It is time to do the turbo.....does anyone have any suggestions as to what set of carbs would be recommended for this application. I have heard that the HSR42 Mikuni's are ideal (for a draw through set up) but I am designing a blow through system so I will be looking for a rack. Racerman let me know that the Keihin's are awesome but he said that they are without a choke which might create some problems being in a cooler climate as well as the extra load with the turbine spooling off the exhaust. Any suggestions are welcome.
CanDman
(popcorn)
:cray: :shok: :diablo: :dash1: :mad: :ireful: :wacko2: :bad:
Bob W
I highly recommend the mikuni...i had tried the s&s and it was ok at full throttle, but stumbled some through the midrange ....tried the lectron but wouldnt idle quite right (for me)...I spoke to Terry Kizer at MR. Turbo,who set up a 42 Mikuni and it was almost perfect out of the box...best 480.oo (!) i spent to date. I think i had to raise the needle some for my application. As for pressurizing a set of stock carbs... be prepared for a lot of sorting out...i know some have been successful but it will take knowledge and time and may never be as good as the mikuni,in my opinion.
Mikuni makes many different models. Take a look at the TMR roller flat slides, which have a choke.
Speaking of choke, wait 'till you see the price.....
With the boost pressure pushing against the slides, I would make sure they have rollers so they open and close smoothly until the point where your BOV opens.
Quote from: weymouth399 on November 14, 2012, 07:13:30 AM
:cray: :shok: :diablo: :dash1: :mad: :ireful: :wacko2: :bad:
Bob W
:praising: :drinks: :lol: :dance2: :mail1: :blush: :good: (popcorn) :rofl: :bye:
Paul seems to think that my problems are carb and fuel related...so instead of throwing money at a new FJ carb.....I might as well move forward with the my original plan. I have almost everything part for the mod so it only makes sense to move forward I know you don't approve mom... :ireful:....but I promise to let you ride her at the rally next year...and I have a feeling your going to get off on CanD with a permanent grin....lol
Kev
Goet....thx for the popcon
TC.........thx for your input
and Felix....always good to hear from you..........
I would love to grab a set of HSR42's....but I read on Mr. Turbo's web site that that particular Carb was ideal for a draw through set up.....I am not sure how to use it with the Blow through set I am designing....I will look at it again but it looks like a single carb rather then a rack...unless I am missing something. I have a plenum that will send the cooled air into the carbs....It has 4 ports ......one each carb........I am mounting the turbo directly in front of the exaust ports. I actually should start a thread in the FJ PROJECT WRITE UPS section........and do that.....I will do some research.... :mail1:
Kev
Quote from: CanDman on November 14, 2012, 05:19:44 PM
Quote from: weymouth399 on November 14, 2012, 07:13:30 AM
:cray: :shok: :diablo: :dash1: :mad: :ireful: :wacko2: :bad:
Bob W
:praising: :drinks: :lol: :dance2: :mail1: :blush: :good: (popcorn) :rofl: :bye:
Paul seems to think that my problems are carb and fuel related...so instead of throwing money at a new FJ carb.....I might as well move forward with the my original plan. I have almost everything part for the mod so it only makes sense to move forward I know you don't approve mom... :ireful:....but I promise to let you ride her at the rally next year...and I have a feeling your going to get off on CanD with a permanent grin....lol
Kev
There's nothing wrong with your carbs that a cleaning wouldn't fix. :yes: And 4 choke plungers, bad PO.
I hope it all works for ya, keep me informed, need anything you know how to get ahold of me.
She's a good slut, be good to her. :biggrin:
Bob W
Quote from: weymouth399 on November 15, 2012, 11:06:41 AM
Quote from: CanDman on November 14, 2012, 05:19:44 PM
Quote from: weymouth399 on November 14, 2012, 07:13:30 AM
:cray: :shok: :diablo: :dash1: :mad: :ireful: :wacko2: :bad:
Bob W
:praising: :drinks: :lol: :dance2: :mail1: :blush: :good: (popcorn) :rofl: :bye:
Paul seems to think that my problems are carb and fuel related...so instead of throwing money at a new FJ carb.....I might as well move forward with the my original plan. I have almost everything part for the mod so it only makes sense to move forward I know you don't approve mom... :ireful:....but I promise to let you ride her at the rally next year...and I have a feeling your going to get off on CanD with a permanent grin....lol
Kev
There's nothing wrong with your carbs that a cleaning wouldn't fix. :yes: And 4 choke plungers, bad PO.
I hope it all works for ya, keep me informed, need anything you know how to get ahold of me.
She's a good slut, be good to her. :biggrin:
Bob W
you know I love my little dirty girl....but we had a chat some 4 yrs ago....and she's been patient with me..... she made me promise to give her a major makeover.....including a little extra boost....and I am determined to keep my word. At here age she doesn't like the young punks poken fun at her....so I committed myself to giving her back her pride and her glory.......and she is busting at the prospect of having some extra legs to kick some Kawasaki and Suzuki butt !!!! Besides ....once the mod is done.......it's not going to be easy to see anything different.....she begged me to keep her looking like an "old sleeper".......... and as matter of fact....she did ask specifically for you......and for your wonderful touch.....that girl loves you.........almost as much as me........ALMOST....NOT QUITE ......LOL :drinks:
CanD's man
Don't even bother with carbs if your going to drive this thing on the street. Step up to EFI before you spend any money on carbs. My Civic turbo daily driver (when on four wheels) drives like a kitten and gets 35+ mpg , runs cool , and does everything a stock civic does. When on boost it's an animal. I do all the work myself, including the tuning. I've seen several carb bikes converted to EFI, both turbo and NA, including a 2 stroke Honda cr500 road race bike. After working with the civic, I wouldn't even consider doing a carbed turbo.
Quote from: RACER111V on November 15, 2012, 08:40:37 PM
Don't even bother with carbs if your going to drive this thing on the street. Step up to EFI before you spend any money on carbs. My Civic turbo daily driver (when on four wheels) drives like a kitten and gets 35+ mpg , runs cool , and does everything a stock civic does. When on boost it's an animal. I do all the work myself, including the tuning. I've seen several carb bikes converted to EFI, both turbo and NA, including a 2 stroke Honda cr500 road race bike. After working with the civic, I wouldn't even consider doing a carbed turbo.
Hey Glen...nice to hear your voice...you are going to laugh....but 2 yrs ago when debating which way to go...I grabbed a throttle body from an 07 fjr that looks like it would work....I also grabbed a Bazzaz Z-F1 fuel injection and traction control systems to go with.....I was very serious about going with EFI but I couldn't find anyone who wanted to tackle it........I have everything for this project.....even a surge tank from an 82 seca turbo...what's cool about this tank is that it has a secondary fuel supply that feeds into the top of the surge tank when boost kicks in....it is activated by a pressure valve.....there is also a drain plug for the excess fuel that collects. There is a built in relief valve as well as a reed valve..... I was seriously thinking about installing a secondary fuel tank (a very small 2 litre tank) filled with 110 octane that could be shot into the surge tank when necessary. I would deffinitely be intersted in discussing this further with you.....but Pleeeeease don't tell....you know who........ :ireful: :mad: :diablo:........ lol
PM me and lets talk .....
Kev
just sayin i have my fj running pretty decent with megasquirt turbo and its done 114 eight mile with a pretty much broken off turbo header-i can guide you thru the process if you want to give it a try-sherwood
Wow I must say I am overwhelmed by everyone's interest.....I am certainly venturing into uncharted waters.....but I do have a concept and have been malling things over and over in my head. The biggest hurdle for me was to keep CanD's sexy stock look......the last thing I want to do is turn her into the bride of Frankenstein ......with pipes and valves and hoses coming out everywhere......this was the primary reason for going with a Blow through set up as opposed to a draw through(plus I don't want to cook my nuts!!!!!!!). I am designing the system to start right in front of the exhaust ports....where the turbo will be mounted. I like it there because I want to minimize turbo lag but I also want to utilize the oil cooler's position directly above it so a scavenge pump will not be required. Positioning the turbo (a GARRETT T-25 /a spare from my 300zx tt) here also will allow me to install a small 10.5"x 7.25" mini radiator right below it between the frame. The radiator will send coolant through to a small cylindrical liquid intercooler I am planning to mount above the tire hugger right under the seat(tons of room). The intercooler would fire the compressed air directly into the plenum or surge tank which are lined up with the throttle bodies or carbs(which ever I go with). Q. How are you going to run your pipe through to where your battery is sitting? Good question !!!. The answer ... I am planning to take out the tool kit and re locate a new racing battery to that location.....was even going to use the rubber strap. :mail1:....I just need to extend the terminal wires to the rear.....The intake on the compressor would have a down pipe with a K&N filter....I was planning to situate at the hole of the lower chin cowling with a screen. Another down pipe was going to direct the exhaust from the turbo to the 2 mufflers I have on the bike. And the compressed air was going to be directed down under the bike and then back up through the frame (split pipes....one on either side) and along the sides towards the tail and into the intercooler...hidden under the seat.....this is the design I have and I am hoping to get started on it soon. I really appreciate all the interest and help.....and will start posting everything once I decide which way to go and once the project gets started. All pointers and tips are greatly appreciated.....thank you !!!
CanDman
I'm building an EFI Turbo FJ at the moment, I have a proper read when I've a bit more time but happy to pass on any details I have setting the plot up, which will be Xmas time.
Quote from: Havoc on November 16, 2012, 04:38:26 AM
I'm building an EFI Turbo FJ at the moment, I have a proper read when I've a bit more time but happy to pass on any details I have setting the plot up, which will be Xmas time.
Then I'll be creating Havoc 2......... :mail1: That sounds awesome.....bro....I'll look forward to it..........well at least I'm not the only Lune out there......... :mocking:
Kev
Interesting i still have GT 25 and i also had a set of FJR Throttle Bodies that i was going to throw on my XJR but now its all changed and im back to using the stock FJ Carbs and decided to Turbo the FJ instead. I bought a low Klm Set of Piston and Barrels from a late model XJR1300 with only 10k on them Forged Pistons with Nicosil Bores apparently all the go for Turbo stress and heat disapation. All the trouble to get the EFI right on and off boost scared me off the EFI sure i gather it must be the best set up if money or tuning is not an issue but from what my research has found that a correctly set up blow thru Carb set up is far easier to get close to right by paying attention to the venturi to carb pressure that compensates for the boost equally and if you are an old school mechanic such as myself at least i understand what i need to do to get it right. There is some great info out there but very little about Turboing FJs the odd XJR has been done but Turbo FJs although out there don't seem to get on the Internet. Good luck with your build and you should start ( or have you already) a FJ Turbo thread resource pages where we can log any of our issues and findings so at least other wondering soles turboing FJ 1200s may have a decent place to start looking for info.
I found these great for basics
and there is a section in turbo-bike for pressurizing the R1 carbs which have the same connections as FJ/XJR carbs
http://www.turbo-bike.com/ (http://www.turbo-bike.com/)
http://www.unclebobsturbos.com/newbie.html (http://www.unclebobsturbos.com/newbie.html)
Regards Sean
Hey Sean.....nice to meet you .....maybe I will see you at the rally in March. When I got back into riding some 4 years ago, I started prowling the web for sites that catered to the FJ specifically. The first site I stumbled upon was a site called FJ Modifications uk. It was here that I saw so many awesome projects and modifications. When I saw what Frank Moore (racerman...aka...Kookaloooo) did to the FJ..... I was hooked. Then I read an mod by a guy named Bob Shammas out of Michigan and the Turbo mod he did to his 84, I was tremendously inspired....lol......my very first bike was an 82 Seca 650 turbo which was the little brother of the FJ.......so when I decided to get back into riding again....the FJ was a natural transition for me to resume where I left off. The information that Bob Shammas posts in his write up is incredible......lists every hick up and glitch and posts all the results as well as the solutions and Dyno charts....although his set up was a draw through set up.....there is still a cache of invaluable data as the entire process is constantly upgraded from stage to stage. I am quite sure you will find his data most helpful. I am really looking to run the girl on 6-15 lbs of boost at any given time.....it will be a challenge but the one thing that Bob said while summarizing the project(s) was that it was incredible fun and it did not disappoint. Being a carpenter and not a mechanic, I have a very limited knowledge of bike engines....but I am learning and I think that that is half of what is all about....plus it seems to make friends out of strangers........and I love that...
Kev
Quote from: CanDman on November 18, 2012, 09:41:16 PM
Hey Sean.....nice to meet you .....maybe I will see you at the rally in March.
Me too? (popcorn)
Sean.... found this on one of your old posts:
"Hi All ,
Well im stuck in Bathurst still working, never had a chance to attend even via tin can, bit depressed I missed the first but has made me more motivated to shift planets if need be to attend the next.
So what's the plan for the next one so i can move off from the depression of missing this one ?
Regards Sean"
Hoping you have seen the plan for Bellingen next March - its a bit closer for you southerners this time. SO..... how about it?
Are you IN......have the planets moved?
Cheers
Harvy
Quote from: The General on November 18, 2012, 10:42:27 PM
Quote from: CanDman on November 18, 2012, 09:41:16 PM
Hey Sean.....nice to meet you .....maybe I will see you at the rally in March.
Me too? (popcorn)
of course you too Dougy........ :blush: silly rabbit........... :empathy2:
Candman
Do you know if Bob is any better after his accident. Donated a few £ to his rehab fund a year or so ago, wondered how he was doing..
Quote from: Havoc on November 19, 2012, 06:37:13 AM
Do you know if Bob is any better after his accident. Donated a few £ to his rehab fund a year or so ago, wondered how he was doing..
I just had a peak at the site last week hoping for an update....but it looks like the last one made was almost a year ago. I find it ironic that the accident happened on a dirt bike travelling considerably slower than had he been on a street bike. At first when I heard from Barry (from FJ Mods.uk) and he told me about the accident, I immediately thought uh oh........ the turbo got away from him..........but such was not the case......... I should write Patti and see if there is any news....will keep you posted if I hear anything.
Kev
PS....What's Barry up to these days....I was hoping to hear from him after CanD was finished......sent him an email but looks like the letter got lost or the email address was changed.........
Quote from: CanDman on November 19, 2012, 10:15:42 AM
PS....What's Barry up to these days....I was hoping to hear from him after CanD was finished......sent him an email but looks like the letter got lost or the email address was changed.........
Last time i chatted with Barry his focus had shifted off of motorbikes and onto old muscle cars/drag racing and it was taking up the majority of his free time....I believe he said something about a 70's model camaro and a big block.
KOokaloo!
Frank
Quote from: Harvy on November 19, 2012, 12:09:41 AM
Sean.... found this on one of your old posts:
"Hi All ,
Well im stuck in Bathurst still working, never had a chance to attend even via tin can, bit depressed I missed the first but has made me more motivated to shift planets if need be to attend the next.
So what's the plan for the next one so i can move off from the depression of missing this one ?
Regards Sean"
Hoping you have seen the plan for Bellingen next March - its a bit closer for you southerners this time. SO..... how about it?
Are you IN......have the planets moved?
Cheers
Harvy
Yes done deal Harvy this time in 2 weeks time i finish this 13 hours a day 6 days (nights) a week night shift ! Never to return to Slaving going to get me a job with Bank Hours for once, However as i have indicated to the General i may not be able to attend aboard any Yamahas both in deep rebuild , Might have to ride the my Troublehead Hardly Davids son :blush: its ok i promise to park it out back or around the corner!
Regards Sean
PS this Just Arrived ! will have these available early next year for about $150 bucks each, Very high Quality Reproductions of the lower Chin Scoop/fairing for 3CV etc.. im going to get side scoops done as well i just need a pair to take the molds from my company's International base in Hong Kong makes RC helicopter and Jet Fuselages and CNC stuff these have really top quality manufacturing and use WEST SYSTEMS Resins and Fibres also to be done in Carbon Fibre for those with too much money. SO any Australian members want to donate Side Scoops for 3CV in exchange for a Reproduction set and ill give the originals back after molds are taken ?
Having Trouble Posting a Pic here will see what i can do tomorrow !
At one point I was collaborating with Steve Conklin on putting fuel injection on FJ's. We made up some sets of adapter manifolds that used Hayabusa throttle bodies. Those are particularly good because you can disassemble the bank of throttle bodies and rearrange them to put the bell crank back in the center instead of on the end. I think they are 41mm bore?
When I sold my FJ I sold all my FI parts to Chris Wyatt: Throttle bodies, adapters, rubber manifolds, Hayabusa wiring harness, external fuel pump, and some other stuff. The electronics is not so bad, as you can buy a plug and play Megasquirt based ecu from Tony at Interface-PNP http://interfacepnp.webs.com/hayabusapnp.htm (http://interfacepnp.webs.com/hayabusapnp.htm). You can replace your complete wiring harness with the Busa harness, or build a separate sub-harness. Chris purchased one of these Busa ecu's for his project. Not sure where he is at with it. It would be perfect for a turbo, as that is what Tony developed them for.
The Interface-PNP box runs Megasquirt MS2-Extra code, which allows you to configure for the FJ crank pickups. Full control over fuel and ignition maps, based on throttle position and/or MAP pressure. I run a similar box on my supercharged Aprilia twin. Once you figure them out they are very easy to tune. In fact, it has an Autotune function, that uses a Lambda oxygen sensor/controller input to tune your bike as you ride. It works really well.
Conklin used a Microsquirt variant. I don't know if he still has it, but he might want to sell it if he does.
So it's actually been done? I have yet to hear confirmation that anyone has actually got an FJ running on EFI. I figure some speed demon may have actually done it for a race bike -but I have not even heard confirmation of that. What I really would like to see is an EFI daily driver FJ. Again, I just have never heard confirmation that either race or daily-driver, currently exists or even has existed at one point.
Please fill me in if you know of an example.
Dan
Quote from: derbybrit1 on December 22, 2012, 11:27:18 PM
The Interface-PNP box runs Megasquirt MS2-Extra code, which allows you to configure for the FJ crank pickups. Full control over fuel and ignition maps, based on throttle position and/or MAP pressure......
I wonder how hard it would be to use the FI model XJR head so you could use the cam signals for running sequential injection?
Batch injection which uses only the crank signal (think wasted spark but using fuel $$) is ok with a turbo, but a wasteful for normally aspirated.
Quote from: Dan Filetti on December 23, 2012, 12:26:16 PM
So it's actually been done? I have yet to hear confirmation that anyone has actually got an FJ running on EFI. I figure some speed demon may have actually done it for a race bike -but I have not even heard confirmation of that. What I really would like to see is an EFI daily driver FJ. Again, I just have never heard confirmation that either race or daily-driver, currently exists or even has existed at one point.
Please fill me in if you know of an example.
Dan
There you go Sir. I have asked these dutch guys are helping a little with my base set up.
VDB Works (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bl8Te6MRASY#)
The motor uses KMS ECU as do I.
Hard to tell from that video what kind of motorcycle it is.
Wonderful shots of the cobblestone streets though!
That bike didn't look like any FJ I have ever seen, but maybe the engine is based off the FJ engine?
Leon
That is an XJR1200 or 1300 (1250). Both came in that bumblebee color scheme. The later models have fuel injection standard which would make the turbo intall easier.
Arnie
It's no documentary I agree but Dan said he wanted to see a living, breathing Turbo EFI FJ motor and that is one. That is an XJR12 which is to all intense and purposes an Fj motor, with an FJ head and adapted Busa throttle bodies. Even easier with 2008 XJR and later TB's but those heads came with all the emission bollox and strangled TBs (not much more than 30mm).
I am running 36-1 induction crank sensor with additional cam sensor planned, but don't know whether its necessary yet. Also IAT sensor, boost sensor, TP sensor, Oil temp sensor, block temp sensor, gear sensor and Lambda sensor controller by a KMS ECU. Digital boost control and progressive Nitrous control will be added after the Oldskool bet is won.
The example you provided is close, I do recognize the XJR from the motorcycle mags, but it's no FJ. And this could easily have been the 1300 which comes from the manufacturer as EFI, which is not what I'm after.
What I would like to confirm the existence of, is a living breathing modified EFI FJ, in an FJ chassis -the turbo is optional.
I am a bit amazed at the number of threads like this one I have read, where seemingly, all the right things were being talked about: IAT sensors, boost sensors, TP sensors, Oil temp sensors, block temp sensors, gear sensor and Lambda sensors... but then... nothing. It's as if it just gets to be too much of a PITA and is universally abandoned.
I asked the same question a while back on this thread (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=7874.msg71726#msg71726) and did not see anyone confirm it.
It may well be possible that if this effort is not abandoned, it will be the first to have actually managed to convert an carbureted FJ to and EFI FJ.
Good luck,
Dan
Havoc,if to show an FJ with all the right bits,your welcome to stick your turbo engine and all its bits into one of my FJ chassis'. :lol: I really wouldnt mind at all.