Hello, Can my stock 1200 cylinders be bored for 1250 pistons...or do i need to sleeve it and clearance the cases? thanks.
From what I have seen with the overbore kits for the FJ. Up to the 1219 pistons you don't need sleeves. The 1250 and larger piston kits require sleeves and modification of the lower case.
My 2 cents added.... for any overbore, even the 1195 kit, I would invest in the RPM oil cooler for more oil cooling capability.
Fred
Quote from: turbocamino on August 13, 2013, 12:47:39 PM
Hello, Can my stock 1200 cylinders be bored for 1250 pistons...or do i need to sleeve it and clearance the cases? thanks.
No, you cannot use anything bigger that 1219 on the stock sleeves & cylinder block. The 1250 cylinder block has siamese cylinders and allows for the larger 1250+ sleeve.
The 1200 block are not and have a gap for air flow and when trying to fit the 1250 + sleeves there is not enough cast material for the sleeve.
So, you need to start with a 1250 block for the 1250+ pistons.
Yes, the cases have to be clearanced for the large sleeves.
Randy- RPM
Sorry about not getting all the information regarding the overbore sizing. I did know the 1250 needed sleeving, but I didn't know the 1250 cylinder block has siamese cylinders, and a stock 1200 cylinder block will not work. :pardon:
Thank you Randy for catching my omission.
Fred
Thanks guys for the reply's. Sounds like an expensive endeavor...that said...if i came across an XJR1250 block for 500.00 it sounds like i may be ahead of things?... was told its an aluminum bore with a chrome bore coating?...not at all familiar with that. Would this be a desirable starting point.
If you are planning on sleeving the block I would be less worried.
If you think you will get away with installing your 1250 pistons (79mm) in the existing niksil plated bores, I would not buy the block until you thoroughly checked it out.
The racers have found that the plated bores in the 1250 block oval out under the extreme stress of racing. This is not really a problem with street bikes, in fact there are a few advantages of the plated bore cylinders, they shed heat better, they have less surface friction, to name two...however, like other plated bores, when they are done...they are done. If the bores are not oval, you could send them out to be replated but many folks just press in new sleeves
I would just plan on new sleeves and be done with it.
....and as long as you are planning new sleeves, why stop at 79mm pistons? Randy @ RPM has some very tastey 82mm pistons. With the modern short skirt design and using narrow pins, these bad boys weigh in the same as your oem pistons..
(http://fjowners.com/gallery/1/49_13_02_11_11_40_19.jpeg)
Go ahead...you know that you want to....
Quote from: Pat Conlon on August 15, 2013, 04:42:39 PM
(http://fjowners.com/gallery/1/49_13_02_11_11_40_19.jpeg)
Go ahead...you know that you want to....
God Damn! God damn the pusher man. :lol:
Those are just dam NAUGHTY :biggrin:
Thanks Pat...for the nudge...Thats alot of piston to be throwing around. The 1250 block was said to be from a 17K stocker. Also trying to figure how well rings seat with a chrome cylinder ? ...and as to cost...sleeves,installing them and then the bore job. any idea of that cost?
Quote from: Pat Conlon on August 15, 2013, 04:42:39 PM
RPM has some very tastey 82mm pistons. With the modern short skirt design and using narrow pins, these bad boys weigh in the same as your oem pistons..
The 1219 pistons weigh a wopping 40g less (each) than standard.
Quote from: turbocamino on August 16, 2013, 08:50:36 AM
Thanks Pat...for the nudge...Thats alot of piston to be throwing around. The 1250 block was said to be from a 17K stocker. Also trying to figure how well rings seat with a chrome cylinder ? ...and as to cost...sleeves,installing them and then the bore job. any idea of that cost?
Call around. Check eBay. You can get a ovaled 1250 block fairly cheap...... I would guess a salvaged 1250 block with new sleeves, bored and finished honed for around $600-800. Remember you also need to have your engine case relieved to fit the 1250 block. You still need pistons, pins, and rings...you still need some 1250 rods...and with all the expected added torque, you should consider back cutting your tranny gears.
Might as well install some larger exhaust/intake valves....
See where I'm going with this?
I would expect to have *at least* $3k in engine parts/machine work before it is all said and done...realistically more like $4-5k.
Quote from: turbocamino on August 16, 2013, 08:50:36 AM
The 1250 block was said to be from a 17K stocker.
Where did you find a 1250 block in the US, or did you get it from Europe?
Randy - RPM
Quote from: racerrad8 on August 16, 2013, 04:04:39 PM
Quote from: turbocamino on August 16, 2013, 08:50:36 AM
The 1250 block was said to be from a 17K stocker.
Where did you find a 1250 block in the US, or did you get it from Europe?
Randy - RPM
Here is a 1250 cylinder block, Andrews Motorsports in North Carolina.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Legends-Race-Car-600-INEX-Yamaha-FJ-FJ1100-FJ1200-XJR1250-Cylinder-Block-/180490850307?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2a0617d003&vxp=mtr#ht_767wt_1161 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Legends-Race-Car-600-INEX-Yamaha-FJ-FJ1100-FJ1200-XJR1250-Cylinder-Block-/180490850307?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2a0617d003&vxp=mtr#ht_767wt_1161)
Fred
Quote from: aviationfred on August 16, 2013, 04:11:02 PM
Here is a 1250 cylinder block, Andrews Motorsports in North Carolina.
Fred
Yep, I now there is access to new ones in the US, I have sold plenty of them for the race car crowd. I personally do not stock them as they are a very expensive item to sit on the shelf.
I can supply just as much and more as Andrews does and usually at better pricing.
That is a lot of money to buy a cylinder to bore out and sleeve for the 82mm pistons.
My question possibly wasn't worded correctly...
Quote from: turbocamino on August 16, 2013, 08:50:36 AM
...The 1250 block was said to be from a 17K stocker.
Where did you find a 1250 block
with 17K in the US, or did you get it from Europe?
Randy - RPM
Quote from: turbocamino on August 13, 2013, 10:25:19 PM
was told its an aluminum bore with a chrome bore coating?...not at all familiar with that. Would this be a desirable starting point.
That is correct, the sleeves in the 1250/1300 cylinder block are a thin wall nikasil material sleeve. They are not a locally serviceable sleeve and once they are over-size, out of round or tapered you must have them bored out to fit the oversize steel sleeves. You can either just bore them out for replacement 1250 sleeves and resize back to the stock 1250 pistons or you need to overbore the cylinder to fit the larger OD sleeves for the big bore stuff...
Randy - RPM
I had hoped i could but 1250 pistons,pins,rings and get on with it...as the bores are said to be "just fine". Patty,are you trying to get me to go racing again. I keep telling myself that im done with that!(http://[img][url=http://s1116.photobucket.com/user/kaw-zx/media/Picture018.jpg.html%5D%5BIMG%5Dhttp://i1116.photobucket.com/albums/k576/kaw-zx/Picture018.jpg)[/URL]
(http://i1116.photobucket.com/albums/k576/kaw-zx/Picture018.jpg)
Er.....That is not a 530 X 110 zzz chain is it????
Quote from: turbocamino on August 16, 2013, 07:02:36 PM
I had hoped i could but 1250 pistons,pins,rings and get on with it...as the bores are said to be "just fine". Patty,are you trying to get me to go racing again. I keep telling myself that im done with that!
(http://i1116.photobucket.com/albums/k576/kaw-zx/Picture018.jpg)
Fixed it for you...
Now, I am still interested if you bought the cylinders in the US or overseas as you were told they had 17K on them.
If they are US cylinders and that is 17K of race car miles, they are worn out, out of round & tapered and will not offer what you are hoping for.
If they are from a bike with 17K, you should at least have the cylinders measured for wear in reference to the piston size, taper & out or round as well.
Then you are going to have to have the cases machined to fit the cylinder/sleeves into the case. And from there you really need to give some thought the the connecting rods. The FJ rod is very weak on the big end and have trouble maintaining a round bore, the XJR rod was designed to eliminate this problem.
Unfortunately there is no "drop them on and run" when going up to the bigger 1250+ bore.
Randy - RPM
Quote from: FJmonkey on August 16, 2013, 07:15:42 PM
Er.....That is not a 530 X 110 zzz chain is it????
Mark ..thats your garden variety Tsubaki funnybike chain...brutal isnt it!
Randy - RPM " Unfortunately there is no "drop them on and run" when going up to the bigger 1250+ bore. "
To be clear....i havent bought them...and i have zero thoughts of racing this bike..its just a cruiser and was hoping to do just as you stated..."drop them in and run" My stocker only has 15K and hoped that the bottom end,trans and rods would handle it ...as RPM's would rarely hit 9000. If im kidding myself...feel free to pop my bubble :cray: