As my "noobie" handle might have clued you, I'm a brand new FJ owner. As noted in my intro post I just unloaded my new-to-me '89 from my truck last night.
A quick once-over revealed that it is time for a new chain. That's not the sort of thing I would put off on any motorcycle, let alone on a 259 KG torque monster, so "new chain" on the top of my 2 do list.
What brand/vendor do you recommend?
I have a chain breaker that does the job on a 530 - will it be up to the FJ monster links or do I need something bigger?
Is there anything quirky about changing this chain?
BTW thanks for the owner's manual link, mates. I now have that PDF in an "FJ" folder on my desktop that I'm sure will be getting more entries soon.
EK ZZZ or DID ZVM, wherever you can find the best price... try eBay and Amazon.
Welcome Burns!
What part of the world are you from? We've got FJ Owners on most continents, rallys in some of them and much free advice! On that last note, many here steered me towards an EK-ZZZ chain. I had a dealer-installed chain on my bike and was adjusting that thing after every two days of riding (400 mile days). I got fed up with that routine and replaced it with the EK-ZZZ and both sprockets. Rode another 12,000 miles on that trip and only had to adjust the new chain twice. TWICE! :yahoo:
Keeping it clean and properly lubed is a breeze once you get into that habit and it'll last you for many years!!
Cap'n Ron. . .
"Chain chain chain, chain of FOOLS"... :i_am_so_happy:
If the chain is toast, cut it off w angle grinder in 10sec. Only break one if you're going to reuse which happens... never.. Chain tool mostly handy for the rivet-peen function, this IMO.
Quote from: Burns on February 09, 2014, 02:59:05 PM
Is there anything quirky about changing this chain?
As ddlewis pointed out, just cutting the old chain will be your easiest method. If you do that...and aren't replacing sprockets, just wire the new chain to the back of the old (cut) chain...using that to pull the new chain around the front sprocket.
Cap'n Ron. . .
Thanks for the tips fellas. I'll be shopping for the EK.
I'm leaning toward changing the sprockets (which look ok) just to give that new chain its least hostile environment.
+1 on the EK-ZZZ. Adjustment --- maybe once between tire changes.
If you're going to change the sprockets as well, it would be a good time to consider the different sizes available and the ratios that result. Stock is 17/42 Depending on the type of driving you expect to do, it may be to your liking to select accordingly.
Randy at RPM has a good selection. http://www.rpmracingca.com/products.asp?cat=39&filter=Sprockets (http://www.rpmracingca.com/products.asp?cat=39&filter=Sprockets)
The 'Search' function will help to see what others have done and their observations on different combinations.
Is anybody else running or has run an EK MVXZ chain on their FJ? Or I guess more importantly, has anyone broken one on their FJ?
Joe
There's nothing to discuss here.
Best chain, rivet link, that's it!
Don't be influenced by what's easiest to fit (clip) or a few dollars cheaper, it will be on there for a long time (or maybe it won't)
Noel
Quote from: ribbert on February 09, 2014, 08:24:53 PM
There's nothing to discuss here.
Best chain, rivet link, that's it!
Don't be influenced by what's easiest to fit (clip) or a few dollars cheaper, it will be on there for a long time (or maybe it won't)
Noel
Rivet type master link is the only way to go. Here is the riveting tool that I have. It works great.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ATV-Bike-Motorcycle-Cam-Drive-Chain-Breaker-Riveter-Rivet-Riveting-Cutter-Tool-/200924656964?pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&hash=item2ec80af544&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/ATV-Bike-Motorcycle-Cam-Drive-Chain-Breaker-Riveter-Rivet-Riveting-Cutter-Tool-/200924656964?pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&hash=item2ec80af544&vxp=mtr)
Fred
Quote from: markmartin on February 09, 2014, 04:42:55 PM
+1 on the EK-ZZZ. Adjustment --- maybe once between tire changes.
If you're going to change the sprockets as well, it would be a good time to consider the different sizes available and the ratios that result. Stock is 17/42 Depending on the type of driving you expect to do, it may be to your liking to select accordingly.
Randy at RPM has a good selection.
(http://www.rpmracingca.com/products.asp?cat=3)
Not on a 89 it isn't. 17/40.
Otherwise absolutely right. 18/43 is the same good compromise that stock is, with a bit of an easier life for the chain. Realize that you'll have to buy a bit extra length in the process, though. The other nice thing is that if you wanted to give it longer legs, you could cut another few links out and drop the rear back down, probably without changing the chain per the usual requirement.
EK ZZZ is a kickass chain.
Buy stuff from Randy. Best service and pricing you'll be able to find.
Quote from: andyb on February 09, 2014, 08:49:57 PM
Quote from: markmartin on February 09, 2014, 04:42:55 PM
+1 on the EK-ZZZ. Adjustment --- maybe once between tire changes.
If you're going to change the sprockets as well, it would be a good time to consider the different sizes available and the ratios that result. Stock is 17/42 Depending on the type of driving you expect to do, it may be to your liking to select accordingly.
Randy at RPM has a good selection.
(http://www.rpmracingca.com/products.asp?cat=3)
Not on a 89 it isn't. 17/40.
Otherwise absolutely right. 18/43 is the same good compromise that stock is, with a bit of an easier life for the chain. Realize that you'll have to buy a bit extra length in the process, though. The other nice thing is that if you wanted to give it longer legs, you could cut another few links out and drop the rear back down, probably without changing the chain per the usual requirement.
EK ZZZ is a kickass chain.
Buy stuff from Randy. Best service and pricing you'll be able to find.
+1 on the 18T c/s and RPM service.
Randy's got chain on the site now? :unknown:
Screw what I said about eBay and Amazon... get one from him.
EK ZZZ ..... No master links... Best price I have found is. http://www.indysuperbikes.com/product.php?productid=700059&page=1 (http://www.indysuperbikes.com/product.php?productid=700059&page=1)
George
I like D.I.D.
Never used anything else so can't comment on EZ items.
I'm a big fan of the DID ZVM-X chains. When I pulled my FJ out of storage several years ago, the old Diamond brand chain that was on her, was toast (rusty and squeaky (no lube in the rollers)). I replaced it with a DID ZVM-2 and got around 30,000 miles on it before having to replace it with a ZVM-X. To be honest, I don't think you can go wrong with either an EK or DID chain. Our FJ's originally came with DID 530 O-Ring chains (At least according to the factory Service Manuals), and today's modern chains are made with newer materials and better technology. Both my OEM chain and the Diamond replacement only lasted about 20,000 miles apiece, though I have to admit that I didn't take as good a care of them as I did the ZVM replacement chains.
I bit the bullet and got a good chain and chain tool about 6 months ago. I have not adjusted it yet, I ride about 8K a year so I might get by with never adjusting the chain just cuz it needs it. It will get set/adjusted every time I put new rubber on. EK-ZZZ or equivalent, clean it, lube it, ride the hell out of it. Nuff said. Move on... Nothing more to see here... I need new muffler bearing oil, any suggestions????
Quote from: FJmonkey on February 09, 2014, 10:22:53 PM
I bit the bullet and got a good chain and chain tool about 6 months ago. I have not adjusted it yet, I ride about 8K a year so I might get by with never adjusting the chain just cuz it needs it. It will get set/adjusted every time I put new rubber on. EK-ZZZ or equivalent, clean it, lube it, ride the hell out of it. Nuff said. Move on... Nothing more to see here... I need new muffler bearing oil, any suggestions????
Just use a fist full of Lard. Slather it on and fire the engine up. When it gets to operating temps, throw on 2 eggs, 2 pieces of bacon, and maybe some hash browns as well. :good2:
Quote from: FeralRdr on February 09, 2014, 10:33:23 PM
Just use a fist full of Lard. Slather it on and fire the engine up. When it gets to operating temps, throw on 2 eggs, 2 pieces of bacon, and maybe some hash browns as well. :good2:
I am feeling the love... Monkey love... That was a great laugh, thanks....
a couple jalapenos will cut that hydrocarbon after-taste.
But before we go, on the topic of gearing that was raised earlier: this bike ('89) came with 17/40 sprockets, if I went 18/40 (for chain-friendliness and maybe some extra "m" in my MPG), would that substantially affect the zero to 10 mph (e,g, initial pull-away from a stop sign) ridability (e.g. require some clutch slippage)?
I'm an old man and ride accordingly. This bike will be North of 3 figures on the speedo only very rarely and has no competitive canyon carving in its future.
Quote from: andyb on February 09, 2014, 08:49:57 PM
Not on a 89 it isn't. 17/40.
Thanks Andy, you're right- 17/40. I was going off memory, and my memory ratio is usually closer to 50/50.
Mark M
Quote from: Burns on February 10, 2014, 10:58:01 AM
But before we go, on the topic of gearing that was raised earlier: this bike ('89) came with 17/40 sprockets, if I went 18/40 (for chain-friendliness and maybe some extra "m" in my MPG), would that substantially affect the zero to 10 mph (e,g, initial pull-away from a stop sign) ridability (e.g. require some clutch slippage)?
I'm an old man and ride accordingly. This bike will be North of 3 figures on the speedo only very rarely and has no competitive canyon carving in its future.
I say it's not an issue. YMMV. I went from the stock 17/40 to 17/38 and then last summer went to 18/38. The clutch slippage (the clutch isn't slipping, I'm just feathering out the clutch lever) from a stop is probably a little more now, but of course one adjusts automatically and I really can't tell. The only time I really noticed having to slip the clutch from take off was when we were riding 2-up, fully loaded with 3 hard bags and a tank bag packed for a few days of riding, and taking off from a stop going up a hill.
I like the lower RPMs this ratio puts out when out on the road. The FJ has plenty of snap for me even at 18/38. I'm rarely above 6000 RPM. I also like having a taller 1st gear.
I don't find the taller gearing effects the gas mileage.
I have a 18/38 and am now thinking about going to a 17/38 combo. Just want a little more acceleration at lower RPM's around town. Not to race but for traffic purposes. Acceleration is a two edged sword, it can kill you or save you. That's just me, nothing wrong with 18/38. I am just zeroing in the bike for me.
MPG issue just doesn't compute with the FJ, its just not that kind of bike. IMO going to a higher gear sometimes doesn't help the MPG without a more elaborate fuel control system. The 18/38 is probably more chain friendly but I don't know really how much it saves you. Someone else will have to answer that.
I am not an aggressive rider I just want to be able to get out of harms way fast as reasonably possable when the situation arises (and it happens). Distracted drivers etc... Go's fast enough on the freeway even with stock gearing.
No one answer for everyone. Just have to trim it in for you. Use a good chain though what ever you do.....
George
Yes, going to a longer gear will make the bike measurably slower. It'll be noticable only if you run against someone on shorter gearing side by side, it'll still have all the legs in the world for getting your scoot on.
Don't expect a big mileage improvement. You didn't buy a machine with more than a liter of displacement just to worry about mileage.
Personally, I think stock gearing is just about ideal, but everyone has a different idea of what ideal is. In theory, you should run sprockets that don't share divisors (17/40 = good, 18/41 = good, 16/48 = bad, etc) to retain good chain life, but it's an old rule and probably not worth more than a tiny amount.
Quote from: markmartin on February 10, 2014, 11:16:49 AM
Thanks Andy, you're right- 17/40. I was going off memory, and my memory ratio is usually closer to 50/50.
If your memory is 50/50, then your thinking should be quite fast, it just takes quite awhile to get there.
Hrm... :)
Quote from: andyb on February 10, 2014, 01:14:41 PM
In theory, you should run sprockets that don't share divisors (17/40 = good, 18/41 = good, 16/48 = bad, etc) to retain good chain life, but it's an old rule and probably not worth more than a tiny amount.
Andy,
That is curious logic for a chain and sprockets. Is it similar to the logic used in odd ratio gearing on a bevel drive cam system? The bevel gear ratio randomizes the gear tooth pairing so cam stresses don't constantly repeat on the same gear tooth pair leading to fatigue failure.
Precisely. Seems like most people don't worry about it, so I can't imagine it's as much an issue anymore. The last bike that a friend had with 15/45 gearing was gentle on chains because it had maybe 50hp at best, and I'm using 16/44 on my ZX9 without any noticable issue... but I'm using a really good chain, which I think makes more of a difference.
Probably made a much bigger difference in the days of singles/twins on non-oring chains.
Based on your collective wisdom I've decided to keep the stock rear tooth count and go with an 18T front (mostly for chain friendliness) and the ED 530ZZZ with rivet link. Last question: is 110 links long enough to accommodate that extra tooth?
Thank you, Sirs.
Where are you buying your chain ? The one I got from http://www.indysuperbikes.com/product.php?productid=700059&page=1 (http://www.indysuperbikes.com/product.php?productid=700059&page=1) was 120 links so I had plenty to fit. It was also the best price for that quality of chain at the time. I just checked and it is still 120 links of chain. On the WEB page check the product options link/arrow.
George
Yes. I'm running 18/38 with 110 link chain.
Quote from: simi_ed on February 13, 2014, 02:50:45 PM
Yes. I'm running 18/38 with 110 link chain.
Ed, I think he is going to run 18/40 but I think 110 link will still work. I can't give him a confirmed answer as I am running the same as you 18/38.
George
Quote from: movenon on February 13, 2014, 05:21:27 PM
Quote from: simi_ed on February 13, 2014, 02:50:45 PM
Yes. I'm running 18/38 with 110 link chain.
Ed, I think he is going to run 18/40 but I think 110 link will still work. I can't give him a confirmed answer as I am running the same as you 18/38.
George
It's been a while, but it seems like I used 110 when I went to 18/40 a few seasons ago. :scratch_one-s_head:
When you use good chain, it's a good long while between changes. :pardon:
yep, and 1 link short is an expensive mistake.
but, as it turns out that's not going to be an issue since the best price on the zzz was for a 120 link unit anyway
I'm running 18/40 with 110 links
With a OEM swingarm, you don't need to go to 112 links until you put a 42 tooth sprocket on the back.
I'm using an 18/42 sprocket set with 112 links.
BTW, you USED TO be able to get a "half link" for standard chains (which was a single link), but with the current crop of O/X-ring chains length has to be changed in incrrements of 2 links.
You're showing your age, Arns. :rofl2:
Quote from: andyb on February 15, 2014, 10:20:20 AM
You're showing your age, Arns. :rofl2:
And you'd think I'd get some respect, considering. :-)
Its taken me a long time to get this old. Many are surprised I have :-/
Experience counts, which is the common feature that the knowledgable members of this forum share.
Arnie
For those chill'uns who have never seen one, pic below is a "half-link" for a standard non O-ring chain.
These came with a pin that went through the plates and the roller of the chain you were connecting to. There was a cotter to keep the pin in place.
(http://fjowners.com/gallery/6/99_16_02_14_7_36_08.jpeg)
Quote from: Arnie on February 15, 2014, 08:09:14 PM
Experience counts, which is the common feature that the knowledgable members of this forum share.
Many have so many experiences that they can't remember them all. :)
Quote from: andyb on February 16, 2014, 08:43:44 AM
Quote from: Arnie on February 15, 2014, 08:09:14 PM
Experience counts, which is the common feature that the knowledgable members of this forum share.
Many have so many experiences that they can't remember them all. :)
Certainly not all their names :-)
I went with the 18 and EK-ZZZ; bought the 120 link one and had to cut off 10. My worries about clutch slippage with the taller gears were certainly noobie - I double shift most of the time in street riding (1-3-5) drop to 4 for ramps and such, 3 if I feel the need for a little thrill of the moment.
That hydraulic clutch is SWEET coming off an XS650 with a industrial-revolution era unit.
Now for some wind protection! For a touring oriented bike I'd rate this bike pretty low on that dimension. My V-Max with a SlipStreamer was calmer. PO mounted one of those adjustable deflectors on the screen of the FJ (which I would rate as worthless). Wind blast is about at nose level in normal driving position.
I guess that would be another thread though.
I'm going with my son to pick up a Triumph Sprint he just bought. We'll be on mounts suited to our generations (me 66 him 46). I'm looking forward to the comparo (of the bikes that is).
Looking to a destination in the area (WA/IDAHO) for a little shake-down cruise.
Spring is about here and I wanna ride.