Coil protection

[fj11.5]

 :biggrin:Sooooooo, that's why nobody shows up at george,s shed days ,,,

[Fj1200buggy]

Thanks for all the help everyone.

Ohm meter. Primary side 2.7 ohms + - 10%
               Secondary  12K         + - 20%

               Pick up coil resistance 120 ohms

George

Thanks, I tested the resistance between the black and orange and the black and red/white, it was around 160 ohms (Bit high?)
and the resistance between the orange and red/white was about 280 ohms.
Do you think thats the problem?

[movenon]

I am a little confused as to what you are measuring. Are you measuring the pick-up coils or the ignition coils ? What I am saying is your colors do not exactly match my wiring diagrams. Close but not exact.

Lets back up a little and do this:

1. Battery voltage 12 volts yes or no ?

2. "Main and engine stop switches are turned to "ON". Check for voltage (12V) on the "R/W" (red/white) lead at the TCI/ignitor unit and the ignition coils"   yes or no ??

3. Measure the pick coil resistance at the TCI/ignitor. 1984 manual indicates ( Black-orange) (Black-Gray). 1991 diagram they are W/R and W/G. You can go down to the pick up area and see what the 2 colors you are looking for... On the TCI / Ignitor box the two wires are in the smaller of the two connectors. Unplug this connector to measure.

If there is a solid black wire in the pick-up wiring (making it 3 wires) , that is a ground. The factory measurment is not from the 2 primary pick up wires to ground (the black wire). There should be no resistance between the 2 primary pick up wires and ground with the pick up disconected from the TCI /ignitor.

4. Now for the coils, the primary side (low voltage side / 12 volt). Unplug the 2 connectors, they are probably color coded. Measure the resistance in each terminal going to the coils. They should read around 2.7 ohms + or - 10%.

5. On the ignition coil secondary side (high voltage / plug wire side). Harder to measure. You should pull out the plug wire from the coil and measure right at the coil terminal to the ground of the coil (where it bolts on to the frame) this should be 12K + or  - 20%.
IF you measured from the spark plug cap center to ground you would get a way different reading as the cap I believe has resistance in it. The plug wire should be solid core (plain wire).

Start at the first step and work your way down.  Step "2" is important.

George

[Fj1200buggy]

I am a little confused as to what you are measuring. Are you measuring the pick-up coils or the ignition coils ? What I am saying is your colors do not exactly match my wiring diagrams. Close but not exact.

Lets back up a little and do this:

1. Battery voltage 12 volts yes or no ? Yes

2. "Main and engine stop switches are turned to "ON". Check for voltage (12V) on the "R/W" (red/white) lead at the TCI/ignitor unit and the ignition coils"   yes or no ?? Yes

3. Measure the pick coil resistance at the TCI/ignitor. 1984 manual indicates ( Black-orange) (Black-Gray). 1991 diagram they are W/R and W/G. You can go down to the pick up area and see what the 2 colors you are looking for... On the TCI / Ignitor box the two wires are in the smaller of the two connectors. Unpluged this connector to measure. Sorry I meant orange and grey.

If there is a solid black wire in the pick-up wiring (making it 3 wires) , that is a ground. The factory measurment is not from the 2 primary pick up wires to ground (the black wire). There should be no resistance between the 2 primary pick up wires and ground with the pick up disconected from the TCI /ignitor. ground(black) to grey/orange= 150-160 ohms, should be 0?. Orange to grey=280 ohms.

4. Now for the coils, the primary side (low voltage side / 12 volt). Unplug the 2 connectors, they are probably color coded. Measure the resistance in each terminal going to the coils. They should read around 2.7 ohms + or - 10%. The reading is just below 3 ohms (Im using an analog meter)

5. On the ignition coil secondary side (high voltage / plug wire side). Harder to measure. You should pulled out the plug wire from the coil and measure right at the coil terminal to the ground of the coil (where it bolts on to the frame) this should be 12K + or  - 20%. Did that-no reading, the previouse time I measured between the 2 spark plug leads  
IF you measured from the spark plug cap center to ground you would get a way different reading as the cap I believe has resistance in it. The plug wire should be solid core (plain wire).

Start at the first step and work your way down.  Step "2" is important.

George

Thanks, I really appreciate your help!

[movenon]

OK, MY bad on step 5....   You were correct to measure plug leed to plug leed.... That should be 12,000 ohms (12K) or there about + - 20%.

I will try to measure my pick up leed to verify your readings. In my feeble mind you should have no resistance/continuity from either pick up coil primary leed to ground. I will check on mine.

Sorry about the miss direction on step 5..
George

[Fj1200buggy]

Ok, so my coils are ok then if the primary is just under 3 ohms and secondary about 11k ohms?
Thanks again.

[movenon]

Good on the coils. I have a 1990 so my colors are or could be different than yours. My pick-up has 2 wires (just an inductive coil) Mine happens to be black and grey for what ever that is worth, look at yours, determine the colors right where the pick up wire go though the case to feed on up to the TCI /ignitor.

The smaller of the 2 connectors on the TCI has 4 leads. Look for the two that coreispond with the colors you noted at the pick up. Mine happens to read 166 ohms. With an ohm meter if you touch either two wires and go to ground (the engine) you should read 0.
Note: it is easier to "prob" in the back side of the connector...

If your pick up passes that test then your coils and pick up are OK.

George

[movenon]

If the pick up checks ok then the next step is to get into the side stand relay (later called a safety relay), side stand switch and the other interlocks.
What year is your bike ?

Question, with the kickstand up, in neutral, key on (just like your are going to start the bike), do you have a neutral light "on" in your instrument cluster ?

George

[Pat Conlon]

It's a buggy with a FJ engine in it..... Hence Erik's screen name...

[movenon]

Thanks Pat. Hard to trouble shoot electrical problems via the WEB. The only wiring diagrams I have are for 1984 and 1991. Someday I will get all of them.
Sounds to me that he has a short to ground in his system. Lord only knows how his buggy is wired.
Just trying to help... 
George

[Pat Conlon]

....Lord only knows how his buggy is wired.....

My thought exactly..... You have been a help, walking him through the bench testing his coils...

George, you are one of the MOST helpful members of our FJ family. 

[Capn Ron]

....Lord only knows how his buggy is wired.....

My thought exactly..... You have been a help, walking him through the bench testing his coils...

George, you are one of the MOST helpful members of our FJ family. 

I've thought the same thing...I've read through several old threads and each and every time, George is there with courteous, helpful, well thought out and thorough replies.  An encyclopedia of FJ knowledge and a real asset to this group.  Having met George at the 2013 WCR I can also say, he's a genuinely nice person, handles a crash pretty well and is a snappy dresser!   Okay, now we're just embarrassing the man! 

Cap'n Ron. . .

[Fj1200buggy]

Ok, I got a proper meter, all of the coils read between 3.6 and 3.8 ohms primary, 2 have readings of above 1 million ohms and the other 2 are 12.75k and 13.8k ohms secondary.
At the pickup ground to grey and orange is 170 ohms-must be 0? and between the grey and orange it is 324 ohms. So I presume my pickups are bad, but can that cause the coils and cdi to break?
I am still using the wiring from the bike.

[racerrad8]

...I was wondering if I can put a fuse between each coil and the cdi to prevent this from happening again, is it possible?
Thanks.

No.

Randy - RPM

[movenon]

Ok, I got a proper meter, all of the coils read between 3.6 and 3.8 ohms primary, 2 have readings of above 1 million ohms and the other 2 are 12.75k and 13.8k ohms secondary.
At the pickup ground to grey and orange is 170 ohms-must be 0? and between the grey and orange it is 324 ohms. So I presume my pickups are bad, but can that cause the coils and cdi to break?
I am still using the wiring from the bike.

"Can a grounded or shorted pick up cause the CDI or coils to break"..  Best guess is yes... IF the pick up primary leeds (grey and orange) have continuity to ground then you have a dead short going into the CDI / Ignitor box .

If you are going to replace the pick ups then I would say FIRST, do a physical check the wire's going from the pick up to the CDI / Ignitor (the entire length). Looking for a wire that is pinched, insulation worn etc. allowing one of the leeds to be grounded.
If you fail to check this and replace the pick ups it will smoke your replacements also.

My opinion is that you have a short to ground somewhere in that area. That's why the fuses blow.  

George