My current Road 4's will be ready in the next few months for replacement.
I can not believe the mileage I've gotten on these tires. Never have I had a set of tires lasting 8,200 miles like these Road 4's.
I could probably get 8,500 miles out of these.
Mind you, my FJ has a RPM 1380cc engine with ~100 ft.lbs of torque, so I had resigned myself to a short life on the back tire.
What I notice with the Road 4's is a very slight wiggle powering out of a third gear corner. Nothing alarming.
You *must* have a gentle hand with this engine. As Kookaloo Frank Moore said..."it suffers no fools..."
Anyhoo.... I'm super impressed with the mileage of the Road 4's.
I have heard several good reports on the Metzeler Roadtec 01 tires. A step up in the handling vs. the Road 4's. What kind of mileage have folks got on these tires?
The Roadtec's were to be my next set....however along comes Michelin with their improved Road 5 tires. It seems that they were aware of the handling on the Road 4's and have stiffened the sidewall and increased the shoulder contact patch on the Road 5's to correct this.
The UK folks at Visor Down give a good review on the Road 5's:
http://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-news-product-news/michelin-road-5-full-road-and-track-test (http://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-news-product-news/michelin-road-5-full-road-and-track-test)
so....how's the mileage on the Roadtec's? I realize the Road 5's are new, so I doubt anyone has yet to have them.
These modern motorcycle tires are absolutely amazing.....
Cheers Pat
Pat that's the first thing I noticed about the 4s. That they would let go faster than the 3s. So I actually liked the pr3s better. But If they have addressed that. .. maybe I won't get the 01s. I think you should try a set and let us know.
Another option is the newer Michelin Power RS.
http://motorcycle.michelin.com.au/motorbike/michelin/desktop/US/en/tires/products/power-rs.html (http://motorcycle.michelin.com.au/motorbike/michelin/desktop/US/en/tires/products/power-rs.html)
Mike is on his second set and so far zero complaints.
Mike used to run the Road 4 in the winter (wet) months and the Pilot Power 3 in the summer (dry) months. Well, since the RS ties were installed, there has been no change of compounds for different conditions so far.
Randy - RPM
Pat,
Are you running on OEM stock 16" rims?
Pat,
I currently have a set of Roadtec 01s on my FJ. I have run Avon Azaros and Storms on this 1993 FJ and ran a set of Continental Conti Motions and a set of Metzeler Lasertecs on my previous 1990 FJ. I have never run a set of Michelin motorcycle tires so I have no point of reference for a comparison. The Conti Motions were toast in just a bit over 2,000 miles in the Ozark hills, the Avon's would go about 3,000 miles before they needed replacement. I have just a little over 1,500 miles on the Roadtec 01s, the rear is showing slight wear on the center 1/3rd of the tread, the front has very little discernible wear. I'm expecting to get double the mileage on these tires as I got on the other brands. Lack of grip has not been an issue so far. A faster rider may not be as impressed with them as I have been so far, but as far I'm concerned these are some great tires.
Joe
G'day Pat, I haven't used the PR5's yet but have been through a set of 01's. They lasted just over 9,000 kms, great grip wet or dry. They did, however, wear flat across the centre 1/3 of the tread very early on. Just after fitting them, I did an unusually flat, i.e. boring ride for about 800kms which wore a lot more from the centre than I expected. I also got good wear from the PR4's, about 9,000kms but had a problem with them pushing in the sharper corners. Great in the wet and not so good in the dry.
I have gone back to using Metzeler Roadtec Z8's, by far the best value tyre I have used. They last almost as long as the 01's, handle just as well and are $100 per set cheaper. Their wet grip is almost as good as the PR4's but the dry grip is far better. They are so good I'm on my 4th set and I have never before used any set of tyres more than once. :good2:
Regards, Pete.
Quote from: red on February 28, 2018, 02:52:48 PM
Pat,
Are you running on OEM stock 16" rims?
:Facepalm:
Ok, thanks guys...
Dan, now that you mention it...I don't recall having the back squirm with the earlier PR3's.
Randy and Mike, thanks, what kind of mileage on the Michelin Power RS did you get?
Red, I have the 17" conversion on my '84: YZF1000 T Ace rear (180/55-17), YZF750 USD front (120/70-17)
Joe, yea, I fully expected a 3,000 mile life out of my back tire. That's why I was pleasantly surprised with the PR-4's
Pete, Ok, thanks for the input on the 01's. 9,000km's (~5,600 miles) is very reasonable. The same mileage out of the Z8's? I'll take a hard look at those and after a cost vs. mile study, I will put them on my list.
Re: Cost vs. miles traveled: I don't change my tires at home. I dismount the wheels and take them down to my local bike shop for mounting and balancing.
It costs me $25 a tire for mount and balance.
This cost vs mile is used for information purposes and is not my sole consideration.
I do not skimp $$ on tires, chains or oil. It's the price of admission to the kookaloo zone.
Quote from: Pat Conlon on February 28, 2018, 01:40:25 PM
These modern motorcycle tires are absolutely amazing.....
Cheers Pat
Modern motorcycles with modern tires are even more amazing!
Quote from: FJ1100mjk on February 28, 2018, 04:26:55 PM
Quote from: Pat Conlon on February 28, 2018, 01:40:25 PM
These modern motorcycle tires are absolutely amazing.....
Cheers Pat
Modern motorcycles with modern tires are even more amazing!
Reminds me....Hey Marty, it's a cold as a witch's tit in your region....but, when things warm up, how about a bike review on your new FZ-1?
I'm also after Lee Carkenord on a review of his new Suzuki Bandit...
Back to tires...
Quote from: Pat Conlon on February 28, 2018, 04:21:17 PM
Randy and Mike, thanks, what kind of mileage on the Michelin Power RS did you get?
I'll have to let Mike answer on the miles traveled.
Randy - RPM
I had Roadtec Z8s on mine, and I wore the rear out in 4,500 miles. Z6s last 6,500 or so. The front Z8 still looked like it has plenty of life on it, I still have it in the garage and I may stick it on with another Z8 rear at some point, but I went back to a pair of new Z6s. Fantastic grip on the Z8s and they felt great the whole time, instead of getting hard to turn the way some tires do as they wear. The Z6s have been terrific, and I am making probably half the power of a built FJ motor these days so "too much power" is not an issue. I am using either 160/70 or 170/60, i forget, on a 17x5 YZF600 rim.
True, this tells you nothing directly about the 01s, except that Pete has had 01s and Z8s, and got longer life out of the 01s.
Andrew picked himself up a bumblebee FZ1 last year. I know that all the upgrades we do to the FJs can be done to an FZ1 as well (except the ones it already comes with, like brakes and wider wheels) and I think Andrew's needed tires. But in the first couple hours he rode it on the way up to Boone last spring, he dragged the aftermarket lower fairing on one side and the footpeg on the other side, and I think he can go faster more easily on the FJ. We'll see if he decides he likes it enough to upgrade suspension on it, or if it gets sold once the 916 is sorted out.
Ok, thanks Bill. Z8's @ 4,500 miles, but 6,500 miles out of Z6's...I'll look into those.
Randy, thanks, I'm sure Mike will chime in.
The first time I saw a set of PR-4's on a FJ was on Mike's, up at the (wet) Hayfork Rally.
I really appreciated the wet handling on my PR-4's riding back from the South Dakota Rally thru the flatlands of Wyoming with the thunder showers and cross winds.
Quote from: Pat Conlon on February 28, 2018, 04:40:42 PM
Quote from: FJ1100mjk on February 28, 2018, 04:26:55 PM
Quote from: Pat Conlon on February 28, 2018, 01:40:25 PM
These modern motorcycle tires are absolutely amazing.....
Cheers Pat
Modern motorcycles with modern tires are even more amazing!
Reminds me....Hey Marty, it's a cold as a witch's tit in your region....but, when things warm up, how about a bike review on your new FZ-1?
I'm also after Lee Carkenord on a review of his new Suzuki Bandit...
Back to tires...
Pat, please, it was a balmy 46F and sunny here today, so it's almost riding weather. My bike is not new, only new to me. Being manufactured in this century qualifies it, from my perspective of past ownership of 1980s FJs, as modern though. :rofl2:
I can provide a preview of a review, after one year ownership of my '02 FZ1 though:
Cons: It's OEM seat sucks (fixed with new Sargent), it looks like shit from the side, it broils the right leg if ambient temp is above 72F, and wind protection and noise sucks. Mushy, marginal, OEM (fixed with stiffer front springs and an $80 S1000RR OEM shock) suspension.
Pros: Upright ergos. Handles, cuts and thrusts far better than previously-owned, aformentioned bikes. The nice weight drop and mass-centralization are very noticeable. Engine spools-up lickity split, provides and ass-kicking hit at 6.5K RPM, and just pulls until the tach hits the red zone.
Easy to work on, and that's something that's not needed much, and if parts are needed, are all still available at your online Yamaha supplier.
Stops and turns as expected of a modern Yamaha bike with its OEM blue dots, stiff aluminum swingarm, and 17 inch wheels shod with good radials.
Nor, any reasons to bring along spare ignition systems and electric fuel pumps, since it is reliable and decades newer. No fear, and looking over my shoulder, when I throw a leg over it, when going on several hundred mile journeys on it.
There
are better bikes out there, but I am happy with it. Don't plan on owning it long either. Life's too short, and one never knows what's around the next bend in life.
Back to the marvels of modern tires...
Pat, when considering the Z8's, there are 2 different spec rear tyres. The "M" spec has normal strength sidewalls and the "O" spec has stiffened sidewalls to cope with heavier bikes, ; touring bikes. I've tried both, about 6,000kms with the M spec and I average about 8,500 kms on the O spec. The M's have slightly better grip when inflated to the same pressure as the O's but dropping the pressure slightly evens things up. Then you have the added advantage of upping the pressures when carrying a heavier load. Not positive but I think the fronts only come in the M spec configuration. The 01's may come in different spec's as well, might be worth looking into.
Regards, Pete.
The Metzeler Roadtec 01's come in 2 specs, standard and HWM (Heavy Weight Motorcycle). I believe the HWM has an added steel belt in the rear tire.
Best sport touring tires of 2017 video
https://youtu.be/w1leVfe5EGg
I just bought a set of Dunlop Roadsmart 2 tires. I have been told that I should be able to expect about 10,000 miles on the rear. We will see how well they work.
Fred
Pat, I also am very pleased with the Metzeler 01's and on my second set ( I was very happy with the Z8's as well) I had the GT or HWM version F&R of both, they have a stiffer carcass. Of all the tyres I have had in recent years, I disliked the PR4's the most. I always replace my tyres in pairs but an unscheduled half life replacement of the rear tyre due to damage saw the front worn down further than would normally be the case. It turned the FJ into an absolute pig and I literally had aching shoulders from the twisties. I also found that when about half worn they started tramlining. However, my major gripe was dry grip. But, as everyone has mentioned, they're great in the wet and they do last.
Call me cynical but I don't put any stock in magazine reviews, I swear those blokes are on the take when it comes to new products from major advertisers, sponsors, freebie givers etc. Remember all the hype about the PR4's? I think I'll wait for the real world reviews to trickle in before investing $500 in a set of tyres. I have no brand loyalty, whatever does the job best. If the PR5's get good reports, I'll give them a go.
You say it appears Michelin were aware of the handling problems of the 4's, funny how manufacturers (of anything) only ever talk about the failings of a previous model when flogging a new one!
You are right about modern tyres being amazing, they have all bar killed off the track day tyre segment.
Reviews don't get any fresher than this. Making the most of cooler weather and Daylight Saving, I did a 400km loop through Apollo Bay after work today on a bike with a PR4 on the rear, returning along the Great Ocean Road. The back wheel let go 3 times in less than an hour on perfect road surface. That is real confidence sapping performance. I had this happen probably half a dozen times on the FJ when I was running them.
For me it's 01's or Z8's until something better comes along. Cost and longevity barely factor into my choice, it's all about grip.
Noel
Thanks Pete, I've wondered if the O spec stiffer sidewalls was a wise investment. It sounds like the added mileage is worth it.
Thanks for the link Fred. Yep, the 01's come out on top of the 2017 class. As a general rule I stay away from Dunlops. They run wide in size causing problems on my chain side clearance.
Thanks Noel, Yes, I've seen you post this before about the PR-4's. My PR-4 experience is nowhere near as bad as yours. Back in my younger years, when I had to constantly scrimp and save, I've had tires like you describe and they were no fun. I was stuck with them....until I could afford to buy a different set.
Fortunately, not so today...if I find tires are evil...off they come.
Q: What kind of mileage did you get from your first set of 01's?
I realize your road surface and conditions are different than what we have here in the states.
You are right, $400 is a chunk of change ($155 front, $200 rear +$50) on the new R-5 tire model, but assuming the same mileage as the PR-4's with 8k tire life, that's a cost of $5 per 100 miles traveled vs the Roadtec $400 with 5.4k miles =$7.14 per 100 miles. Again, for me, tire cost (thankfully) is not the issue.
Still....I'm leaning towards letting the dust settle on the Road 5's and see what shakes out.... The Roadtec 01's are a proven tire.
Quote from: aviationfred on February 28, 2018, 07:59:51 PM
I just bought a set of Dunlop Roadsmart 2 tires. I have been told that I should be able to expect about 10,000 miles on the rear. We will see how well they work.
Fred
I've RARELY ever had a bad tire as far as grip performance goes. However, there are/were a handful of tires that I will never buy again because of their lack of mileage.
The Bridgestone BT-23 was the stock tire on my FZ-1 (they don't even make these anymore). The OEM version performed well and lasted an impressive amount of mileage getting upwards of 8Kmiles. So I bought them again. The non-OEM tires would barely make it to 3K. After trying a second set, same miserable life so no more.
I had high hopes for the original Dunlop Roadsmart after talking to a Dunlop rep at the motorcycle show way back when they first came out. They were the replacement for the Dunlop D305 (? that doesn't look or sound right) radial which was my first radial tire and available in 16" front and rear. My first disappointment was the Roadsmart was not available in the 120/16 size. Regardless, I bought a set for my '93. They were advertised as a Sport Touring tire so I had fairly high expectations. WRONG! Within 3500 miles, the front was worn out and cupping badly. Unfortunately I had purchased 2 of the tires and the second one was just as short-lived. I swapped to Pilot Power fronts and actually got better mileage.
Hopefully the Roadsmart 2 is a better package.
Probably won't get anymore Dunlop Q3s either. Nice and sticky, but barely made it to 3k with the front and rear on the BMW.
My FJ currently has a PR4 in back with a Pilot Power in front, no complaints.
My FZ1 has a set of PR3s and again, no complaints.
The BMW S1000XR has a new set of Pirelli Angel GTs (soft sidewall version) and so far I like them.
Son's FZ1 has a set of Angel STs and he's not complaining either.
On the shelf I have a couple of Conti Road Attacks that I bought at closeout pricing. I recall Noel having favorable comments about them.
Quote from: FJ_Hooligan on March 01, 2018, 02:29:12 PM
On the shelf I have a couple of Conti Road Attacks that I bought at closeout pricing. I recall Noel having favorable comments about them.
Yes I did. I had quite a few consecutive sets of them. At the time (that seems like a long time ago now) many dual compound tyres suffered from triangulation as they wore if you spent a lot of time on corners (Roadsmarts come to mind)
What I liked about the RA's was, rather than use dual compound with a defined transition point, they achieved the same effect with a single compound by applying different amounts of heat from the centre to the edges during manufacture so the transition was progressive and the tyre retained it's profile better.
For the sort of riding mix I do, they retained a smooth rounded profile even when worn out. Wear characteristics are obviously subject to each riders habits and frequently ridden roads. For example, where Pete lives, the last bit of straight road he sees is his driveway.
When it comes to tyres, I don't remember mileage and try to forget the price!
Noel
Just go darkside, and quit all the fretting and whining about mileage!
(http://fjowners.com/gallery/10/1388_01_03_18_7_28_29.jpeg)
Just to muddy the waters, I decided today my next tyres will definitely be Conti Attack 3's.
Noel
Re: Tires...
As others have stated, what is suitable for one and his riding style and habits may not necessarily be applicable to others but here goes...
As mentioned I was running the Pilot Road's during the winter and the Pilot Power 3's for summer/dry months. Both in my opinion are above average performers. I believe it was GiantKiller Dan who was able to get the Pilot Power's to spin the rear on a regular basis – however with his big bore engine and heavy throttle hand (!) perhaps results with other tires would be similar!
As far as the road holding ability of the Pilot Roads 3's & 4's in the wet they are exceptionally capable; having come upon many motorcycles in wet and rainy conditions few were able to maintain spirited riding under such conditions. Likewise, often speeds comparable to autos on winding roads were doable at normal speeds. In the dry, I had no real complaints and having followed capable riders who use the Pilot Roads such as Andyoutandabout on numerous occasions & for many hundreds of miles, I believe his estimation of their all-around performance is in the affirmative.
My previous post from June, 2016 "Suspension Brakes & Such" was made in dry weather using Pilot Roads. Might be worth a look.
Performance with the Power R/S performance was significantly improved over the Pilot Power 3's.
Mileage and cost are considerations may be valid but handling considerations top the list: the R/S's high speed handling, both directional & sweepers is exceptional and in my opinion, much better that the Pilot Power 3's. Also, during vigorous riding on winding roads their overall performance, from ride comfort to surface grip, is also significantly improved. The quick handling was initially comparable but as the tires wore, the R/S's seemed to maintain their initial quick response while the PP 3's became sluggish.
Although I do not have an exact figure, mileage between the two was about the same (about 6,000miles, update in the future) but the wear pattern was improved. On the R/S the rear tire does not wear as flat and on the front no cupping or irregular wear pattern appeared.
Riding in wet weather has been limited. Although there are almost no grooves on the R/S's, wet weather performance seems to at least be on par with the PP 3's which was certainly acceptable although not outstanding. Michelin claims that improved tire compound enables good wet weather performance.
My only complaint is that with the almost smooth surface, when on a gravel or sandy road, anything above modest speeds become problematic.
Although I have only several hunderd miles on my third set of Power R/S's with the arrival of winter I look forward to trying the Pilot Road 5's (perhaps I'll change over to the 5's and save these R/S's for summer). The reviews are good and apparently the improved compound and groove pattern will lend themselves to improved performance in the dry and the wet.
Mr. Conlon - give 'em a try & I'll follow your lead...
Whatever tire chosen, ride safe!
Ok, thanks guys.... :good:
Can't believe I missed a tire thread. Here's a little song I wrote:
Oh yeah, I'm a Michelin man
Oh yeah, I'm a Michelin man,
This ps4 do all I want,
Oh yeah, I'm a Michelin man
Oh wow a brand new model,
Oh wow a brand new model,
If they are half as good as the old ps4
Then I'm still a Michelin man.
Thank you folks, thank you very much.
Has anybody considered, the Dunlop Road Smart 3? It is supposed to out preform the Pilot Road 4 by quite a bit, time will tell.
Also, you can buy a set, of the Road Smart 2 tires for $180.00, on Ebay.
Kurt