I was wondering what the best way to extend the swing arm without welding.......not too much....say 2-3 inches....any suggestions?
CanDman
Quote from: CanDman on December 15, 2013, 09:00:06 PM
I was wondering what the best way to extend the swing arm without welding.......not too much....say 2-3 inches....any suggestions?
CanDman
Why? If you don't mind my asking... I like the corners and canyon carving. It is more like flying a plane. Longer WB seems more like drag racing.... The launch must be a thrill....
Quote from: FJmonkey on December 15, 2013, 09:14:00 PM
Quote from: CanDman on December 15, 2013, 09:00:06 PM
I was wondering what the best way to extend the swing arm without welding.......not too much....say 2-3 inches....any suggestions?
CanDman
Why? If you don't mind my asking... I like the corners and canyon carving. It is more like flying a plane. Longer WB seems more like drag racing.... The launch must be a thrill....
Thx for weighing in Monkey........would 2 inches make that much difference? When I get the engine back in her....she is going to have a little more lift on the front end...from what I am being told
Kev
(popcorn)
she says it does
(popcorn)
hey Ran ....Trav ......what happened to the "OH IT'S ON NOW" Thread? I miss that one...lol
Kev
Quote from: CanDman on December 15, 2013, 09:20:28 PM
hey Ran ....Trav ......what happened to the "OH IT'S ON NOW" Thread? I miss that one...lol
Kev
Here ya go, Kev... knock yersef out. :negative:
http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=10060.0 (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=10060.0)
What sprockets are you running CanDman, wouldn't it be easier to just raise your gearing to try and tame the front end than making a longer swingarm.
Quote from: Bones on December 16, 2013, 02:46:54 AM
What sprockets are you running CanDman, wouldn't it be easier to just raise your gearing to try and tame the front end than making a longer swingarm.
I don't know Bones....someone else also suggested that a while back.....maybe I should look into that. I was talking to another member about it and he thought I was riding with a stock swingarm but when I told him that I had switched to a 97 T-ace he told me that it was in fact and inch and a half shorter than the FJ swingarm......there was also an aesthetic appearance I am trying to address. when I look at my bike from the side.....it just beckons to be extended......to me at least....the rear looks like it need to move back slightly...2 inches......anyway....I do appreciate your input thanks everybody
CanDman
Quote from: CanDman on December 15, 2013, 09:00:06 PM
I was wondering what the best way to extend the swing arm without welding.......not too much....say 2-3 inches....any suggestions?
CanDman
FWIW...If you go into our "FJ Winter Projects" section ,look at "fj1298"'s Dragbike project....it looks like a stock arm he added to.
You can get most of the benefit of a slightly longer arm by just lowering the bike some.
I've yet to see anyone get an arm stretched inexpensively, though periodically you can find them for sale reasonably priced. The other option is to consider looking for a swap from another machine that had a slightly longer one.
Maybe we could swap? I send you my stock arm off my 86' and you send your T-Ace arm. postage might suck.
Quote from: turbocamino on December 16, 2013, 08:44:35 AM
Quote from: CanDman on December 15, 2013, 09:00:06 PM
I was wondering what the best way to extend the swing arm without welding.......not too much....say 2-3 inches....any suggestions?
CanDman
FWIW...If you go into our "FJ Winter Projects" section ,look at "fj1298"'s Dragbike project....it looks like a stock arm he added to.
The arm on the drag bike is an FZ1 swing arm (as far as I know identical to the ThunderAce arm). It was extended 0-6" by Larry Hardcore (you can look him up on psychobike.com) for $375 back in 2009. Exceptional work and quick turnaround. And this isn't a swing arm that gets extended everyday like a Busa. Larry can also do a "fixed" extension like 2" or 4" or whatever.
(http://fjowners.com/gallery/171_25_04_10_9_54_22_1.jpeg)
Like Andy said - there's really no way to "cheap out" on this.
Another alternative may be a first gen R1 swing arm. I know Andy York swapped one in many years ago. Pretty sure they are 1 1/2" or 2" longer than stock.
(http://fjowners.com/gallery/5/171_13_05_13_9_23_57.jpeg)
All this talk of extending the swing arm because of more power leads me to wonder whether either Frank or Flynt, with their worked engines, extend their swing arms? I doubt you're building anything that would best either of those two machines, and, to the best of my knowledge, neither of them extended theirs. It comes down to, as with any bike, (or machine really) judicious throttle control. Get in cozy with your throttle, no matter the amount of power, there is no reason to extend the swing arm, unless you're building a track bike, seems to me.
It's a lesson I drilled into my boy when teaching him to ride his dirt bike: learning the subtleties of throttle control will keep you out of, and allow him to escape from, all sorts of trouble.
My $0.02
Dan
Dan - spot on that throttle control is critical no matter if you have the stock swing arm or longer (or even shorter)! If you get it long enough to not wheelie, then it's even easier to spin! Also, Frank has the FZ1 swing arm - so pretty sure it is the same length as the ThunderAce arm - and will dust most anything from a stop light (the rider - i.e. throttle and clutch control - is the difference).
If it is intended to be a street bike, I'd just ride it! If you want to do the drag strip or LSR or ??? then modify it for the purpose, but realize you will compromise it as a street bike. I didn't like the compromises so I put together the drag bike to go along with the street bike. A good shock on the back will do more for control than extending the swing arm 2 " too...
Quote from: Dan Filetti on December 16, 2013, 05:37:07 PM
wonder whether Flynt extend(ed) their swing arm?
I have the T-Ace swing arm with no extension... I am a bit raised in the rear and lowered in the front as well.
What made the difference for me was the tuning. When I went to the FCRs and tuned with Frank's help, it was too easy to get the front wheel up... had a few wheelies with Diane on the back when I was just leaving a stoplight quickly. When discussing how I wanted the bike to run post dyno, I specified a little softer on the lower end and more emphasis on smooth roll on. Now it will wheelie, but you have to want it to do so...
Frank
Thanks for all the input.....I may have posted the thread a bit wrong......what I should have said....was that I really think that CanD would look better if I moved the rear wheel 2 inches back ....do you think that doing so would dramatically affect the handling of her? ...and does anyone have any suggestions on how to do so without and welding......
CanDman
Since you have asked again, I will throw in my 2 cents......yes, it will significantly affect the handling and no, I can't conceive of any way to lengthen the swingarm safely without welding. If the appearance is what you are trying to address, I would be more inclined to modify the tail of the bike. There it is, 2 cents worth of advice. :crazy:
Joe
Quote from: CanDman on December 16, 2013, 05:39:44 AM
<<snip >> I had switched to a 97 T-ace he told me that it was in fact and inch and a half shorter than the FJ swingarm......<<snip>>CanDman
Kev, why wouldn't you go back to a stock swingarm? Would this get you 1-1/2" back? Also 2 extra links on your chain might get close to 2" back if there's room in the axle adjustment.
Quote from: CanDman on December 17, 2013, 09:20:04 PM
Thanks for all the input.....I may have posted the thread a bit wrong......what I should have said....was that I really think that CanD would look better if I moved the rear wheel 2 inches back ....do you think that doing so would dramatically affect the handling of her? ...and does anyone have any suggestions on how to do so without and welding......
CanDman
JMC - This was a 4" stretch and I don't recall Jon having any handling issues.
(http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb37/campsimonette/jmc_swing_zpsb202cf53.jpg) (http://s208.photobucket.com/user/campsimonette/media/jmc_swing_zpsb202cf53.jpg.html)
(http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb37/campsimonette/jmc_swing2_zps541a6f32.jpg) (http://s208.photobucket.com/user/campsimonette/media/jmc_swing2_zps541a6f32.jpg.html)
Quote from: Dads_FJ on December 18, 2013, 09:30:18 AM
Quote from: CanDman on December 17, 2013, 09:20:04 PM
Thanks for all the input.....I may have posted the thread a bit wrong......what I should have said....was that I really think that CanD would look better if I moved the rear wheel 2 inches back ....do you think that doing so would dramatically affect the handling of her? ...and does anyone have any suggestions on how to do so without and welding......
CanDman
JMC - This was a 4" stretch and I don't recall Jon having any handling issues.
(http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb37/campsimonette/jmc_swing_zpsb202cf53.jpg) (http://s208.photobucket.com/user/campsimonette/media/jmc_swing_zpsb202cf53.jpg.html)
(http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb37/campsimonette/jmc_swing2_zps541a6f32.jpg) (http://s208.photobucket.com/user/campsimonette/media/jmc_swing2_zps541a6f32.jpg.html)
There must be some guys on here with polish envy when they see this one.
Later pics of the same bike (Black Sunshine):
(http://i643.photobucket.com/albums/uu159/rktmanfj/BlackSunshine1.jpg)
(http://i643.photobucket.com/albums/uu159/rktmanfj/BlackSunshine4.jpg)
You'll feel it, and you'll definitely have reduced cornering clearance. That said, once you get the chassis set up and can keep the tire planted, you'll gain a pretty impressive amount of accelleration too....
Yes, that is a 4" stretch.
This post (http://www.fjowners.com/index.php?topic=3417.msg28806#msg28806) has the links to the site that was devoted to that bike, as rehosted here.
Quote from: markmartin on December 18, 2013, 08:46:41 AM
Kev, why wouldn't you go back to a stock swingarm? Would this get you 1-1/2" back? Also 2 extra links on your chain might get close to 2" back if there's room in the axle adjustment.
A link of 530 chain is 5/8" pin-to-pin. You need 2 links to go there and back, so you'd need more like 6 links to get two inches back.
If ever there was a bolt on that would tempt the most honest, law abiding Fjer into ways of a common thief, then that juicy, rare JMC rates as the tipping point. Or maybe a metmachex, but good luck in honestly finding either of those 80s icons of aftermarket lovliness.
Andy
Didn't Bob Nemic get that swingarm?
Quote from: andyb on December 18, 2013, 01:12:38 PM
Quote from: markmartin on December 18, 2013, 08:46:41 AM
Kev, why wouldn't you go back to a stock swingarm? Would this get you 1-1/2" back? Also 2 extra links on your chain might get close to 2" back if there's room in the axle adjustment.
A link of 530 chain is 5/8" pin-to-pin. You need 2 links to go there and back, so you'd need more like 6 links to get two inches back.
Yeah, that's what I said but that's not what I meant. :-) I was counting the 1-1/2" if he went back to the stock swing arm from the one he has now + a couple of links of chain for an additional 1/2" . 1-1/2" + 1/2" = 2"
Quote from: FJ_Hooligan on December 18, 2013, 03:36:38 PM
Didn't Bob Nemic get that swingarm?
Yes.
IIRC, the PM wheels and front end with the 6-pot calipers, too.
thanks for all the great input..........looks like I will live well enough alone......although that may change after I slap a turbo on her.... :mocking:
the FZ1 swingarm is definitely longer than the thunderace arm..... IIRC the thunderace swingarm is about 1.5 inches shorter than stock where the FZ1 arm is right at 2 inches longer than stock.
(http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f198/Racerman27410/IMG_0793.jpg) (http://s47.photobucket.com/user/Racerman27410/media/IMG_0793.jpg.html)
Merry Christmas and Kookaloo!
Frank
Quote from: racerman_27410 on December 23, 2013, 05:11:10 PM
the FZ1 swingarm is definitely longer than the thunderace arm..... IIRC the thunderace swingarm is about 1.5 inches shorter than stock where the FZ1 arm is right at 2 inches longer than stock.
(http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f198/Racerman27410/IMG_0793.jpg) (http://s47.photobucket.com/user/Racerman27410/media/IMG_0793.jpg.html)
Merry Christmas and Kookaloo!
Frank
Hey Franky....Merry Christmas to you too......and thanks for the input......I hope we can meet up one day and let Brutus and CanD hang out and play......Kooookaloooo for sure
Kev
Merry Christmas Frank!
CanD's best solution may be to simply get and mod an FZ1 arm and sell the ready to install ThunderAce arm to recoup costs. With a little patience, you could have a zero cost extension :drinks:
Quote from: racerman_27410 link=topic=10728.msg105045#msg105045 date=1387840270
URL=http://s47.photobucket.com/user/Racerman27410/media/IMG_0793.jpg.html](http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f198/Racerman27410/IMG_0793.jpg)[/URL]
Holy shit Frank... that thing of yours must be something else entirely from mine. Mine has the T-Ace swing arm and is ok other than some level of throttle control in practice. Yours looks like you might be able to get into the serious end of the power band We're going to need to meet and compare kook zones at some point.
Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to ALL!,
Frank
thanks fellas.... i should be more active now that my year long house building project is winding down (moving in Friday)
I'm definitely going to be doing more travelling this coming year and i hope to get up and ride with you all at some point soon! :drinks:
Frank, Yes i can get into the power ...the longer swingarm alongside playing with the ride height to fine tune weight transfer allowed me to get the bike to really launch hard and still handle good in the twisties.
BTW my 18/38 gearing should be good for 200MPH + :gamer:
Kookaloo!
Frank
Quote from: fj1289 on December 24, 2013, 08:20:41 PM
Merry Christmas Frank!
CanD's best solution may be to simply get and mod an FZ1 arm and sell the ready to install ThunderAce arm to recoup costs. With a little patience, you could have a zero cost extension :drinks:
There was some material that needed removing to make room for the T-ace swing arm......what's involved in swapping over to the FZ1.....and what year?.......I already have the FZ1 front forks and the FZ1 tires.....so I like this suggestion the most.....
Kev
Quote from: CanDman on December 26, 2013, 09:15:16 AM
Quote from: fj1289 on December 24, 2013, 08:20:41 PM
Merry Christmas Frank!
CanD's best solution may be to simply get and mod an FZ1 arm and sell the ready to install ThunderAce arm to recoup costs. With a little patience, you could have a zero cost extension :drinks:
There was some material that needed removing to make room for the T-ace swing arm......what's involved in swapping over to the FZ1.....and what year?.......I already have the FZ1 front forks and the FZ1 tires.....so I like this suggestion the most.....
Kev
Kev, mine is a 2002 FZ1 swingarm (same as Franks I believe).
The wheel is centered in the arm, so its just a matter of removing ~2mm either side of the pivot. You have to press the bearings out first, and the original FZ1 spacer between the bearings.
Once you have measured and cut, you press in the bearings and use the OEM FJ bearing spacer, end caps and pivot bolt.
For the chain, I used the '86 Honda VF1000F c/s sprocket with the outside face machined off so that there is enough thread for the C/S nut and washer, and flipped the wheel sprocket......
And for the rear brake, you will need all FZ1 stuff, including hanger, calliper, spacers, axle and wheel.....and replace your OEM brake light switch (which will make contact with the swingarm) with a banjo bolt switch.
I also bought a pair of Soupys links to get the height where I wanted it.
Job done!
Take a look at mine in March mate.
Harvy
Quote from: Harvy on December 26, 2013, 01:47:05 PM
Quote from: CanDman on December 26, 2013, 09:15:16 AM
Quote from: fj1289 on December 24, 2013, 08:20:41 PM
Merry Christmas Frank!
CanD's best solution may be to simply get and mod an FZ1 arm and sell the ready to install ThunderAce arm to recoup costs. With a little patience, you could have a zero cost extension :drinks:
There was some material that needed removing to make room for the T-ace swing arm......what's involved in swapping over to the FZ1.....and what year?.......I already have the FZ1 front forks and the FZ1 tires.....so I like this suggestion the most.....
Kev
Kev, mine is a 2002 FZ1 swingarm (same as Franks I believe).
The wheel is centered in the arm, so its just a matter of removing ~2mm either side of the pivot. You have to press the bearings out first, and the original FZ1 spacer between the bearings.
Once you have measured and cut, you press in the bearings and use the OEM FJ bearing spacer, end caps and pivot bolt.
For the chain, I used the '86 Honda VF1000F c/s sprocket with the outside face machined off so that there is enough thread for the C/S nut and washer, and flipped the wheel sprocket......
And for the rear brake, you will need all FZ1 stuff, including hanger, calliper, spacers, axle and wheel.....and replace your OEM brake light switch (which will make contact with the swingarm) with a banjo bolt switch.
I also bought a pair of Soupys links to get the height where I wanted it.
Job done!
Take a look at mine in March mate.
Harvy
I am looking forward to it Harv.....can I still use my Penske shock and my R1 brakes?
Quote from: CanDman on December 26, 2013, 10:15:46 PM
can I still use my Penske shock and my R1 brakes?
Yes and and yes Kev. I'm also using a Penske and R1/FZ1 are the same calliper.
Harvy
Quote from: Harvy on December 27, 2013, 02:39:44 PM
Quote from: CanDman on December 26, 2013, 10:15:46 PM
can I still use my Penske shock and my R1 brakes?
Yes and and yes Kev. I'm also using a Penske and R1/FZ1 are the same calliper.
Harvy
I had no idea that you and I had so much in common Harv.....lets see
1. I have a 300zx tt......and you have one in your family
2. Penske shock
3. R1 brakes
4. an FJ
5. FZ1 fork mod
6. The same room at the rally
7. a love for Moose head and Whisky
8. a love for Coke .....(puzzles).... :mocking:
9. and we're both rabbits.....I was born in 63 (the ear of the rabbit)
TRULY AMAZING !!!!!!!!!! :drinks:
Kev
Well, if it matters, I have a FZ1 swingarm that I'd be happy to trade for a Thunder Ace arm if you're interested...
My 90 also has the FZ1 2002 swing arm swap with the Penske shock. I also purchased the XJR clutch pushrod, shift shaft and counter shaft cover from Randy. Awesome set up. The longer wheelbase slows response a little but overall the bike rides and handles awesome. I am finishing off an 86 restoration now and have an unmolested low mileage 84 that will also get the FZ1 swinger and front end. I highly recommend that swing arm set up.
Quote from: skymasteres on December 28, 2013, 01:39:31 AM
Well, if it matters, I have a FZ1 swingarm that I'd be happy to trade for a Thunder Ace arm if you're interested...
Hey Thanks Mav.......once I come back from Oz I will be in So Cal for a week....by then I will have seen Harvy's set up and maybe , if I bring a carrot, he may let me take it for a rip...and see how it feels...if I like it, I will seriously consider swapping swings..... :drinks:
Hey Johnnie....thx for the input..... :good:
Kev