Nuts bolts screws and other fastners

[Troyskie]

G'day gang,

I'm getting close to re-assembly of my 11.

Most of the main bits, frame, plastics, etc are looking great.

How do I clean up all the fastners? The bike is down to complete zip, even the cases are currently empty, every fastner removed, sorted, separated etc. But there are literally dozens (hundreds?) of them and except for inside the engine they are mostly oxidised.

I've tried ultrasonic cleaning, ok, but corrosion is still corrosion on the nickel etc plating.

I've tried cleaning & polishing, but they'll oxidise again pretty quick (I'm not a polisher either).

I've tried wet blasting (vapour blasting) and the come up really nice, but the chrome, nickel etc. is still very thin and will rust in damaged/garked up spots.

I've tried electroplating them with great results, but there are soooo  many it will take a geologic age to get them all looking new and I'm not certain how good my plating is.

I've bought complete fastner bags from wreckers with some good ones, but it is a HUGE job matching them up to find a good one, and I'm always missing one of a set.

I'm so far down the resto path that I'd like to keep it as rigie-dig as possible (i.e. hex for hex, phillips or JIS for like). I did find a stainless set on fleabay, but it was mostly allen key style which I know is better, but not rigie-dig.

I'd even buy new ones, it shouldn't be too expensive (after what I've put in to get this far), but with so many I think I'd struggle to find the correct ones.

Any suggestions?

Troyskie

[Sparky84]

G'day Troy

No zinc platers down there that'll do small batches for you?

Cheers
Alan

[Millietant]

I've replaced loads of bolts on my bike with either cap head or button head stainless steel allen bolts, picked up at a local engineering supplies place for just a few pounds.

I basically just made a list of the length and diameter of each type I wanted and went down to the "nuts and bolts" shelf at the back of the store and filled a bag with what I needed (took some nuts so I could check the threads matched).  At the cash desk, the guy just took the bag in his hand, had look a look inside and said "how does £10 for the lot sound". I had well over 100 bolts in the bag and thought that was a great deal !

Now all the staff know me because I'm forever sitting on the floor in front of the bolt shelves counting out individual stainless bolts (for any odd length ones I just buy the nearest longer size and cut them down - takes seconds).

Solves the issue of them going rusty too.

[fj-f3a]

Greetings Troy

Please, don't get too hung up on Stainless Screws.
IMHO, they are not the bee all and end all.
From my experience, stainless screws and aluminium can be a bad mix. Galling.

As you may be aware, in the aviation industry, corrosion is one of the major maintenance issues.
During my apprenticeship in the late 70's, many a bolt was scrapped due to the smallest amount of corrosion being present, which could ultimately cause the bolt to fracture.

Something I just learned is the JIS (Japanese Industrial Standard) does not just apply to the screws holding the caps on our brake and clutch master cylinders, it applies to every screw on the bike.
That's why all the 8mm hex head screws are 12mm AF and not 13mm, the 10mm hex head screws are 14mm AF and not 17mm.

Personally, I would not be hesitant in change to high tensile socket head screws but, finding them in the fine threads may be difficult.

As for corrosion, after washing, a liberal coating of ACF-50 will do the trick.


Gavin

[Sparky84]

Somewhere like this, but maybe closer

https://www.sgwzincplating.com.au/

[Motofun]

SS and Aluminum are very close on the galvanic scale...this is good, much better than steel and aluminum.  Use a very little anti-seize and you are good to go.

[ribbert]

Like Gavin, I did an apprenticeship that involved some basic metallurgy, but over many ensuing decades I've found there is plenty or wriggle room between theory and practice in this regard. In other words, I've been installing SS screws into alloy for decades without detrimental consequences. Admittedly, I'm a anti-seize sort of guy and these are motorbikes not aircraft, but I've never had a problem (and they look really cool).

These are my favourite screw kit guys and I've had one of their kits on the FJ for many years. They come bagged up, labelled, legend, contents list on each bag, washers, nylon washers (for the screen) JIS are replaced with Philips, dome head, flat head, Allen head, tapered, counter sunk etc....it's all there. Honestly, every time I look at one of the kits I think what extraordinarily good value they are, if you were try and figure out the same lot by yourself.

Yamaha FJ1200
169-Piece Highly Detailed
Stainless Steel Screw Kit

About the Kit
Replace the scratched, nicked, rusted, missing, or damaged stock screws with these very attractive stainless steel socket head fasteners. This is a custom hand picked highly corrosion resistant, attractive, and durable stainless steel hardware screw kit to replace many of the stock fasteners on your Yamaha FJ1200. These shiny screws will stay beautiful for the life of the motorcycle. Kit is complete, well sorted, and highly detailed with full step-by-step instructions. Makes the perfect mini project and will enhance the already good looks of your bike.

Desmoparts crew painstakingly hand picked this kit for your machine. We pulled one stock screw at a time and replaced it with an equal stainless fastener. Documented and photographed each step to bring you a complete well sorted kit. We've been putting together stainless screw kits for select models since 2000.

The Yamaha FJ1200 stainless steel screw kit is a very high quality, well thought out, and extremely detailed kit. This intense 169-piece screw kit contains A2-70 and A4-70 grade metric stainless steel designed specifically for the very classy FJ1200 sportbike. The step-by-step instructions are written in plain English and are easy to follow. Our screws are Button, Cap, Low Cap, and Flat Head style requiring common Hex key tools. Self-tapping screws are all Phillips head stainless. Kit even includes nylon washers for the windscreen. Kit is designed specifically for the 1989-1993 bikes, yet also fits the early machines quite well but not perfectly. We do not as yet have a kit for the newer FJ1200.

The FJ1200 fasteners are separated into 7-zip lock bags and clearly labeled according to screw type and location. Assembly instructions correspond to bag ID. Difficulty level: medium. Buyer need only basic wrenching ability, some free shop time, and common tools. Stainless kits make a great weekend project or gift idea. Call us if you have any specific questions regarding our products or specific installation on your bike - 713/222-0832.

Kit includes screws to fit the following components:
brake and clutch reservoir covers
handlebar and control hardware
right and left engine covers
most all fairing hardware
kickstand safety switch
chain guard and guide
instrument panel
license plate kit
sprocket cover
mirror mounts
oil filter cover
starter cover
windscreen
front fender and much more



They come with multi page instructions describing location, bag numbers and installation (and the bags are correspondingly numbered)

I've fitted a lot of these to different bikes without issue.

Noel

[Millietant]

They look just like all the little bags I made up for myself Noel......it took bloody hours, sitting on the floor in the shop and then sorting them out on a table in my garage....bloody hours !!!!  .....but in a sad sort of way, I enjoyed it.

[red]

These are my favourite screw kit guys and I've had one of their kits on the FJ for many years. They come bagged up, labelled, legend, contents list on each bag, washers, nylon washers (for the screen) JIS are replaced with Philips, dome head, flat head, Allen head, tapered, counter sunk etc....it's all there. Honestly, every time I look at one of the kits I think what extraordinarily good value they are, if you were try and figure out the same lot by yourself.
Noel

Noel,

Nice.  Where do you get them?       
.

[Troyskie]

Thanks everyone  !

Although I'm not a polisher, and I've lost the love of going pure stock/concourse, I'm still bore-sighted on finishing an OEM resto for this bike (no others though  ). As far as OEM goes, the engine is not truly OEM as it has 1st oversize Wiseco pistons, and the modern internal updates from RPM. Also, even though the anti-dive is still connected it is running gold emulators and stiffer springs in the forks. I've luckily sourced a set of original 84 headers, collector, mufflers with only superficial surface rust. This system was removed during run-in by the original owner and only has 800miles on  . They are perfect inside. They will need polishing and the headers will need to have the black chrome re-done.

I'm steering clear of the ready SS sets purely cause I'm sooo far down the original resto path I'd like to keep my Effie stock. I might consider going this way for concealed fastners, but not sure yet. I will go this way for my 12 and my other project 11.

For ease of future maintenance I would prefer the SS allan key style, but it would be a big departure from what I've achieved so far.

I'm intimately familiar with the dissimilar metals issue, galvanic corrosion, hydrolysis of coatings etc.

I'm less familiar with the mechanical issues (galling as Gav mentioned).

I'm unlikely to want to coat the external fastners in a water disperser protector like ACF-50 as this will pick up heaps of dust and dirt.

Last night I did think of another method that would be suitable for bulk. I'll give it a go over the weekend and advise if it works.

If anyone has any other suggestions to keep her OEM, or a fastner list of length, diameter, thread guage I'd love to hear from you.

Troyskie

[Sparky84]

Long process but have you tried to get part numbers of bolts needed and see if Yamaha still stock them, sometimes the same bolts are used on later models. You will have to wait for the 10 weeks delivery from Japan.
Service Manual just lists size and pitch of thread not length.

I spoke to a bloke that doesn't toss any old bolts from doing restos and he just wire brushes them, then sends them to a plater that does small batches

[ribbert]

These are my favourite screw kit guys and I've had one of their kits on the FJ for many years. They come bagged up, labelled, legend, contents list on each bag, washers, nylon washers (for the screen) JIS are replaced with Philips, dome head, flat head, Allen head, tapered, counter sunk etc....it's all there. Honestly, every time I look at one of the kits I think what extraordinarily good value they are, if you were try and figure out the same lot by yourself.
Noel

Noel,

Nice.  Where do you get them?       
.

Red, this is the kit I used.
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Yamaha-FJ1200-Stainless-Steel-Screw-Kit-Bolt-Kit-with-169-stainless-fasteners/381948903198?hash=item58ededbf1e:g:OOwAAOSw4DJYlAYN&frcectupt=true

Noel

[X-Ray]

Agree with Noel, the Desmoparts screw kits are great value, and they do look good. I only have a kit on the '93 so far, might treat myself to a kit for the '94 and the '84 now, this thread has rekindled my interest in doing it,  

One thing is they unfortunatley do not have the replacement special screws for the timing cover (unless they have sourced then now)