Hi all. I`ve got a strange one for you.
First off, I have an `88 FJ12 that`s all stock except for a Pipercross air filter. Now the problem. NO power under load. It will rev when in neutral if you give it a handful of throttle. Pull in the clutch, it will still rev, put in in gear, it will still rev. Go to take off and it will fall flat on it`s face, in first! I`ve had the bike out earlier in the year so it did run.
Now, I`ve had the carbs apart twice and checked every passage I can find. I`ve checked for seized float pins, leaky seats and changed the o-rings on the seats. Checked the diaphragms for pinholes and tears and checked the pilots, mains, and tubes for blockages. I`ve had the carbs mounts off and resealed them. Checked the entire harness for shorts/chafes/and pinched wires. Cleaned and checked all the connectors and switches and sprayed them with Deoxit. I`ve bypassed the sidestand switch, the clutch switch, the fuel pump relay, and then the fuel pump itself. I`ve checked the cam timing and valve clearances. I`ve checked the airbox for mousenests.
Now for the wierd. If I can coax it up to 3-3500 it will suddenly kick in and take off,....but not always. I`ve also pulled the choke knob out a bit and it will help a lot,....but not always.
I have a second hand CDI coming, and then I`m stumped.
I still think it`s a carb issue but I can`t see how.
Anyone?
Ray
Ray-
You've sure done a lot of homework, that helps. My money is on the carb still being blocked. Not that I'm an expert, but for me the key seems to be the 3-3500 rpm bit. I know certain jets do not come into play until above certain rpms so I guess you have a clogged idle-jet -someone check me on that.
As to why you did not find it on either of your two cleanings, not sure, -did you use professor Raforth's outstanding instructions? Were you using liberal amounts of spraying and soaking in Berryman's B-12 AND compressed air?
Have you checked you float LEVEL?
As to why the power return is intermittent after 3-3500 rpm - :unknown: perhaps a smart carb guy can provide a plausible explanation for that.
But again, I'm guessing on it be a carb issue.
Good luck.
Dan
Ray
Try pulling the choke on a little, if it is a restriction in they pilot jet that should bypass pilot jet. with the enrichment valve if it don't pick up I doubt there's blockage
poss try different filter, or w/clean air box try no filter (do not ride it this way) static test in shop.
hope this helps Bob
Vacuum leak.
You are describing the exact symptoms of clogged idle jets or circuit. Did you remove the idle mixture screws and make sure the circuit was unobstructed?
DavidR.
Ok, I`ve just pulled the carbs for the third time. I pulled the diaphragms and looked for the tiniest pinhole,..nothing. There was some slight wear where they fold over so I did the forum approved repair with the Pliastidip to see if anything would change but I`m not holding my breath as there were no holes to start with.
I realize that my symptoms sound like all 4 pilots are plugged and normally I`d agree. I just pulled the pilots, looked through them, they looked clear and just to be sure I ran a bristle from a brush down the hole to make sure there wasn`t a tiny piece of glass there. I then blew contact cleaner into the pilot jet access hole,...it came out the air jet at the carb inlet. I then blocked that and cleaner came out the idle mixture hole (I didn`t even take out the screw) and the three holes by the edge of the butterfly.
As for the vacuum leak, all mounts are pliable with no cracks, the vacuum nipples at the top of the mounts are good and the mounts themselves have been remounted with Threebond to the head.
As to the fuel level, I haven`t checked that. I`ve done float height but I can certainly do the fuel height tomorrow.
If it`s not raining tomorrow, I`ll try it again.
Anything else I can try?
Ray
Hello Ray, sounds like a hard one. First I would check the valve clearance. Than a compression check. Do you have a synchronizer to balance the carbs? If not it is hard to do the job right. Also check the little o-rings under the mixture screws? Make sure they are in good condition. Good luck Werner
I was interested in the Pipercross air filter and read this in the cleaning instructions
Pipercross Cleaning Instructions
The cleaning of a Pipercross air filter should be carried out as below. Failure to do this could result in damage to the air filter or even the vehicle.
Remove excess dirt by gently brushing the filter.
Apply cleaning additive (C9003 or C9000) liberally. Massage in with soft brush. Allow to soak for around 5 minutes.
Flush the filter out with warm water from the clean side of the foam to the dirty side.
Allow the filter to dry naturally (do not apply any heat to the filter!!)
Lightly apply dirt retention additive (C9007 or C9001) on the dirty (black) side of the foam.
Steps 2-4 may need to be repeated until the filter is clean. Do not over oil the foam as this will cause a lack of performance.
Pipercross Air Filters
Perhaps your lack of performance is related ? Have you tried going back to stock filters?
That's the same way any foam or gauze filter is oiled, with the absolute minimum oil on it to work or airflow goes into the toilet.
Almost wondering if there's an engine issue after reading all this though, i.e., jumped a tooth on the camchain. A compression check would be the fast way to check that.
The cam timing and valve clearances have been checked. I have two valves that are .0005" tight and they`re going to be changed out this morning. Compression check I haven`t done but I can. And Pierre, I`m starting to lean to the filter as well. Not sure why it would run and then not but I can clean and check. I don`t have a stock filter but then again, that`s why I bought the one you can clean and reuse!
I know for a fact the o-rings are there under the mixture screws and as for condition, they`re ok. Not great as they`re a little flat but I have to pull them out rather than having them fall out when I tip the carbs over to get the screw out. Does anyone have the size of the o-rings so I can go get new ones? they`ll be about 2mm x 1mm wall? Guessing.
3mm ID x 1mm section (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=1391.0%5B/url)
How do the plugs look?
How old is your battery? The FJ igintion system needs a good strong battery. I've had similar problems when the battery starts to go.
Good luck and keep us posted - you will find the kookaloo again!
Quote from: SlowOldGuy on May 05, 2010, 10:10:34 AM
How do the plugs look?
Actually, fouled plugs could do this also, the spark being blown out when the throttle's opened. Shouldn't run at higher revs then, unless enough combustion temp is being produced to cause them to clean up a bit though.
Check and make sure you have all your spark plug boots seated well and while you are at it check for spark on all four plug wires.
I bet thats it.
I remember working all weekend on an FJ for a local owner. It was kind of a basket case and he really wanted to get it running beofre investing much money into it.
I cleaned the carbs, reinstalled them. Did an idle mixture adjustment, carb sync but it ran like crap. I don't recall the exact symptom, but it would barely run when we tried to test it out with a run down the street. I checked everything; re-checked carbs, fuel level, mixture, sync, coils, timing, cam timing. Nothing made any difference. I finally gave up for the weekend.
He called me a few days later to say he put in new plugs and it was now running great. The plugs looked fine when I checked them, maybe a bit old looking but the color was fine.
Like Frank always says: Check the easy/cheap things FIRST!
DavidR.
is the vacume line to the ignitor box actually connected to the box and carb joint?
Kookaloo!
Frank
Quote from: racerman_27410 on May 05, 2010, 03:38:05 PM
is the vacume line to the ignitor box actually connected to the box and carb joint?
Kookaloo!
Frank
I think the `88 was the first year that there was no vacuum connection to the box.
As for the plugs, maybe, they looked ok, but I can try new ones. Right now I`ve cleaned the filter and it`s drying. I`ll re-oil it and try it again tomorrow if it`s not raining.
I know it`s going to be one of those " Oh crap, it can`t be that simple!!!" situations.
Ray
Quote from: rhubarbray on May 06, 2010, 12:34:55 AM
I think the `88 was the first year that there was no vacuum connection to the box.
All years used a "vacuum sensor" of some type. On the early models, it went directly into the black box. Later models has a separate device called a Boost Sensor that was in the front fairing area.
You should have atleast one vacuum line running from one of the carbs (typically #2) over the valve cover and into the fairing. The line is insulated where it passes over the head.
However, one small vacuum leak on a single cylinder shouldn't cause the drop in perofrmance you describe.
DavidR.
This my be a reach, but could it be bad gas or water in the gas? You said it was sitting for a while. Octane drops as gas ages...just a thought.
Klavdy's FJ had the EXACT same symptoms last December after sitting for only 6 months. I cleaned the carbs and changed the gas out in the tank...problem solved!
Quote from: SlowOldGuy on May 06, 2010, 08:26:50 AM
Quote from: rhubarbray on May 06, 2010, 12:34:55 AM
I think the `88 was the first year that there was no vacuum connection to the box.
All years used a "vacuum sensor" of some type. On the early models, it went directly into the black box. Later models has a separate device called a Boost Sensor that was in the front fairing area.
You should have atleast one vacuum line running from one of the carbs (typically #2) over the valve cover and into the fairing. The line is insulated where it passes over the head.
However, one small vacuum leak on a single cylinder shouldn't cause the drop in perofrmance you describe.
DavidR.
I've never noticed any tubing going from the carbs and over the cam cover then into the fairing on my '89. When it "disappears into the fairing",where does it terminate? Each carb has a vent line which simply hangs down the back of the engine (or are they overflow tubes??). Think I could be missing something fundamental here,but I've never experienced rough running which begs the question of what is this vent line for and does it actually do anything useful? My manual never mentions a "Boost Sensor". Now I'm really puzzled. Having spent two hours at the weekend singlehandedly grappling with refitting the carbs and airbox to find where this mythical (to me!) tube goes and then rectifying it's absence is not an appealing prospect! Please elaborate..
Quote from: jack02 on May 06, 2010, 03:26:55 PM
I've never noticed any tubing going from the carbs and over the cam cover then into the fairing on my '89. When it "disappears into the fairing",where does it terminate? Each carb has a vent line which simply hangs down the back of the engine (or are they overflow tubes??). Think I could be missing something fundamental here,but I've never experienced rough running which begs the question of what is this vent line for and does it actually do anything useful? My manual never mentions a "Boost Sensor". Now I'm really puzzled. Having spent two hours at the weekend singlehandedly grappling with refitting the carbs and airbox to find where this mythical (to me!) tube goes and then rectifying it's absence is not an appealing prospect! Please elaborate..
the vacume line comes off the carb joint (on top between the carbs and cylinder head.....same place as you connect to balance the carbs) not underneath where the float bowl drains are.
its an electro/mechanical ignition advancer. I know for a fact mine didnt run worth a crap on the bottom end with it disconnected.
KOokaloo!
Frank
Quote from: jack02 on May 06, 2010, 03:26:55 PM
I've never noticed any tubing going from the carbs and over the cam cover then into the fairing on my '89. When it "disappears into the fairing",where does it terminate? Each carb has a vent line which simply hangs down the back of the engine (or are they overflow tubes??). Think I could be missing something fundamental here,but I've never experienced rough running which begs the question of what is this vent line for and does it actually do anything useful? My manual never mentions a "Boost Sensor". Now I'm really puzzled. Having spent two hours at the weekend singlehandedly grappling with refitting the carbs and airbox to find where this mythical (to me!) tube goes and then rectifying it's absence is not an appealing prospect! Please elaborate..
Here is the vacuum line (wrapped in silver shielding):
(http://fjowners.com/gallery/1_06_05_10_6_23_05_0.jpeg)
Here is where it goes on the #2 Carb:
(http://fjowners.com/gallery/1_06_05_10_6_23_10_1.jpeg)
It snakes around a lot on it's way up to the control box which is mounted just below and to the right of the front headlight on your 88 FJ. The box is in different locations on different years.
Quote from: SlowOldGuy on May 06, 2010, 08:26:50 AM
All years used a "vacuum sensor" of some type. On the early models, it went directly into the black box. Later models has a separate device called a Boost Sensor that was in the front fairing area.
You should have atleast one vacuum line running from one of the carbs (typically #2) over the valve cover and into the fairing. The line is insulated where it passes over the head.
However, one small vacuum leak on a single cylinder shouldn't cause the drop in perofrmance you describe.
DavidR.
No vacuum line on my '91 B model FJ. All the carb manifolds have a single vacuum tap for balancing, but that is capped for normal running.
I think even rocket scientists can err occasionally :-)
Cheers,
Arnie
Yamaha calls it a pressure sensor on the 'fiche.... #24 in Electrical 2 http://www.yamaha-motor.com/sport/parts/home.aspx (http://www.yamaha-motor.com/sport/parts/home.aspx)
But if Arnie doesn't have it and he doesn't have it on his '88, maybe it was just a US "feature." I'm too lazy to look at the different wiring diagrams right now.
Sometimes I forget that there's a larger world out there. Comes from 20+ years of working "behind the wall."
Besides, I'm from Texas, nowhere else really matters (unless you want to ride really great roads, or have good weather, or a nice beach, hmmmm, maybe I need to re-calibrate).
DavidR.
Quote from: Arnie on May 06, 2010, 07:30:38 PM
Quote from: SlowOldGuy on May 06, 2010, 08:26:50 AM
All years used a "vacuum sensor" of some type. On the early models, it went directly into the black box. Later models has a separate device called a Boost Sensor that was in the front fairing area.
You should have atleast one vacuum line running from one of the carbs (typically #2) over the valve cover and into the fairing. The line is insulated where it passes over the head.
However, one small vacuum leak on a single cylinder shouldn't cause the drop in perofrmance you describe.
DavidR.
No vacuum line on my '91 B model FJ. All the carb manifolds have a single vacuum tap for balancing, but that is capped for normal running.
I think even rocket scientists can err occasionally :-)
Cheers,
Arnie
Same for me Arnie......'91 Japanese domestic model.
Harvy
Seems that all is as should be then on my '89 here in the UK... all carb rubbers are fitted with a cap on the vacuum gauge take-off points and the one on carb#2 isn't suspiciously absent - as if it would run without it! So the vent line in question and the "Boost Sensor" can't have been in the UK model's specs. Reassured now,thanks all.
Jack02...... I believe Euro spec and Jap domestic models were one in the same beast? Well at least in the way of colour schemes........my 91 has the grey colour on the bottom of the chin scoop, while US models were white.
So maybe the Euro bikes did not have the vac line either?
Harvy
Quote from: SlowOldGuy on May 06, 2010, 09:01:27 PM
Besides, I'm from Texas, nowhere else really matters (unless you want to ride really great roads, or have good weather, or a nice beach, hmmmm, maybe I need to re-calibrate).
DavidR.
I couldn't agree more.
May I quote that in my Sig?
My `88 has no lines leading from any of the carbs. All have a nipple cap from Yamaha. And there`s nowhere on the ignition to put a line as my advance is controlled digitally. `88 was the only year the FJ wasn`t imported into the US but it`s the same as the `89-`90.
Ray
The vacuum portion of the FJ ignition system is for emissions. It is designed as illustrated by the spark curve in the manual to spike the ignition timing to to upwards of 50* upon deceleration. This is done to help burn the extra fuel drawn by the carbs when the throttle plate is closed creating the high vacuum on the back side of the carb butterfly.
The ignition system has a built in advance curve within the box which will take it to 36-38* range. We slot all of our ignition plates to 6-8* which will make the total timing in the 42-46* range overall and consistant.
The vacuum portion of the box, unless shorted, should not affect the basic performance of the bike as the ignition curve inside the box is the source of engine timing and performance.
Randy - RPM
OK, update! I borrowed a used stock air filter from FJRPierre the other day thinking it was that,...........nope,same.
I then went out to buy new stock plugs thinking the plugs were misfiring or shorting to ground under load,..........nope, same.
I ran wire from the coil inlets to a meter I had taped to the fairing mount thinking the power is being cut,......nope. Anytime revs are up, I`m well over 13V.
When I was running, I decided to try full choke,.......pulled like a bastard but was revving so high it wouldn`t slow down for the corner! Half choke still ran ok but bogged unless you fed the throttle in slowly.
I tried holding the throttle at a steady 1/16- 1/8 throttle with no choke and the revs would drop and the engine would actually stop.
Oh, and kick me in the nuts while I`m down,........while I was at the local Yamaha dealer inquiring about bringing the bike in for a "expert" opinion,... I was politely told that they are no longer accepting bikes older than 1990!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So now, I can`t even bring it to the dealer!!!
Looks like it`s you and me
Anything else I can try?
Ray
Quote from: rhubarbray on May 07, 2010, 04:52:11 PM
When I was running, I decided to try full choke,.......pulled like a bastard but was revving so high it wouldn`t slow down for the corner! Half choke still ran ok but bogged unless you fed the throttle in slowly.
Ray
Ray,
By your latest writing, you have pretty much diagnosed the problem. It is definitely a fuel related issue since the engine will run good with the choke on with the exclusion of the high idle.
Quote from: rhubarbray on May 05, 2010, 12:52:26 AM
I just pulled the pilots, looked through them, they looked clear and just to be sure I ran a bristle from a brush down the hole to make sure there wasn't a tiny piece of glass there. I then blew contact cleaner into the
pilot jet access hole,...it came out the air jet at the carb inlet.
In this earlier message you said you have removed and check the pilot at the carb throat. That is the jet used for the air mixture portion of the pilot circuit. The fuel pilot jet is located in the fuel bowl in the well directly behind the main jet. The orifice in that jet is microscopic and plugs with the slightest debris or dried fuel sediment. If you can not locate a ultrasonic cleaner and those jets are plugged, you should replace them.
Since FJRPierre is recently versed in the rebuilding of the FJ carb, it might worth seeing if he will assist you in rebuilding and cleaning them.
Randy - RPM
I read all the posts and I did not see mentioned the base set up for the carbs.
so set your mix screws to 3 turns out.
use a 1/16 drill bit as a feeler gauge for the butterflys as a starting point for base idle/carb sync.
you should be able to see light through them when off the bike.
cause it sure sounds like you have a lean problem in the low range.
anyway thats all I got. :pardon:
Sure sounds like you've got a plugged pilot jet circuit.
When mine starts this kind of s*&t, I typically pull the mixture screws (noting how many turns from open, so I can reset) then spray carb cleaner into the mixture screw ports.
When I do this, I jam the spray tube into the hole & try for a real tight fit, Watch for the back-spray when doing this!!!
Do it a few times, then BLAST with compressed air. Fit the air nozzle as described above. I try to make sure my pressure reg is set wide open, and over 100 psi for this. This will (may?) blast carb cleaner & air out the air bleed port on the carb mouth, through the passage into the post-throttle port and the pilot jet. It MAY clean out the blockage. Good luck!
Quote from: racerrad8 on May 07, 2010, 05:11:23 PM
Quote from: rhubarbray on May 07, 2010, 04:52:11 PM
When I was running, I decided to try full choke,.......pulled like a bastard but was revving so high it wouldn`t slow down for the corner! Half choke still ran ok but bogged unless you fed the throttle in slowly.
Ray
Ray,
By your latest writing, you have pretty much diagnosed the problem. It is definitely a fuel related issue since the engine will run good with the choke on with the exclusion of the high idle.
Quote from: rhubarbray on May 05, 2010, 12:52:26 AM
I just pulled the pilots, looked through them, they looked clear and just to be sure I ran a bristle from a brush down the hole to make sure there wasn't a tiny piece of glass there. I then blew contact cleaner into the
pilot jet access hole,...it came out the air jet at the carb inlet.
In this earlier message you said you have removed and check the pilot at the carb throat. That is the jet used for the air mixture portion of the pilot circuit. The fuel pilot jet is located in the fuel bowl in the well directly behind the main jet. The orifice in that jet is microscopic and plugs with the slightest debris or dried fuel sediment. If you can not locate a ultrasonic cleaner and those jets are plugged, you should replace them.
Since FJRPierre is recently versed in the rebuilding of the FJ carb, it might worth seeing if he will assist you in rebuilding and cleaning them.
Randy - RPM
I may have been misunderstood. I didn`t say I pulled the pilots at the carb inlets. With the carbs upside down,(diaphragms out just in case- compressed air involved), float bowls off, and pilot jets out of their mounting hole, I then sprayed cleaner into the hole where the pilot jet would have been mounted. Once fluid comes out the jet (path of least resistance) at the inlet I plugged the inlet jet to force the fluid out the mixture screw hole and the three holes at the butterfly. All 4 carbs are clean,clean,clean.
I realize that I`m describing a plugged pilot jet scenario and under normal circumstances, I`d agree with you.
I have another theory, hear me out. What if it`s a weak spark which can`t ignite a normal fuel/air mixture but which CAN ignite a rich mixture such as when the choke is pulled??? I`m wondering if I have a failing pickup coil, TCI, or? Whatever is happening is doing so to all 4 cyls at the same time,....no stumbling,...no rough running. That`s why I`m thinking it`s something which is affecting all 4. Pickup coil, TCI, air filter, fuel line, see what I mean?
slowly going mad!
Ray
Oh yeah, yes my mixture screws are already set to 3 turns out and the float heights are at the lean end of the range but within spec. And my idle is nice and smooth, no out of sync.
QuoteWhat if it`s a weak spark which can`t ignite a normal fuel/air mixture but which CAN ignite a rich mixture such as when the choke is pulled???
Unlikely. The correct mixture should actually be easier to light off than a rich one, if you've got things warmed a bit.
I hate to say it, but I'm guessing that you're missing something surprisingly simple someplace, a passageway that's plugged solid, a fuel filter that's nearly full, etc. Start from scratch like you've never touched anything on it, and look very closely at what you're doing.
If you have a 6 year old kid to come help you, that may be best--if you have someone to explain what each portion of the carb circuits are/do, it gives you a chance to work slower through them, and fresh eyes will sometimes catch fallacies or missed stuff between carbs.
Don't give up! Ran into a simple @!#%!@# moment today, my zx9 wouldn't idle down under 2500 revs. Turns out the cables were getting pinched when the gas tank came down, and wasn't letting the throttle close fully. Some swearing, and then relief that it was a fairly easy fix after!
I hate to say it but yours will not be the first set of "clean" carbs that had to come back off for another (more thorough) cleaning. Dont overthink the problem.
ultrasonic cleaning is preferred.
get some Uni pod filters (2 x Uni p/n 3229) and quit messing with the airbox.... it will make your life much easier.
Kookaloo! :good:
Frank
In your first post, you said it ran okay earlier in the year. If all it did was sit from then to now and it suddenly has this problem, then it must be something related to the storage.
Bad fuel?
Clogged fuel pump?
Kinked fuel line?
Have you tried running it with an auxiliary tank?
Are the plugs black, brown, or white?
Still sounds like a fuel problem to me. When I let mine sit for a few weeks, it will idle fine and rev fine with gentle throttle, but when I put a load on it or grab a bunch of throttle, it will blubber and die. If I can get it off the idle circuit by reving, I can get it going down the road. If I let it idle and barely turn the throttle, the revs will pick up slightly then it's like it hits a huge flat spot. If I continue to slightly turn the throttle, the revs will peak at about 1800 then the engine will nose over, start blubbering and eventually die if I hold the throttle at that position.
A dose of Techron and about 30 miles and everything is fine.
I know you've gone through the carbs several times, what about the rest of the fuel delivery system? Could something have clogged during the down time?
DavidR.
Hello Ray, about the fact that it was running fine earlier this year you should check corrosion between the spark plug wire and the caps. It can be also a spark plug cab. Check the resistance. Another thought good luck Werner
Quote from: racerrad8 on May 07, 2010, 05:11:23 PM
Since FJRPierre is recently versed in the rebuilding of the FJ carb, it might worth seeing if he will assist you in rebuilding and cleaning them.
Leave Pierre alone! He has Rally to prep for!! :sarcastic:
>>>If you have a 6 year old kid to come help you, that may be best--if you have someone to explain what each portion of the carb circuits are/do, it gives you a chance to work slower through them, and fresh eyes will sometimes catch fallacies or missed stuff between carbs.
Actually I'm the ideal candidate for the 6 yr old position! :wacko1:
Here's a thought Ray Why don't you take the carb off mine, put them on your bike and give her a good run. That should eliminate a bunch of "maybe's" :good2: (says Pierre thinking like a 6 yr old)
Quote from: fjrpierre on May 08, 2010, 09:03:40 AM
Here's a thought Ray Why don't you take the carb off mine, put them on your bike and give her a good run. That should eliminate a bunch of "maybe's" :good2: (says Pierre thinking like a 6 yr old)
!!! I just might take you up on your offer! I`ll call you later. That would certainly eliminate or confirm a BIG variable.
Ray
If you really want to eliminate a lot of maybe's you also need to run rhubarbray's carbs on fjpierre's bike.
Reason is, swapping carbs will also touch a few other things like fuel line runs, fuel filter, etc. Just because fjpierre's carbs run well on rhubarbray's bike doesn't mean rhubarbray's carbs were bad - could have dislodged something in the fuel filter, could have unkinked a fuel line, even removing and replacing the carbs could dislodge something. Stranger things have happened!
Good luck and let us know how it goes - always trying to learn!
I (and I think most others here) still think a good carb cleaning will fix your problem. I usually use about 1 1/2 to 2 cans of carb cleaner on mine when I clean them. That little red straw on the can has cleared any debris for me EVERYTIME - I've never even used compressed air on mine. I understand that you say your carbs are clean, clean, clean. And that we are getting annoying with our repetition - but you asked! Just sayin'
Update!! Well I took FJRPierre up on his offer and tried his carbs on my bike. And it ran!! So it is the carbs. I didn`t put my carbs on his as he had to return the FJ to his son and we had run out of time.
So I took the carbs apart for the fourth time! And I had my dad with me to check everything and every passage is clean and clear! HOWEVER,....for the sake of argument I`m going to take the stripped carbs to a local mechanic who has a large ultrasonic cleaner tank.
So to all of you who said carbs...you were right. I`ll see what happens when I get the carbs back from the dunk.
Ray
Ray, here's a thought. I recently purchased some pilot jets. 1 set was for my dad's FJ. Before he installed them, he took a close look & sure enough, 1 of the BRAND NEW JETS was clogged! Maybe you have a similar situation?
Glad to hear you're on the trail. Nothing like a big ultrasonic cleaner to get the crud out.
Ed
Glad you're making progress!
Quote from: rhubarbray on May 08, 2010, 09:17:24 PM
Update!! Well I took FJRPierre up on his offer and tried his carbs on my bike. And it ran!! So it is the carbs. I didn`t put my carbs on his as he had to return the FJ to his son and we had run out of time.
Or it was something you disturbed when you physically swapped them. (But it's a really little chance, odds are it was the carbs.... just keep it in mind, you can fool yourself sometimes.)
I just threw on a spare set of carbs I had. I hadn`t used them before now because I seem to remember them having a plugged passage when I checked them 5 or 6 years ago and I just never got around to them as mine were working fine. Yeah, whoops!
So I threw them on anyway after a couple of flushes and put in a K&N I had laying around, didn`t even check to see if it was clean.
It ran! Stumbled a bit and the idle was low but it ran.
So I`m going to have to check my carbs again and strip them and get them cleaned.
Ray
Ray - good deal!
Try running some Techron, SeaFoam, or Marvel Mystery Oil in the next tank of gas - should help clean up the low speed stumble like carb guru DavidR mentioned. Of course, a carb synch would be good to do too.
Enjoy the new found kookaloo!
Chris
Here's another thing to keep in mind.
If it looks like you're going to have to replace a bunch of parts on your carbs; like slide diaphragms, needle seats, needle jets, floats, etc. then consider getting a brand new set from Randy. Not sure what the Canadian taxes and handling charges would add up to, but it's right at $400 plus postage in the states. Perhaps Randy can update the price for you.
DavidR.
Quote from: SlowOldGuy on May 11, 2010, 05:58:09 PM
Here's another thing to keep in mind.
If it looks like you're going to have to replace a bunch of parts on your carbs; like slide diaphragms, needle seats, needle jets, floats, etc. then consider getting a brand new set from Randy. Not sure what the Canadian taxes and handling charges would add up to, but it's right at $400 plus postage in the states. Perhaps Randy can update the price for you.
DavidR.
Diaphragms are good,. needle jets were replaces last year with FactoryPro ones, everything else looks good. Mind you ,..$400?? Who is Randy?
Quote from: rhubarbray on May 12, 2010, 07:43:25 AM
Mind you ,..$400?? Who is Randy?
Randy KICKS ASS! He has ALL SORTS of engine related parts as well as knowing the FJ engine inside and out. Oh, and his prices are awesome.
Here is more information:
http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=69.0 (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=69.0)
Ok, another update. After my dad took a look at my "clean" carbs and said yes they`re clean, nothing in there I put them in and didn`t really expect anything to change and it didn`t. More to show dad that it`s something else.
But,....while I had the carbs still on, I tried it again in the garage and it ran well in neutral and then wouldn`t take throttle in neutral in the garage! Didn`t do that before! A little troubleshooting later and I found that on the fuel pump relay connector one of the wires was hanging out a little. I moved the connector and the wire fell out! Bad crimp! Verified that the pump still works by jumping the connector and crimped a new terminal on but I figured the constant bad connection/no connection took out the relay. So I just ordered a new one and it wasn`t as bad as I figured it would be. Just over $60 tax in.
So once the relay comes in I`ll try it again but it looks like I had TWO problems which is why the symptoms were changing.
Slowly getting there.
Ray