 larger ones.

At this point don't worry about Seafoam or additives... They are not going to fix the problem. Flashlight and "Mark 2 eye balls" is all you need right now.
George

[itsdrock]

thanks George. i will do that. spinning it with no oil sounded kinda scary haha.
so, i'll go ahead add the oil. if i turned the fuel valve to "off" on the fuel tank, do i also need to go ahead and turn off the petcock too?
i'm also a little confused about turning the fuel back. if i turn it back on wouldn't go and contaminate my new oil, while i look for the leak? or do you think it won't get into the oil this time? and about tapping on the carbs, i'm supposed to hit the 4 round bowl looking things on top of the carbs am i right? and how do i know if i shocked the floats loose? or do i just hope it got loose?  Carburetors are so confusing
Plus,is there anyway to visually tell if the pump is busted?
I have so many questions....and so eager to get her up and running again. it was running so well till now. 

[movenon]

thanks George. i will do that. spinning it with no oil sounded kinda scary haha.
so, i'll go ahead add the oil. if i turned the fuel valve to "off" on the fuel tank, do i also need to go ahead and turn off the petcock too?
i'm also a little confused about turning the fuel back. if i turn it back on wouldn't go and contaminate my new oil, while i look for the leak? or do you think it won't get into the oil this time? and about tapping on the carbs, i'm supposed to hit the 4 round bowl looking things on top of the carbs am i right? and how do i know if i shocked the floats loose? or do i just hope it got loose?  Carburetors are so confusing
Plus,is there anyway to visually tell if the pump is busted?
I have so many questions....and so eager to get her up and running again. it was running so well till now.  

First, the petcock is the fuel valve (one in the same). On/off

If you let it drain for an extended time it could go back into the oil. It would take a while... Shouldn't take that long to locate a leak. would have been better to focus on the fuel leak before changing the oil.

Tapping on the carbs referrers to tapping on the bottom bowels not the top of the carbs. (to help free up a needle and seat, sometimes it works).

If one of the needle and seats are stuck open fuel will come out one or both of the overflow hoses. The 2 larger drain hoses coming the the bottom of the carbs. That's why I want you to locate them. IF fuel is coming out that point then you can try to tap on the bowels to free up the needle. If it reseats then fuel will stop flowing. If not you will have to remove the carbs and clean and adjust. Lets don't go there yet...

Right now you just want to know where it is leaking. Then you can shut the fuel off and report from there. One step at a time.

There are various tests for the fuel pump but for now the easiest thing to do is just make sure it is hooked up and look for a fuel leak. That's the first problem THEN you can go into what it takes to fix it.
George

[itsdrock]

there's a big black plastic box thing(air filter/airbox?) right behind the carb that's obstructing my view from seeing the hoses. is it ok to remove this to get a better look? i noticed it's connected to each carb, and i don't wanna take it off it's gonna mess with the sync of the carbs or anything.
George: so you're telling me i should run the fuel before adding the oil(with the drain plug and filter still off)? i haven't put in any oil yet, i've been just visually inspecting it. i only can see one hose clearly, and that's the one i mentioned before(connected on the right side of the carb, about the same size as the fuel tank breather hose, and it's nestled directly behind the carb.) i couldn't see the others to see if they were leaking.

[FJscott]

To tell if fuel is getting past the pump when not running;

1- turn off fuel petcock on tank
2-remove hose from outlet side of pump
3- open fuel petcock

Does fuel come out of pump outlet?
Yes- replace pump
No- reinstall hose on pump outlet

If it was my bike, after determining that pump is OK I would;

DO NOT START OR ATTEMPT TO START THE BIKE UNTIL YOU GET THIS SORTED OUT.
DO NOT PUT FRESH OIL/FILTER IN UNTIL YOU ARE CERTAIN CARBS ARE NOT OVFERFILLING
DO ADD CLEAN OIL/FILTER AFTER YOU ARE SURE THE PROBLEM IS FIXED AND YOU ARE READY TO START THE ENGINE

1- drain all 4 float bowls, then close the drain screws
2- open the fuel petcock on tank
3-turn ignition key on, you should hear the pump running. at this time look for external leaks at all fuel hoses.

Note: if any leaks are seen, turn ignition key off. fix the leak, repeat step 3

Note: if no external leaks are detected and after the carbs are full of fuel the pump SHOULD turn itself off.start looking for signs of fuel coming from the overflow hoses, tap on the carbs to try and dislodge any crap that might be in the float needle seat.

if this does not work. drain the carbs again,and again and hopefully this draining and refilling repetition will flush all the bad stuff out.

while you are in there it would be wise to replace the fuel filter, they are cheap and you are already in there.

I wouldn't mess around with any seafoam or additives at this point. if you suspect bad gas, dirty tank drain it, flush it
and change the filter.

hopefully this solves your leaks and you can get back to your studies.

let us know how you make out and GOOD LUCK!

Scott

[movenon]

Thanks Scott 

Here is a picture of the carbs from the rear. The hose in the center with the braided covering is the fuel inlet coming from the fuel pump.
The larger lines , one between carbs 1&2 and one between carbs 3&4 are the bowel overflow hoses. They are the ones that will leak IF a needle and seat leaks.  The other 4 smaller hoses are air vents for the choke's.   
     

Yes it's hard to see them but they are there. As to the air box, it is a pain in the ass but can be removed. If your carbs have to be removed then the box has to be pulled. Don't do it yet.    FIRST figure out where the fuel is leaking........         

George                       

[Arnie]

Itsdrock,

WHERE are you located?  not asking for your street address, just the town/suburb name.

Perhaps one of the experienced FJ owner/mechanics on this list would be willing to help you.

At this point, you've had a lot of advice, most of it good but you seem not to have had enough experience to understand what they are trying to tell you.  That's ok, we all started at the same point - clueless, but before you either get frustrated and take your bike to a stealer (dealer) or do something damaging, get some help.

Arnie

[itsdrock]

I went out and bought a torque wrench, 4qts of oil, and an oil filter. I should be ready to handle most obstacles i may encounter tomorrow. since i have the tank off, i figure it will be best to clean out the gas tank too. It might be a little rusty on the inside, could that be messing with the carbs?
Scott: Thanks for the input, i shall try what you said.
George: I couldn't really see if the 2 bowl overflow hoses were leaking. However, the thin hose(on the very right side of your pic) for sure had fuel dripping out.  I understand how it could leak out through there when it's on the side, but why when it's upright?
Arnie: I am in Santa Ana.