Thought it seemed right to start a new thread - here's a link to the old one where I mentioned my clutch 'aspirations'. http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=12827.msg136784#msg136784 (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=12827.msg136784#msg136784)
I am going back to a single spring (new FJR one) and have purchased new clutch steels, fibres + the RPM shift kit. I have also decided to go back to the old master cylinder and so having sourced one and thoroughly cleaned / fitted new seals I will be fitting that too. The reason being I want an original clutch from lever to engagement. I'm getting tired of bleeding the ZZR M/C and want the chance to experience an original clutch as far as possible. I remember riding my old FJ's with original equipment and don't have any bad memories of slippage or bleeding issues..
While in purchase mode I also sourced a new (old stock) pushrod and because the slave cylinder was changed last year too, this really will be as far as possible an original clutch. All that said, I do have a braided clutch hose already fitted, but maybe that's one upgrade I'm willing to compromise on..!
Also, for the record, I'm not against upgrades / mods as I have a fair few, but all this stems back to having constant issues with the clutch which is after all a fundamental part of riding, and I want to be happy with it and not have to think about it through poor feel of the clutch lever or indeed slippage which is why I put the double spring in a while back...
One thing I've never found a definitive answer about is whether the FJR diaphragm spring is uprated compared to the FJ/XJR one. There is a lot of hearsay that it might be, but it is certainly cheaper compared to the FJ one over here in the UK. Either way, it's new, and that's the point for me.
So after all this waffle I have to fit my new parts which I hope to do in the next few days, and will update this thread for anyone interested.
Cheers
mark :good2:
I recommend you have a magnet on a stick for the shift kit upgrade. Something like this one:
I had to fish the bolt out of the sump a few times and would be SOL without it. Or you could plug hole the hole, but don't forget to remove the plug...
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/618yeVa6EgL._SL1500_.jpg)
^^^ A tool, that no toolbox should be without. Owned one for decades, and it has bailed me out a few times after one of those "oh shit, where did it go?" or similar episodes.
The bike works great on stock parts!
Upgrade for function (mechanical failure, driving demands) is my motto.
Ps, Randy, I really want one of those new rear suspension springs but i need intake boots & a chain first.
Quote from: mark1969 on April 15, 2015, 12:19:36 PM
One thing I've never found a definitive answer about is whether the FJR diaphragm spring is uprated compared to the FJ/XJR one. There is a lot of hearsay that it might be, but it is certainly cheaper compared to the FJ one over here in the UK. Either way, it's new, and that's the point for me.
Cheers
mark :good2:
Mark, Randy (RPM) posted the relevant info about FJ vs FJR clamping force etc a few years back. If I can find it I will post up the msg number.
Or search for it yourself....... he included a few pictures for illustration of any differences he found.
Sounds like the only thing you are not replacing in the clutch department is the basket with attendant bearings.
Cheers
Harvy
Mark 1969 ,
The clutch in stock form will most likely be fine for your riding style . Hang onto your upgrade parts just in case.
The clutch slip most common for the Fj is in the high rpm shifts under load at maximum acceleration.
If you keep the load light and stay away from 8k shifts you will be fine.
Cheers guys, I will hang onto the parts and yes I have one of those telescopic magnets. Got me out of a mess a few years ago when I dropped the valve tool bolt into the engine on my old FJ...20 seconds of fishing and it was out.
Just got to pick up the clutch holding tool from post office tomorrow and away we go with the work on this one. Once fitted I'll take it easy on the new clutch for a few hundred miles anyway just to give it chance to bed in and then we'll see how it goes.
After 3.5 hours of tinkering, I have the RPM shift kit and all the new clutch fibres/steels, shift shaft seals/circlip, pushrod and original master cylinder fitted.
All appears well, the bite point is much much better, the gears all change correctly (and smoothly) and I'm hopeful that it will be a better riding experience.
I didn't get chance to road test today, but will do so over the weekend...
Already just by starting up and testing it on the centre stand through the gears I'm keen to get out there and see how it all feels on the road.
The only downer was a large-ish puddle of oil on the garage floor which I am fairly sure came pouring out of the open shift shaft hole when I had the bike on the side stand...lesson learned!
It meant I had to use my last 500ml of VR1 to top up when all back together.
Will update when a thorough road test has been carried out.
Quick question, would people recommend I take it easy on the new clutch for a while. Is that accepted 'good practice' or does it not really matter?
Did you pre-soak the fibers in oil before installation?
..
Quote from: FJ_Hooligan on April 17, 2015, 03:36:16 PM
Did you pre-soak the fibers in oil before installation?
Yes I soaked them overnight. :good2:
Ride it like you stole it. :-)
Quote from: mark1969 on April 17, 2015, 03:34:06 PM
The only downer was a large-ish puddle of oil on the garage floor which I am fairly sure came pouring out of the open shift shaft hole when I had the bike on the side stand...lesson learned!
It meant I had to use my last 500ml of VR1 to top up when all back together.
Quick question, would people recommend I take it easy on the new clutch for a while. Is that accepted 'good practice' or does it not really matter?
You should not have lost any oil, you took something out you did not need to... But its done now and you will not need to crack it open for some time now. When I put in new steels and fibers I noticed the clutch had a slight shudder feel. It went away after about 500 miles or so. Ride normally or ride it like you stole it, the OEM clutch is good to go.
Did you take that wire out?
If he had it on the side stand when he removed the shift rod to install the detent kit oil would have leaked out. Made the same mistake when I installed mine. :ireful:
Quote from: copper on April 17, 2015, 03:59:58 PM
If he had it on the side stand when he removed the shift rod to install the detent kit oil would have leaked out. Made the same mistake when I installed mine. :ireful:
Oh, the shift shaft? It can stay in for the shift kit.... That makes sense.
you soaked the fibers so there is no need to baby it . Just ride like normal and if it does give you the grabby feel put it in 3rd and slip it up to speed .
that will take the edges off.
Quote from: FJmonkey on April 17, 2015, 04:05:47 PM
Quote from: copper on April 17, 2015, 03:59:58 PM
If he had it on the side stand when he removed the shift rod to install the detent kit oil would have leaked out. Made the same mistake when I installed mine. :ireful:
Oh, the shift shaft? It can stay in for the shift kit.... That makes sense.
Yea but some of us like to take an easy job and make it a hard job.... that is until we find out it could have been an easy job :dash2:
Quote from: copper on April 17, 2015, 04:48:09 PM
Quote from: FJmonkey on April 17, 2015, 04:05:47 PM
Quote from: copper on April 17, 2015, 03:59:58 PM
If he had it on the side stand when he removed the shift rod to install the detent kit oil would have leaked out. Made the same mistake when I installed mine. :ireful:
Oh, the shift shaft? It can stay in for the shift kit.... That makes sense.
Yea but some of us like to take an easy job and make it a hard job.... that is until we find out it could have been an easy job :dash2:
Indeed! Turns out if I'd left the shift shaft in place the whole job would have been so much easier. I was thinking installing the shift kit would be difficult but it turned out to be easy compared to getting the shift lever off its splines to then take out the shift shaft...which it turns out was overkill..ah well.. :dash1: :rofl:
Anyway, job done and I look forward to blasting off the cobwebs.
Quick update, I had a short ride today just to see if everything works...and it does.
The clutch is very smooth, bite point is further out from bar (which I wanted); there is NO judder or anything untoward in the engagement of the clutch; the gear change is silky smooth, so much so that I cannot quite believe it. Changing gear now takes little to no effort, which means no more struggling to find neutral when coming to a standstill. I fitted the RPM shift kit which has made all the difference (along side all the new clutch bits). To anyone lurking who is considering it I say go for it, you will NOT regret it. :yahoo:
So only did about 30 miles, but it was enough to give the clutch a good workout and it passed with no weird feel or slip, so I'm happy.
The only thing is, I am now acutely aware of the throwout bearing noise when idling in neutral.....so that will be replaced very soon.
And finally, my aims have been met - which were to have a normal clutch with no heavy lever action and a smooth gear change. All of which means I can now concentrate on the road / riding / journey and not be preoccupied with an annoying clutch which I dreaded using in slow traffic.
It's been costly, but worth it, and I know the Barnett conversion is a good piece of kit, but for me I didn't want to add it to an ageing clutch to mask the problems of worn out parts. I wanted to try a standard all new clutch first. If I ever do fit one it will be if / when I experience slip on a relatively new clutch. And of course, hopefully it won't be necessary! :good2:
Good report Mark, happy to hear you can now find your Kookaloo....
Great , Glad it worked for you so far.
Just stay away from high rpm shifts and you will be just peachy .