Hello, I fiinally got my '85 running a few weeks ago, and the weather warmed up nicely this weekend. I put some miles on the bike on Saturday, and decided to venture out further today. Everything was going fine with the ride and the bike was running great. However when I was furthest from home (go figure) I noticed the tach needle jumping around a little. Bike was still running pretty good though, so I continued to flog it. I came to a stop sign then took off, and the bike was missing but not bad, that's when I high-tailed it for home. Bike was still running so-so, and I wasn't to worried. I was still farther out than I wanted to be. I was coasting to a stop sign, and when I pulled the clutch in, the bike died. I quickly thumbed the starter and it started, and I continued for a few hundred more feet before it died again. I coasted to a stop, and the bike wouldn't crank, and there was no juice (no dash lights, or headlight). I fiddled around blindly with it, and the lights would come back on, then it would start, then quickly die, then again, no lights no cracking. I found (I wasn't going anywhere fast) if it sat for a while, the juice would return, it would crank then start. I got it to run enough where I threw a leg over it, and took off, only to have it die again (same thing no cranking, and no lights) within a hundred or so feet. I went through this a couple of times, before I threw in the towel. Luckily I got a ride from a nice cager, and was dropped off at a place where I could call a flatbed tow truck. The bike now is home, and it was pricey to get it there. I'm bumming.
Can anyone provide any direction on what to check for that would cause the bike to die like this, then have no power at all, then if it sits, it comes back to life, but not for long? Is it possible that the starter relay can be the problem? Seems to me something is heating up, then failing, then returns to like when it cools.
The bike has:
New battery, new ignition switch, all connections are clean and tight, new fuses (none blew during the breakdowns). I went through the bike pretty thoroughly before bringing it out this year and felt really confident about my FJ, then this.
Any trouble shooting pointers would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Marty
Pretty strange.
If the battery had died, it wouldn't recover.
If it was kinked fuel line, you wouldn't have the electrical symptoms.
It could be a coil, maybe, with heat issues, but it doesn't sound like that.
And if its an electrical component going to short when hot, then it would most likely blow a fuse.
Did you put any new electical items on the bike without running them through a fuse?
Are there any electical connectors that may be shorting to ground when the bike warms up?
Sorry to not be of any more help,
Arnie
Arnie:
Strange indeed. The complete lack of power points to an electrical issue. The bike is bonestock, or at least very close to it. There are no non-stock electrical items on the bike.
Marty
San Dimas Mike had issues of his 86' cutting out like the kill switch was hit. It happened to him three times in a short period and made him turn around, not wanting to be stranded far from home. It prevented his ride with me today. He narrowed it down to the kill switch. he took it apart and found it dirty and gunked up. Cleaned it, took if a few test rides, all better now. Hope your issue is as easy and simple to fix.
Thanks for the kill switch heads up. I'll be going through that switch and the starter button too. Although I don't think the latter one is connected (no pun intended), to what I'm experiencing.
My guess would be to check the status of the charging system. Is it putting out 14 volts above 1,500 RPM's?
Does the bike start & run normally after trickle charging the battery overnight?
Sorry your steed failed you. Please don't shoot her.
Sounds like dead cells in the battery. The question is if overcharging is what killed it. I've always experienced a bad running condition like you describe when I have a motorcycle battery go bad - it is never as simple as it won't start anymore :diablo: A few others have had running issues that were similar that was a battery going out.
Good luck, and keep us posted
Even thought you said you have a new battery, I'm thinking bad battery as well. It does happen.
Have the existing new battery load-tested. As was said, the underlying issue may be the charging system.
Dan
sounds to me like your charging system is dying.
A brand new fresh battery will keep the bike running for a while and then you will have the problem you describe. loss of power and starts missing , then dies with no lights or anything . Let it sit and magically it comes back to life runs for a bit and dies.
The charging system on the fj is usually an over charge problem.
use the repair manual to check out your system maybe a ground is loose.
carry a roll of romex with you for ghetto jumper cables .
Quote from: Mark Olson on March 12, 2012, 12:54:26 PM
carry a roll of romex with you for ghetto jumper cables .
Ohh! I love it! That's got to be the 'tip of the week' ! Good one.
As you've disturbed wiring to replace the ignition switch, if you get it running again, try gently waggling the harness near the switch, maybe a wire is fractured?
Hi again:
Thanks to all for the feedback. I will be getting into the bike here in the next few days and checking out the electrical system per your suggestions. Looks like I may be springing for another new battery, and some other parts.
Marty
Did someone say Battery (http://www.rpmracingca.com/proddetail.asp?prod=84-90AGM)?
Randy - RPM
I just checked the battery with my multimeter (Old-school Sears analog, yea!) and it shows 13V! If I have some time tomorrow after work, I'll throw it in and see if I can get the bike running so I can see what the voltage output to the battery is from the charging system.
Before I went to work this morning I put the key in the ignition and turned it on. The only thing that lit up, was the neutral light.
Marty
I'd vote battery based on description. That typed... check you coils closer. Especially the ground connection where it bolts at the bottom as that is the ground. That would be a contributor to the running ruff in my internet diagnosis. Start simple. If you are feeling superstitious, I'd like to suggest a nice ground from battery negative to the frame bolt that is just a few inches away. It is a little tip I picked up from my friend Lee C of Denver. AKA known as the 200K+ mileage flagship of the Stormy Red and Quartz Silver. :hi: In addition to kill switch standard check, add in the side stand intercept to the troubleshooting roadside playbook. I don't remember if it kills the headlight, but it is simple enough to frustrate and easily overlooked. I've bypassed my long ago so I don't recall... Keep us posted!
Putting the key in and getting only a dash light, sound to me like you may want to be looking at the starter button. I have read where sometimes it gets stuck part way in. Take it apart, clean it lube it. Either way, it can't hurt. Now, I have not heard where driving with it stuck part way in can cause stalling etc. as you experienced, but do not rule out multiple issues.
Just a thought.
Dan
As Dan says - if it is a headlight problem too then go to the starter switch. The FJ's have a cutout circuit for the headlight when the starter button is depressed - the idea being to use that power for the starter.
I got pulled over one afternoon for not having my headlight on. The starter button had fouled just enough to kill the headlight, but not engage the starter. Took a little while to figure that one out!
Well I think that I may have found the problem. After cleaning the starter button, and kill switch with some cleaner called Deoxit, which by the way is pretty good stuff, I was greeted with the neutral light coming on and the bike would crank and start. However, it didn't take long for that to stop and I was back to having nothing, then an occasional intermittent neurtal light on, and a little cranking. If it fired, it quickly died, and then no juice whatsoever. I took the starter relay off of my '87 and put it on, and no luck there. Plenty of voltage (12.5V) in the battery, that was at least making it through the main 30A fuse. I thought, well, I'll pull the front fairing off, which I did.
I started getting ready to verify voltage at various junction points, when I noticed that the four-pin connector that goes to the fuse panel was disconnected. I connected it back together, turned the ignition key on, but without the gauges on the bike couldn't see if the neutral light, or for that matter the headlight was on, but when I thumbed the starter button, it cranked! It now runs, and after shutting it down and starting it up a number of times, I'm feeling confident that the connector was the problem. Seems as though the retainer (spear-shaped thingy) that is supposed to hold the connector together and keep it from coming apart, has lost its springyness, and hardly holds it together. I'm thinking that I may have partially dislodged it when I put the front fairing on last when I had the whole bike pretty much apart. And became pretty much disconnected on my last ride when I was stranded. With some judicious usage of cable ties, I'm pretty sure the connector is not going to part itself again.
For the record, I checked the charging system, and it's cranking out 14.5V at from my best guess of 5,000 RPM by sound, because the gauges are still off the bike.
Never goes above 14.5V though.
Thanks to all who contributed.
" With some judicious usage of cable ties, I'm pretty sure the connector is not going to part itself again."
Good find, hope it cures the problem...
Eric M
Rode it twenty-some miles today, and it didn't miss a beat. More miles to come!