So, as many who know me can attest, I'm very hesitant to change things...insofar as the FJ is concerned anyway. I generally think that Yamaha got it right the first time around and hey, if everything is working well enough, why fix it? Add to that, my long list of other projects and I find myself not wanting to open up a new can of worms...so I tend to maintain to the best of my ability the parts that were originally supplied from Yamaha.
That being said, I had a chat with several folks at the WCR this year about the start up procedure with their bikes. They would pull the choke out one notch, hit the button and everything was smooth. Idled fine...and was ready to ride in short order. For the 17 years I've owned my '92 FJ1200, starting it and warming it up has been a pain!!! Two to three clicks on the choke...start it...listen to it sputter...run over and blip the throttle...one notch back on the choke...set the throttle up with the throttlemeister...put my helmet on only to hear the revs go up to 6,000...back off the throttle...less choke... Good lord that thing wouldn't really run with *no* choke until I rode it down the street a mile or two and then everything was fine.
The universal response I got from other FJ-ers was, "#40 pilot jets", so I started looking into this. Apparently, the 37.5 jets in my bike were an attempt to meet US EPA regs and the rest of the world got 40's and 42.5's. Okay...this is compelling. I had a nice ride and chat with SimiEd about this and expressed my concern of chasing carburetor issues for the next six months if I started down this path. He assured me they were plug and play and didn't effect anything else in the carbs. Well, he was right...and so was everyone else!
I installed the 40's this last week and WHAT A DIFFERENCE!!!
(http://www.rpmracingca.com/prodimages/large/Carb%20Pilotjet-1.jpg)
The bike now starts instantly on just one notch of choke and idles perfectly...It's also ready to ride much sooner than with the old setup. I couldn't be happier and what a simple upgrade!!! If you're debating this like I have been for so many years, just do it! WELL worth the small effort!
Randy has these for less than $4 each: http://www.rpmracingca.com/proddetail.asp?prod=Carb%3APilotjet&cat=39 (http://www.rpmracingca.com/proddetail.asp?prod=Carb%3APilotjet&cat=39)
In the interest of full disclosure, I live relatively close to sea level...am running the stock air box with factory air filter...and also did a valve adjustment and carb sync at the same time as the #40 jet install. Given that, this is the first time in 17 years that starting the FJ is a joy and not a hassle. :good2:
On a side note, would this be considered "idle conversation?" :scratch_one-s_head:
Quote from: Capn Ron on August 07, 2014, 12:17:57 AM
On a side note, would this be considered "idle conversation?" :scratch_one-s_head:
...very clever, you jet setter! :sarcastic:
Quote from: The General on August 07, 2014, 05:43:25 AM
Quote from: Capn Ron on August 07, 2014, 12:17:57 AM
On a side note, would this be considered "idle conversation?" :scratch_one-s_head:
...very clever, you jet setter! :sarcastic:
Good one Doug, now you've started it!
Hi Cap'n! It's about 2 weeks on since installing #40 pilots, #115 mains and shimming the needles. The bike has been transformed! Start up procedure and subsequent warm up exactly as you describe. Stock airbox with UNI OEM replacement filter, V&H 4:1 exhaust. A huge word of thanks to the slowoldguy!!!
Chris
+1 :good2:. Easy way to clean your pilot jets :lol:. Anyone that has a reason to pull there carbs should evaluate this change.
George
yep....and your air cooled engine will run cooler!
How do you remove or add shims to the needles?
Glad to say :shout: "Told ya so" :shout: Glad it worked out as well as I expected.
When are we riding again? I can tell you some more 'words of wisdom'. :rofl2:
Quote from: Capn Ron on August 07, 2014, 12:17:57 AM
So, as many who know me can attest, I'm very hesitant to change things...insofar as the FJ is concerned anyway. I generally think that Yamaha got it right the first time around and hey, if everything is working well enough, why fix it?
Ron, Ron, Ron...
I don't want to hijack the thread, but here is my recent experience over the last few weeks. I have been riding & modifying my two 86's since I bought them many years ago. All of the RPM goodies from the fork valves, to the rear shock, handle bar risers, vibrantors, carb work, oil filter adapter, shift kit and more.
After you have done all of that and you hope on a stock bike you quickly come to realize what a poor riding bike the stock FJ was.
I started riding my recently acquired ABS 93, which was basically stock, with the exception of blue dots and an FJR brake M/C. I mean stock all the way down to the bias ply tires...
All, I have to say is that last weekend, the bike is no longer stock with the exception of the bias ply tires. I can tell you after my daily commute this week those are on the way out too with the 17" wheel upgrade when the wheels arrive. While the bike rides much better it still chases all of the lines in the road because the bias ply tires are sucked into the valleys of the roadway cracks, I cant wait for radials.
The only upgrade that I haven't gotten to yet is the shift kit and that will happen this weekend, you don't realize how buttery smooth the shifting became due to the roller detent and heavier spring of the RPM shift kit...I miss at least one shift every trip as I have to hold pressure on the shift lever to ensure the detent rolls to the point required to engage the drive cogs of the transmission. Where as with the RPM shift kit installed I guess I am just "flicking" the lever and it detents into position smoother & quicker for sure, positive shifting.
Next time you are up this way, you need to stop by and take one of my FJ's out for a ride and feel the difference for yourself.
P.S... there are still a few things to do to your carbs & bike to make it run even better.
Randy - RPM
Randy,
Yeah, I agree with most all the mods folks are doing to their FJ's and the improvements they realize. I am slow to change more things on the bike, mostly because I enjoy riding it...rather than having it apart in the garage. I have to prioritize anything I do to the FJ with many other projects/hobbies I support single-handedly (nine things registered at the DMV and a house :shok: ). All those get prioritized against always having the FJ ready to ride. I manage to keep all the plates spinning at the same time (barely) and have to have a VERY good reason to add another project to the list! Thus the "If it's not smokin' or broken, it's probably not getting upgraded" mind-set. :yes:
That being said, I have upgraded my front and rear suspension, new oil cooler, installed all SS brake/clutch lines, fork brace and have done a variety of electrical/relay mods. Those were all "must-do's" in my opinion. My next addition will be a set of wider ABS wheels to accommodate radial tires for my "canyon days".
I would love to stop by the shop and check out your place and a bike with your fork valves and the shift kit installed. I'll plan a ride up there when the heat breaks! :good2:
Quote from: Capn Ron on August 07, 2014, 08:29:53 PM
My next addition will be a set of wider ABS wheels to accommodate radial tires for my "canyon days".
What source do you have for wider ABS wheels? I know you can have the stock wheels widened (Kosman?). But that's kind of expensive.
Quote from: FJ_Hooligan on August 07, 2014, 09:06:06 PM
Quote from: Capn Ron on August 07, 2014, 08:29:53 PM
My next addition will be a set of wider ABS wheels to accommodate radial tires for my "canyon days".
What source do you have for wider ABS wheels? I know you can have the stock wheels widened (Kosman?). But that's kind of expensive.
That's the route I'm taking...
Re-read my above post about juggling a dozen projects. The "bolt-on-swap" wheel projects I've followed here end up involving some or most of the following issues: speedo drive, bigger axles, swing arms, cush drive spacer machining, off-set sprockets, rear brake/arm relocation AND losing my working ABS to boot. Doing a wheel swap *may* seem cheaper and it probably is for those that are staring at snow drifts all winter long, but here in SoCal, those are prime riding days! :good2: I have a spare set of ABS wheels that need to be powder-coated anyway so I can do this all off-line with NO down-time. All things considered (for me anyway), this is the way to go.
Quote from: Capn Ron on August 07, 2014, 08:29:53 PM
......I have upgraded my front and rear suspension....
Ron, did you already replace the weak sauce oem rear shock? That is (IMHO) a very necessary upgrade (#1 on my list).
Whatever route you take in getting modern 17" tires on your bike, so be it....just do it. (2nd on my list of necessary mods)
Quote from: Pat Conlon on August 07, 2014, 10:09:21 PM
Quote from: Capn Ron on August 07, 2014, 08:29:53 PM
......I have upgraded my front and rear suspension....
Ron, did you already replace the weak sauce oem rear shock? That is (IMHO) a very necessary upgrade (#1 on my list).
Whatever route you take in getting modern 17" tires on your bike, so be it....just do it. (2nd on my list of necessary mods)
Yeah, I think the first major mod I did was a Penske Sport shock (years before the RPM shock was available) dialed in to my riding/loaded weight... Soon thereafter, I upgraded to 1gk straight-rate springs in the front end via Racetech...but I did not have the emulators installed at the time. I know a nice bump up in fork performance can be gained with the RPM fork valves...They're on the list, but with all my projects, it's a *very* long list. :yes:
I'm looking forward to getting some wider rubber on a set of wheels dialed in for the canyons!
Quote from: racerrad8 on August 07, 2014, 07:50:41 PM
the shift kit...you don't realize how buttery smooth the shifting it detents into position smoother & quicker for sure, positive shifting.
Randy - RPM
Since this thread has been "hijacked" already, and has become a post listing various "necessary" mods, I have to ask:
Do you mod this shift kit in any way before your sell it? I installed the same brand kit (with the stiffer spring, and roller bearing detent roller) on another bike that was notorious for false neutrals, and crunching sounds that would make you cringe when you stabbed at the lever while in one of those false neutrals. It definitely cleared up the false neutrals, and did exhibit positive shifting. However, the shifting was not "buttery smooth", in fact it became more notchy. Something that I would attribute to the stiffer spring. All and all, it was a mod that was necessary on that particular bike, because of the false neutrals that plagued it.
And I don't know if Yamaha did anything with the shifting components on later year bikes, but the shifting action between my '87 and my '85 is apparent. I would even go so far as saying the 87's is buttery smooth when compared to the 85's. Maybe the former does have the RPM shift kit in it. :yes: Installed by the PO.
Ron, you are correct about "staring at snow drifts". Although the long winters in my area offer time to do mods and maintenance, I'd rather be riding.
Quote from: FJ1100mjk on August 08, 2014, 04:52:44 AM
Ron, you are correct about "staring at snow drifts". Although the long winters in my area offer time to do mods and maintenance, I'd rather be riding.
Hey Marty...no worries about the hijack...I think threads ebb and flow and we all get something out of them.
I grew up in a part of the country that had forced down-time due to snow drifts... (upstate NY) and in some senses, I miss that. Ehhh...who am I kidding? I continue to live in SoCal and all that implies for the weather and the nearly 365 days of riding and sailing!!! :good2:
Okay, I'm taking it back to the posted topic for a minute. I too am running #115 mains and #40 pilot jets in my FJ, an 84. My pilot jets are the type with no holes on the sides. The stock #37.5 jets were that type also. Is this an early FJ carb setup, do the later models have a different carb, or jetting setup? I originally tried to run the type with the side holes and it ran like shit. no idle and stumbled till about 3500 rpm. Once I put the holeless ones in she ran excellent and continues to this day! There is a difference...right? Charley. (popcorn)
Quote from: charleygofast on August 08, 2014, 07:06:02 AM
Okay, I'm taking it back to the posted topic for a minute. I too am running #115 mains and #40 pilot jets in my FJ, an 84. My pilot jets are the type with no holes on the sides. The stock #37.5 jets were that type also. Is this an early FJ carb setup, do the later models have a different carb, or jetting setup? I originally tried to run the type with the side holes and it ran like shit. no idle and stumbled till about 3500 rpm. Once I put the holeless ones in she ran excellent and continues to this day! There is a difference...right? Charley. (popcorn)
Charley,
There is no difference in the jets with the side holes and without. The side holes do two things, it give a place for debris to go instead of just to the microscopic hole causing it plug and to aid in cleaning later as the holes allow more access for cleaner solution to get into the jet.
The metering portion of the jet is always the microscopic hole at the tip of the jet which is sealed by the taper seat of the jet, so...
There is no difference in the metering of the actual jet.
Randy - RPM
Bminder,
Regarding adding slide needle shims-in my case I have an OEM slide needles, so they aren't adjustable like an aftermarket needle that has grooves would be. However, it is possible to utilize uniformly sized washers, x01 per needle, to effect the height of the needle in the main jet "tube". My understanding is that one washer should be placed between the circlip and plastic alignment piece. This is what we did with my '85...sorry, I don't have any pics of this, however, if you check out the illustrated carb cleaning procedure in the carb files section, you'll find pictures that will give you the idea. There is also a topic "shimming needles" (topic=11325.0) where Randy explains proper placement (Thanks Randy!).
Chris
Quote from: FJ1100mjk on August 08, 2014, 04:52:44 AM
Do you mod this shift kit in any way before your sell it? I installed the same brand kit (with the stiffer spring, and roller bearing detent roller) on another bike that was notorious for false neutrals, and crunching sounds that would make you cringe when you stabbed at the lever while in one of those false neutrals. It definitely cleared up the false neutrals, and did exhibit positive shifting. However, the shifting was not "buttery smooth", in fact it became more notchy. Something that I would attribute to the stiffer spring. All and all, it was a mod that was necessary on that particular bike, because of the false neutrals that plagued it.
Did you buy the RPM roller detent or the F/P kit?
I do not modify the kit in any form that I sell, I use a high quality roller bearing detent lever. The reason I stopped carrying the "other" kit was because when they arrived, the detent lever was in a small plastic bag that was marked, "made in china".
I also did a fair amount of testing with differing springs to get the correct tension so that there is not a significant amount of lever force, but provides more pressure on the detent lever bearing which accelerates the shift cam speed and quicker positive shifts.
Randy - RPM
I installed Randy's kit a while back and while I would not call it "buttery smooth" it did make the shifting more positive. A good mod especally if you are working in the clutch area. What I found on mine was that the stock roller was a little sloppy and I am sure the 20-30 year old stock spring wasn't as good as it use to be when new. The kit has a new and improved roller bearing and with the new spring provides more positive shifting. I personally seem to notice it more on down shifting but works both ways. Here is a picture. The spring is the old one.
(http://fjowners.com/gallery/7/1651_16_04_14_7_58_55.jpeg)
George
Quote from: racerrad8 on August 09, 2014, 02:01:14 PM
Did you buy the RPM roller detent or the F/P kit?
Randy - RPM
Factory Pro. It was for my much-missed Honda VFR750F.
Too bad the kit didn't come with the spring tuning by Randy feature. I put over 20,000 miles on the bike after the kit was installed, and the shifting was always notchy. But like I said, the false neutrals and dreaded gearbox crunching were eliminated. $ well spent. Didn't have to remove the clutch for the install either, which was nice.