finally got round to riding my fj today not ridden it for a few months due to it needing a major service, spent the last few weeks in the evenings doing a few jobs on it... valve clearances, new collector, cleaned and oiled pods, cleaned calipers, new spark plugs, balanced carbs, replaced carb diaphragms, fitted dynojet needles, fresh oil and filter, new back tyre, chain oiled.
huge difference to ride won't leave it as long between services next time riding it was like riding a new bike think the main thing that made the difference was the diaphragms being replaced no more snatchy throttle at low revs going round small tight bendy bits was so much easier, bike seems more responsive with dyno needles and much smoother since doing the clearances, gear changes are smoother with new valvoline 20/50 race oil, and i'm pretty sure it was doing more mpg 100 miles ridden and the needles showing half a tank.
can't wait to get out for another ride. :good2:
Do you use 20/50 no matter what temp it is? I'm planing on flushing out my crank case with some cheap, light oil like 5/25 and I don't know what to put in for running. I do want to change it more often and use bulk oil (by the case) Say like every 1000 miles.
Use what you like, I normally run 10/40, have 20/50 in now, not much difference that I can tell. As long as it is oil and has no friction modifiers then you will be good to go. I use a full synth and change it less often. But I ran on Dyno and blended for years with no explosions, so just change as required and get your Kookaloo on dude...
Quote from: FJmonkey on December 21, 2013, 03:14:35 PM
Use what you like, I normally run 10/40, have 20/50 in now, not much difference that I can tell. As long as it is oil and has no friction modifiers then you will be good to go. I use a full synth and change it less often. But I ran on Dyno and blended for years with no explosions, so just change as required and get your Kookaloo on dude...
+1 :good:
Fred
started using 20/50 as recommended by the uk fj owners club when i bought my fj and just sort of stuck to using that ever since. did try some 10/40 once and it seemed to get through quite a lot of that.
was recommended not to use synthetic in the fj due to possibility of the clutch slipping.
I'm using Shell Rotella T6 full synthetic ad have had no issues with my clutch, FYI.
Leon
Quote from: 1tinindian on December 21, 2013, 06:28:53 PM
I'm using Shell Rotella T6 full synthetic ad have had no issues with my clutch, FYI.
Leon
good to know leon :good2:
i haven't tried synthetic purely based on taking advice from uk fj forum. opens up a world of different oils i can try. it's interesting comparing fj uk forum ideas to fjowners.com ideas.
Quote from: yampug on December 21, 2013, 07:27:01 PM
Quote from: 1tinindian on December 21, 2013, 06:28:53 PM
I'm using Shell Rotella T6 full synthetic ad have had no issues with my clutch, FYI.
Leon
good to know leon :good2:
i haven't tried synthetic purely based on taking advice from uk fj forum. opens up a world of different oils i can try. it's interesting comparing fj uk forum ideas to fjowners.com ideas.
Switching might give you some fits, I had some slip issues early on, after that it all was good...
Quote from: 1tinindian on December 21, 2013, 06:28:53 PM
I'm using Shell Rotella T6 full synthetic ad have had no issues with my clutch, FYI.
Leon
+1
Dan
Quote from: Dan Filetti on December 21, 2013, 10:49:55 PM
Quote from: 1tinindian on December 21, 2013, 06:28:53 PM
I'm using Shell Rotella T6 full synthetic ad have had no issues with my clutch, FYI.
Leon
+1
Dan
Been using it ever since the redcap Mobil1 went away.
Had some slip, added the Barnett conversion, some 60k miles ago.
this is the oil i opted for - http://www.valvoline.com/products/brands/racing/racing-motor-oil/6 (http://www.valvoline.com/products/brands/racing/racing-motor-oil/6)
any opinions?
taken from wiki-
Motorcycle usage
Though marketed as an engine oil for diesel trucks, Rotella oil has found popularity with motorcyclists as well. The lack of "friction modifiers" in Rotella means they do not interfere with wet clutch operations. (This is called a "shared sump" design, which is unlike automobiles which maintain separate oil reservoirs - one for the engine and one for the transmission). Used oil analysis (UOA) reports on BobIsTheOilGuy.com have shown wear metals levels comparable to oils marketed as motorcycle-specific.
can't seem to find a uk equivelent
Hola
For FJs the best is dinosaur oil... or fish oil, that contain Omega 3... sorry, only joking. There are a lot of discussions on this matter in the forum.
Its not a coincidence that me (with more than 400.000 kms on FJs) or Phill Hacker recomend 20-50w (10-40w in cold climates) mineral oils
With expensive synthetic oils your bike will sound like a bag of nails, the clutch would slip and the valve seals get hardened. And with the big tolerances of an air-cooled engine will spend a lot of oil
All advantages, like you can see
Regards
Quote from: yampug on December 22, 2013, 06:58:54 AM
can't seem to find a uk equivelent
Phill Hacker recommend Morris, originally formulated by diesel engines. It could be similar
Quote from: Alf on December 22, 2013, 08:12:03 AM
Quote from: yampug on December 22, 2013, 06:58:54 AM
can't seem to find a uk equivelent
Phill Hacker recommend Morris, originally formulated by diesel engines. It could be similar
think i'll stick with the valvoline vr1 i've got. :good2:
bargain price as well £25 for 5 litres spec - API SN/SM/SL
edit: bugger - Valvoline VR-1 Racing Motor Oil is not recommended for use in wet clutches(use Valvoline 4-Stroke Motorcycle Oil)
back to the drawing board.
Quote from: yampug on December 22, 2013, 06:52:56 AM
this is the oil i opted for - http://www.valvoline.com/products/brands/racing/racing-motor-oil/6 (http://www.valvoline.com/products/brands/racing/racing-motor-oil/6)
any opinions?
Perfect, that is the oil I use in all of my personal bikes and race cars. I recommend it highly and I assure you, as long as your clutch spring is good, you will never have a clutch problem.
I have been using and recommending that oil for my 20 years of racing & working on the FJ and I will not use anything else.
I am building two engines right now, one from a customers car that uses the Valvoline and the engine has had four full years of road racing on it. The oil is changed every four race weekends which is about 1000-1250 miles of hard, wide open racing application buried under the hood of a race car mounted sideways with poor air cooling circulation. Here is the oil that is dripping from the engine:
(http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc517/racerrad8/001_zps232feecc.jpg) (http://s1215.photobucket.com/user/racerrad8/media/001_zps232feecc.jpg.html)
Here is the oil for a street bike engine I am building and this engine runs strictly on synthetic oil:
(http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc517/racerrad8/002_zpsad44473e.jpg) (http://s1215.photobucket.com/user/racerrad8/media/002_zpsad44473e.jpg.html)
I am not totally sure of the exact mile, but this oil had just at 1000 miles on it.
Use the Valvoline and you will be fine.
I use, install and highly recommend the VR1 racing oils.
Randy - RPM
:dash1:
i should have known better than to start talking about oil on a bike forum. :dash2:
thanks for your reply randy :good2:
any one want to buy 4 litres of Motul 3000 4T 20W-50 i just purchased off ebay? :rofl2:
oh well it'll do for the next oil change i shall keep notes on clutch characteristics with the valvoline in comaparison to the motul 3000 oil.
i wonder if these friction modifiers supposedly added to car oil really do exist.
actually it's funny randy should come along and say the valvoline oil is a good oil as i originally found the valvoline recommened on a legends racer forum, i figured if it's good enough for those things being thrashed round a track with less cooling than an fj and having to lug around the weight of a car body then it'd be good enough for my fj. :good2:
Quote from: yampug on December 22, 2013, 03:05:41 PM
:dash1:
i should have known better than to start talking about oil on a bike forum. :dash2:
Yep, horrible!!!! :ireful:
Randy
I used Motul 300V racing when I raced with my 1100. And in a race it don´t mind if the bike spend or not too much oil or if the engine sound too much. Even the seals not get hardened too much because the temperature is constant, not changing all the time between 80-110ºC like in a road use
I´m a medium fast rider in open roads (well, not Valentino Rossi, obviously, but enough to chase all my friends in an open road with my dinosaur). And I don´t use more than 80% of the engine power most of the time. The 20-50w oil that I use (cheapo car oil API SG) is in good shape when I change at 6000 kms intervals, the engine don´t spend oil (with more than 100.000 kms in it) in my long travels around Europe on summer and the engine feel more sweet with mineral oil
And not only me. All my friends think the same. Even a couple of them use their FJs like a regular track weapons and use 20-50w oil with good results, changing the oil and filter each time that they go into a track. And all of them in a moment or another have changed to synthetic oils with not very good results in engine sound or oil comsumption
So don´t sell that 20.50 w oil
I for one am glad to here about what everybody is using for oil. When I had my other two 11's, I bought them new from a friend (suzuki dealer) and I just brought them to him for all the servicing. I never did anything to the bikes except clean them.
Pics of Old pics
(http://i1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc460/whiterabbit30/DSC04802.jpg)
(http://i1212.photobucket.com/albums/cc460/whiterabbit30/DSC04796.jpg)
Before the 11's, I changed my oil in my kz650 and used the cheapest oil I could find every 1000 miles, like quakerstate 10/40. back then it was like $9 a case and that is what I was planning on doing.
I run 15-40 Shell Rotella. I buy it for 12.00 to 15.00 a gallon. Change it so often that I have never seen it dirty. Seems to work. I do have 4 or 5 quarts of Valvoline motorcycle oil on the shelf I am going to use up next oil change and will give the Valvoline VR 1 a try later on. I think the key is change what ever oil you use often and I have to say the spin on filter is a blessing for that. :good2:
George
found this interesting castrol page with a video -
http://www.castrolmoto.com/en/trizone/clutch.php (http://www.castrolmoto.com/en/trizone/clutch.php)
intrigued as to whether these friction modifiers really do affect wet clutches, according to castrol yes and according to valvoline pdf on vr1 they say not suitable for wet clutches but with all randys experience he says vr1 is good for fj's
guess my best option is to experiment and make my own choice based on what i experience. :good2:
friction modifiers in oil fact or fiction?
You just have to find out what works for you. My theory is if all else fails try to use as close to the factory spec's as you can. You can way over think oil. :morning1:
George
I'm with George on oil. I think its way more important to change oil often. I don't care how well it lubricates, they all get dirty.
Quote from: TexasDave on December 23, 2013, 11:05:52 AM
I'm with George on oil. I think its way more important to change oil often. I don't care how well it lubricates, they all get dirty.
Actually you are with me on oil...remember you are using Valvoline VR1 20w-50wt too. :dance2:
Randy - RPM
I have used Valvoline oil in all of my VW bugs (6) for 30yrs here in HOT texas. They are 1600cc air cooled engines and have a smaller oil capacity. Yes on Randy's recommendation it is in the FJ also. :yahoo:
Friction modifiers definitely exist. No one who knows what they are talking about questions their existence.
The end result of my research on oil can be found here: http://fjowners.wikidot.com/oil (http://fjowners.wikidot.com/oil)
There is a summary at the top, and sourced references throughout.
Quote from: yampug on December 23, 2013, 09:00:45 AM
found this interesting castrol page with a video -
http://www.castrolmoto.com/en/trizone/clutch.php (http://www.castrolmoto.com/en/trizone/clutch.php)
intrigued as to whether these friction modifiers really do affect wet clutches, according to castrol yes and according to valvoline pdf on vr1 they say not suitable for wet clutches but with all randys experience he says vr1 is good for fj's
guess my best option is to experiment and make my own choice based on what i experience. :good2:
That makes a lot of sense ta me. I`d be interested on your report using a standard clutch in good condition & heaps of wrist. :good2: (Might just get the online numbers up too!....Heeeheheee) (popcorn)
Quote from: fintip on December 23, 2013, 02:45:55 PM
Friction modifiers definitely exist. No one who knows what they are talking about questions their existence.
The end result of my research on oil can be found here: http://fjowners.wikidot.com/oil (http://fjowners.wikidot.com/oil)
There is a summary at the top, and sourced references throughout.
apart from this sentence -
Modern car oils (since SH became obsolete in the 90's) have friction modifiers that screw with wet clutches.
is there anything else in your article about friction modifiers? sorry if i missed it i ctrl f'd friction modifier and it only came up in the first bit.
There is not a lot, but if you ctr+f "friction", you will see two other finds which will show you the particular additive in question, and why it is in there. The universal advice from those in the know is to not use modern street-use-approved automotive oils, with the exception of diesel oils. Randy's recommendation here of such an oil is the first I've ever heard, if that is indeed a street use approved car oil.
But that doesn't mean friction modifiers do or do not exist--the question is just how much they affect wet clutches.
I also use Rotella synth after all I've read. My engine will consume dino oil, but not synthetic. The previous owner told me as much, but I didn't believe him--I had been told that synthetic oils don't go with wet clutches.
Sure enough, upon oil change to regular "dino" oil, the bike started to consume oil. And sure enough, after more research showed synthetics are not only fine for wet clutches, but in general, preferable, I switched back... No more consumption.
Not sure why, but that's my experience. My clutch slips a little, but it did that from day one--it has 80k miles on it, and frankly needs a clutch service. This is a torquey engine.
Quote from: yampug on December 19, 2013, 01:12:35 PM
finally got round to riding my fj today not ridden it for a few months due to it needing a major service, spent the last few weeks in the evenings doing a few jobs on it... valve clearances, new collector, cleaned and oiled pods, cleaned calipers, new spark plugs, balanced carbs, replaced carb diaphragms, fitted dynojet needles, fresh oil and filter, new back tyre, chain oiled.
can't wait to get out for another ride. :good2:
You mentioned a new collector box, I think I read on another thread you have had some issues with it. What did you go for in the end? Did you get your issues sorted what did you have to do in the end?
How about the best of all worlds; Steel Header Lock Nut (http://www.rpmracingca.com/proddetail.asp?prod=Exhaust%3AH%2FN)
It is a metal lock nut with a flange...
Randy - RPM
Quote from: nurse on December 31, 2013, 02:31:58 PM
Quote from: yampug on December 19, 2013, 01:12:35 PM
finally got round to riding my fj today not ridden it for a few months due to it needing a major service, spent the last few weeks in the evenings doing a few jobs on it... valve clearances, new collector, cleaned and oiled pods, cleaned calipers, new spark plugs, balanced carbs, replaced carb diaphragms, fitted dynojet needles, fresh oil and filter, new back tyre, chain oiled.
can't wait to get out for another ride. :good2:
still trying to sort that out after fitting that shite delkavic box currently waiting for a second hand original box to arrive off ebay. then i may get the delkavic box cut and welded so it fits properly using the second hand original one as a pattern. at the moment i can only fit aftermarket race cans with the delk box fitted. no good for oe ones.
You mentioned a new collector box, I think I read on another thread you have had some issues with it. What did you go for in the end? Did you get your issues sorted what did you have to do in the end?