Good evening everyone,
Since DavidR has began the conversation re: the rear shock, I can only assume the gentleman from R.P.M would authorize my observations of the new rear shock... I could call him and ask, but who would still be awake in the middle of the night...?
By chance, I had the good fortune to be in need of a valve adjustment when the shocks arrived at the R.P.M. shop. Unlike when I had to be induced into installing the Fork Valves, I readily agreed to purchase the rear shock. In fact, almost the opposite - Randy had reservations because of the lack of actual road miles on the unit. As with everything else from R.P.M. it looks first class and performs even better.
My observations mirror DavidR's, however permit me to buttress that statement with 5,800 additional miles of testing & observations. In the past several months, I have had the opportunity to ride a WIDE variety of roads, both back road & extended freeway riding. It is a fact that I traveled the many freeways of the San Francisco Bay Area, many of which are in poor repair, for no other reason than to experience the performance of the shock under a myriad of road conditions, and have conveyed my observations to Randy via e-mails, telephone and the occasional visit to his shop. I have also encountered many types of weather, from comfortable climate to driving rain in this time period.
Also, when I installed the shock, in addition to having Randy service the motorcycle, I purchased new tires at the same time (I had then sent via UPS to my favorite tire installer) so that I would ensure I would not be limited by either tires or mechanical problems. So to speak, I started with a clean slate. Also, I have the adjustable dog bones, and I (importantly in this regard) prefer the rear wheel almost in the stock position, just a shade lower [although I am not quite 5' tall, I have never had the problem of quick side to side transitions that others have mentioned, I guess 'cause I'm not as old as some of the others].
And it should be noted that although I am by no means an expert, or perhaps even qualified from an engineering perspective to make such an evaluation, Randy is absolutely qualified and to this end, following each ride and I have provided to him numerous e-mails, phone calls and the occasional visit describing my observations. I also have turned my camera around and have taken quite a bit of video, showing how the shock works in a multitude of situations. The rear wheel is NEVER stationary. When I first made a video, I thought the freeway was smoother and thus there would be nothing to see; however when we reviewed the video, the wheel was always in motion, a true Gold Wing like ride.
Highway Ride: Davide mentions a Gold Wing like ride. That is exactly as I described it to Randy, calling it "Gold Wing territory". It floats when it should and absorbs quick, sharp impacts when needed.
And as good as the freeway and highway ride is, the quick staccato like bumps are absorbed so well that where I used to weight the pegs to minimize the pounding that would be transmitted to the rider, it is all but eliminated. I have video of the rear wheel in a right hand sweeper taking an incredible pounding as I enter a freeway, and a fabled Ducati with his suspension was unable to keep pace (in the high 80's).
As I explained it to Randy, sharp & quick bumps can only be described as follows: place the bike on the center stand and have some beat on the frame with a rubber mallet, you will feel the impact but it will not be transmitted to the rider.
Another video shows the old FJ cruising along with a Yamaha R1 at exactly 110 mph just as smooth as sitting in your easy chair.
I have an axillary fuel tank and soft luggage that I use on cross country rides. The testing included traveling the the same roads with full fuel and low fuel loads (a difference of 10 gallons, or about 60 to 70 pounds) with no felt change in the suspension action. I have not had the opportunity to ride with a passenger (the USD's gets the chicks) but I would speculate that a minimum of preload adjusting would be needed.
DavidR mentions the drive off of corners; it is a correct that the improvement is very noticeable. As with the Fork Valves, which keep the front end tracking very well (which is why I feel I was able to keep pace with the Hayabusa, which I described in a post some time ago; while he drifted wide, I was able to get the inside track and shorten the distance between corners). The wheel is tracking so well that there is a noticeably less tendency to "spool up" when applying power as you exit a turn, it is especially noticeable if the road surface is exceptionally beat up.
It is a fact that when you have the the suspension settings dialed in, there is a particular zone, or for lack of a better description, a rather eerie but very certain and definable "harmonic window" where smooth takes on a whole new sensation. Perhaps more on that later. In fact when I hit the deer recently, that is exactly what I was doing motoring along at 4:00 am on a mostly deserted freeway.
All in all, in my qualified opinion, I must say that the gentlemen from R.P.M. has achieved yet another resounding success.
Ride carefully,
Mike Ramos.
Nice report Mike :biggrin:
You hit a deer?
This report makes me want (need) a new rear shock even more.
Leon
Quote from: 1tinindian on March 18, 2013, 07:36:42 PM
You hit a deer?
This report makes me want (need) a new rear shock even more.
Leon
Leon couldn't agree more with you I have a Penske rear and now I want
Randys new rear shock :empathy2: going have to work some extra shifts :rofl:
Quote5,800 additional miles of testing & observations. In the past several months
Mike,
You're such a slacker. I'd expect more miles from you in a few months. :rofl2: Sorry to hear about the deer, but glad you're alright.
Hey Carey screw the deer l hope the FJ is good, deer season should be longer!! :sarcastic:
So, was there "flight time" involved, like in David's test.............Or did the RPM shock just absorb the whole deer? :unknown:
I hit a deer at 70mph once with my Firehawk...........It involved "flight time"................for the deer.
If Mike had a set of USD's he prolly could have avoided the deer....
Hey, I'm just saying...... (popcorn)
Quote from: Pat Conlon on March 18, 2013, 09:26:30 PM
If Mike had a set of USD's he prolly could have avoided the deer....
Hey, I'm just saying...... (popcorn)
stiring the shit again eh? I like it....
Quote from: Pat Conlon on March 18, 2013, 09:26:30 PM
If Mike had a set of USD's he prolly could have avoided the deer....
No doubt... although pine cones appear to be the weakness! :rofl2:
Frank
Quote from: Flynt on March 18, 2013, 09:37:11 PM
Quote from: Pat Conlon on March 18, 2013, 09:26:30 PM
If Mike had a set of USD's he prolly could have avoided the deer....
No doubt... although pine cones appear to be the weakness! :rofl2:
Frank
Pine cones who mentioned pine cones (http://i1064.photobucket.com/albums/u371/Dash16170/759.jpg)
Monkey you would remember this corner :biggrin:
Quote from: baldy3853 on March 19, 2013, 12:21:13 AM
Pine cones who mentioned pine cones (http://i1064.photobucket.com/albums/u371/Dash16170/759.jpg)
Monkey you would remember this corner :biggrin:
Its in my GPS titled "Klavdy's Corner", it gets the occasional salute when I ride past it.
Quote from: FJmonkey on March 19, 2013, 06:44:04 AM
Quote from: baldy3853 on March 19, 2013, 12:21:13 AM
Pine cones who mentioned pine cones (http://i1064.photobucket.com/albums/u371/Dash16170/759.jpg)
Monkey you would remember this corner :biggrin:
Its my GPS titled "Klavdy's Corner", it gets the occasional salute when I ride past it.
That's quite funny have that picture stored as Klavs corner :biggrin:
That picture is close to the lane and does not show the large paved pull out area where K-Man's FJ slid nearly 300 feet scrubbing off speed. Then it hit the mountain (much like you see in the picture but covered in shrub) with enough force to bent the forks and tweak the frame. What a day... His gear did its job and had less injuries than expected for someone loosing a game of dodge the pine cones.
Good evening,
Here is an e-mail to the gentleman from R.P.M sent soon after the rear shock installation.
It is dated December 22, 2012. I started at about 2:00 or 3:00 am.
The reason I left the bike in Redding is that there was a considerable amount of snow where I live.
If there is additional interest, I will post other updates as I can find them in my e-mail mail box.
Ride carefully,
Mike Ramos.
Morning Randy,
I arrived at my son's home in Redding from Walnut Creek earlier this morning...
When I started to ride again I told my son that if I crash & not die, to turn off life support after 48 hours. I have since told him that if I crash and do die, to make sure that your shock is returned to you before the bike is junked. And it may not be so far fetched as it seems...!
It was raining when I left Walnut Creek and between the Carquniz Bridge and the the 505 cutoff it poured... there is indeed a "harmonic" window with your suspension & I experienced it first hand on Hwy 505 - passing a line (Holiday traffic I suppose as usually traffic is sparse) of cars riding into what appeared to be a driving wind from the front in heavy rain; it was just phenomenal.
Somewhere before Williams it stopped raining but the road remained very wet. I was able to enter the the "window" several other times as well, learning what to look for.
The rear end does drop out in a particular type of depression, it seems to be of the type when the pavement stops or begins as the road crosses a bridge - it could be at either end. But it does not have to be just at a bridge crossing. Quite comfortable...
As of now, I still feel as if the "floating" is normal & is a correct response to the road surface.
Now bear in mind that I was not in some type of Zen like utopia on a bright sunny day; it was cold and the first half was in a pouring, driving rain. I usually stay in the low 70's on Hwy 5 but this morning despite the fine suspension experience I wished for the ride to end & I really wanted my donut & hot chocolate at my favorite donut shop in Anderson; so I bumped up my cruise speed.
My bike has always been extraordinarily smooth at particular cruise speeds (thus no Vibranators); this suspension, when it enters that "window" makes the ride a unique experience. Very cool, pretty neat.
Another 205 miles so we are up to 800 miles on the shock.
I wonder if #1 - decrease the rear spring preload two turns as suggested and if that will allow the shock valve to operate more efficiently & #2 - to decrease the fork preload a notch to balance the front & rear together. I did increase the front because of the stiff rear spring on my sport shock.
It snowed even in Redding when I was gone so it is apparent that while we may get the settings refined for the open road, the sport aspect may take awhile because of the winter weather. I may go to San Diego over the New Year Holiday and there may be some country roads there, however there will be very heavy traffic so I do not know how productive that would be. I'll let you know as plans firm up - road trips are usually rather spontaneous.
I'll be away from a computer the next day or two. Call if any questions or if I need to expound upon anything.
Mike.
Hello everyone,
Below is another update that I emailed to the gentleman from R.P.M. I mailed him the chip from the camera for his viewing. I was in Walnut Creek when I sent this email to Randy.
I switched the camera over to the right side as to show the brake caliper which gives an improved view of the up & down movement of the rear wheel.
Changes or additions are in [ ] to clarify.
Impressions of the shock's performance are self-explanatory.
The date is January 6 of this year.
Good evening Randy,
[ ] I took tomorrow (Monday) off and motored down here to Walnut Creek.
No editing is available so I am mailing you the chip from the camera for your viewing. There are three sequences to review.
On my way home from here last week I turned on the camera (it was mounted on the left side) at a Valero gas station in Red Bluff. As I rode I thought this road (Hwy 5) is too smooth to show anything. Well, the wheel is actually quite active soaking up the road's imperfections. This was the morning it was 28* in Willows and thirty minutes later in red Bluff it seemed just as cold. At 4:30 into it I exit and then accelerate hard - no apparent 'jacking' of the rear end. The rest is mundane.
Coming here today, I mounted the camera on the right side. The brake caliper gives a better relationship (up & down movement) as you can see it move better than just the rim.
When I turn the camera on at a stop sign (a road goes off to the left) I accelerate to 90+ twice. I was going to head for the mountains [west of Red Bluff] at that time (before coming here) but the roads remain quite wet in sections. In fact, the roads were damp & wet all the way down here. Watch this sequence for awhile after I enter Hwy 5 - some pretty good bumps are encountered. You can hear the thudding of the wheel as I do my best to ride the bumps between lanes.
The time I turn the camera on at an off ramp is on Midway Road on the 505 cutoff just before it ends as it enters Hwy 5. At 2:40 into it I enter the very rough right hand sweeper that enters Hwy 5 @ 85 mph, however I am unable to maintain that speed through the turn because the damp road surface spooked me. I entered Hwy 5 in the high 70's. You can see the wheel taking shot after shot, not much if any is transmitted to the rider. Look at the fender (especially here but when any bump is encountered at any time); the relationship of the fender to the road remains unchanged - it may be the camera but I do not think so. Apart from gripping the tank with my knees, I sat normally, no weight on the pegs at all. Pretty darn tootin cool..!
Now on to my impressions on the ride itself: before I left Redding (my son's home - still snow at my place) I lowered the shock pre-load two full turns. I left the fork pre-load the same for now. Judging by how far the suspension dipped when I rocked off of the center stand, as judged by the side stand clearance to the floor, the static heights appear to be unchanged.
This (as I describe it) "harmonic' window has indeed increased, or should I phrase it as it has widened its' latitude?
I can, under highway conditions at least, confidentially state there is no undue "float" that is not attributable to the road surface. I now have 1,200 miles on the shock without having any dry back country roads to travel...
Today it was almost unnerving at times - uncanny may no longer be a descriptive enough word. Touch the tips of your fingers together and flex them steadily against each other until you get the sensation (they feel as if) they are on a pane of glass. That particular and most peculiar feeling is quite unreal and I find it rather unsettling, as is the sensation I get from time to time when the "harmonics" all come together. I actually look around and ask myself if I am at a movie watching the road go past or am I really out here on the open road?
I head home early Tuesday morning [ ]. I plan to lower the spring pre-load one notch to see if it balances the rear setting.
I'll mail the chip to you, mail it back or I'll pick it up next time I'm at your shop.
Good night & take care,
Mike.
I am not sure if you guys understand, Mike has been having to keep all of this information under his hat for many months since the shock has been on his bike. He has been very detailed in his notes and does not ever question any of the adjustments I have asked him to make. He has kept an open mind and been a major asset to testing. Sometimes it is very hard to change things when you are happy with the performance, but Mike has made every change I have asked of the shock. Sometimes it got better and others it got worse, but that is the testing process.
I know it seems like time is crawling by on the introduction of the shock, but it is because of guys like Mike, David and several others not associated with the FJ that have put in 1000's of testing miles behind the scenes. Between the two shocks we have exceeded 12,000 miles of testing and the number increases everyday.
I have just posted and update here on the progress of the shock over at David's truly unauthorized post;
Totally Unauthorized Teaser for the RPM Shock (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=8658.0)
Stay tuned for more information in the coming weeks as I hope to get all of the pieces in place and be able to get you guys the availability date & price.
Randy - RPM
Good morning,
Well, here is description that was sent to the gentleman from R.P.M. of a 104 mile ride this past January 8. Particular questions that were addressed was if the shock was "floating'' inappropriately and its' ability to absorb quick, hard "jolts". The weather remained poor for back country riding so to address these questions I rode different kinds of Bay Area freeways.
I am in the Bay Area at the moment, leaving for the far northern area of the state. There is nice weather here and by early evening I should be in the Hwy 36 area. If the weather hold, I will have some video of a few country roads.
Have fun everyone,
Mike Ramos.
Randy: It is almost 9:00 & I get up at 1:30 am (on the road by 2:00) so I have to condense this...
Good evening,
It has been a very hectic weekend - I had to stay an extra day unexpectedly - [ ] I went to San Jose (Alum Rock exit) on a linguicia run (if you like it I'll bring some next visit) -
Before I left I set the fork pre-load to the first notch (it was on #2). I think I like the # 2 better; however I did put washers in so as to split the difference between notches. My intuition tells me that I will remove the washers and leave it there on #2. I do not have the tools here so we'll have to wait. I plan to leave it on this setting for the ride in the morning.
I left here and took Hwy 680 all the way. Traffic was light and moving high 70's mph. Without question I suspect that I am watching a movie; however I know I am not. Just a most strange almost unnerving sensation...
Prior to the Sunol grade I see a motorcycle way ahead and so I pick it up a notch; however he is riding just like me - favoring the slow lanes and motoring along just a few mph faster than the general traffic, not tail-gating at all when he gets behind a slower car & patient to pass.
I finally catch up to him on the far side of the grade. It is an older fully fared BMW with smallish saddlebags & top trunk - the engine is the in-line four that lays on its' side. I set off to his right for quite some time with one lane between us, just behind him so that I can observe his suspension working. His does not seem to be articulating as much as mine; I do believe the FJ rides smoother. His bike is older, skinny tires & all, however it is a highway bike. But then I have to return [Walnut Creek] here so I pass him and motor on to the Alum Rock exit.
A few miles of surface streets & to the linguicia factory.
I decide to take Hwy 101 back to Walnut Creek, looking for different road surfaces. I make my way over to Hwy 880 and in the slow lane is the new 6 cylinder touring BMW with very wide saddle bags & top trunk. I set off on his left and BAM he travels over the joint between the pavement & the overpass. It was quite a jar, I saw his arms shake and the bike really jolted him. I was one lane over so I cannot say that the FJ absorbed it better but it does lay to rest (for now) the fact that once in awhile I get jolted. I am thinking it is the road as much as anything to do with the suspension.
So, I know that Hwy 13 (Warren Fwy) has a somewhat smooth surface; however it is an up & down surface that really makes a car float. I make my way over there via Hwy 238 & 580 (MacArthur). Hwy 13 is short, however the surface is as expected and undulating. The suspension "floats" in a most appropriate and predictable manner. Just as it should.
I cruise back through the Caldecott Tunnel and arrive here just elated. It was 47 miles to San Jose & 104 when I arrived here again.
It was quick & just a fantastic ride. It was significantly a ride to remember.... In broad day light no less! I searched and found just about every kind of road surface and the FJ suspension worked very well. I even shadowed two BMW's from two different eras. I do wish the 6 cylinder stayed on the road longer however he was not exiting to another freeway but to a surface street.
Because I cannot get any back road riding in I have taken to accelerating over bumps, especially sharp bumps and the rear shock really seems to handle it extremely well. More on that aspect later.
A note on the ride on the night time 505 in the rain two weeks ago: That was just an incredible ride - on par with the night time triple digit sojourn through the mountains in Arizona on my way back from the ECFR.
IMPORTANTLY: I enjoy all aspects of [street] motorcycling and your products, time & energy has allowed me pure enjoyment on the open road. I do thank you.
Continued success & take care,
Mike.