Hello, Last season i geared my 89 a bit taller (18/38) and i like it alot...that said, i have lost some low end pull and am trying to get some back. I have it jetted well and added a few degrees timing but its time for some maintenance anyway as i can see oil getting past a few guides and at 20k its time for a valve job as well. Im planning a valve job,springs,seals and some bowl/port work and deck the head a couple(?) thousands to raise compression some ...and a intake cam too. A board member here,suggested a megacylce cam #268-00. Im just looking for some low end pull without much, if any, mid range loss. I rarely see 9000rpm so if some steam is lost there...so be it. I surely dont want to lose any driveability. Anyone have knowledge of this cam and its lift/duration and overall performance? Any other suggestions welcomed as well. Thanks.
Not trying to be a wise *ss or anything like that, but have you contacted the people at Megacycle and posed your questions to them?
I know that direct feedback from owners who have the cams in their bikes can provide good answers, but I got to think that as long as Megacycle has been around, that they're a great source for the answers you seek too.
Just my 2 cents.
Marty
I don't know what sort of range of cams Megacycle make for FJ's, but I've had some experience with them with SOHC Honda 750's in the past, and the thing to keep in mind with cams is that "Bigger aint better" unless you're going to race your bike.
I replaced my 125/75 race cam with a mild street cam with only a couple more mm of lift and a little more duration, and my old CB has gone from being gutless at "normal" speeds, to everything I wanted when I originally built that engine 7 years ago, torquey down low with lots of mid range grunt.
Let us know what you end up with, and how well it works in "real world" situations, once I get my FJ back on the road I'm sure I'll want to improve it's performance too. Cheers, Terry. ;D
I have megacycle cams and Randy (RPM) can tell you how hard it is to get info from them. When I picked mine there was really no "more torque" option other than to get adjustable timing on the sprockets. Then you tune to taste. Mine are as shipped and dyno shows low end same to 5000 RPM, then things start to get interesting... I do have a modified engine however.
You should try calling them directly, but honestly they didn't offer much that would meet your needs, at least as described. Getting much more torque probably requires more cc's on an FJ...
Randy?
I have the same cams you are referring to, when they are in the bike the mid range is equal to the standard - I have 1200 wiseco with a slight lift in compression, ported, and a decent pipe, after 6,000 rpm it goes like an ape to around +10,000rpm. You do have to degree the cams or you are just wasting your time (they won't run well). I'm having a few issues with mine which Randy is helping me sort out. I suggest if you buy these cams, buy through Randy so if there are any issues he bends over backwards to help.
If all goes well they are worth having to a point where I was prepared not to refit the standard cams back while I'm getting my cams checked out.
P.S don't forget the valve springs, they state that standard are ok but I personally would not use standard springs.
Quote from: Bozo on November 24, 2013, 03:54:29 AM
I have the same cams you are referring to, when they are in the bike the mid range is equal to the standard - I have 1200 wiseco with a slight lift in compression, ported, and a decent pipe, after 6,000 rpm it goes like an ape to around +10,000rpm. You do have to degree the cams or you are just wasting your time (they won't run well). I'm having a few issues with mine which Randy is helping me sort out. I suggest if you buy these cams, buy through Randy so if there are any issues he bends over backwards to help.
If all goes well they are worth having to a point where I was prepared not to refit the standard cams back while I'm getting my cams checked out.
P.S don't forget the valve springs, they state that standard are ok but I personally would not use standard springs.
Correct. I think there are far to many people that know nothing about cam timing.
Not to be a smartass, but why not just put the gearing back? Presto, immediate increase in applied torque, job done. It wasn't a big surprise that you lost some snap with the longer gears, right?
You can also change the timing on the stock cams too, though at the cost of some top end.
Quote from: Flynt on November 24, 2013, 01:05:43 AM
I have megacycle cams and Randy (RPM) can tell you how hard it is to get info from them. When I picked mine there was really no "more torque" option other than to get adjustable timing on the sprockets. Then you tune to taste. Mine are as shipped and dyno shows low end same to 5000 RPM, then things start to get interesting... I do have a modified engine however.
You should try calling them directly, but honestly they didn't offer much that would meet your needs, at least as described. Getting much more torque probably requires more cc's on an FJ...
Randy?
More compression and tighter squish will get you more torque and HP even at stock displacement. Or...go this route http://thekneeslider.com/kawasaki-supercharger-patent-drawings/ (http://thekneeslider.com/kawasaki-supercharger-patent-drawings/)
Are XJR cams different? I thought they were in that they offered more low end grunt. Could source some from overseas...
Quote from: Bozo on November 24, 2013, 03:54:29 AM
You do have to degree the cams...
Didn't mean to imply otherwise... that's why I got the adjustment option.
When Randy set them I think he put them at stock timing and FactoryPro left them there essentially (no significant adjustment they said) during the dyno tuning. I described what I wanted power delivery wise (less sudden torque than it had post 1350cc build/pre-tune because I couldn't keep the front wheel down away from a stop, esp with Diane on the back, and progressive power increase over stock with improved top end) and they nailed it... but I'm sure it could be made to deliver different characteristics with cam/timing/fueling.
Frank
Quote from: Flynt on November 24, 2013, 10:41:02 AM
Quote from: Bozo on November 24, 2013, 03:54:29 AM
You do have to degree the cams...
When Randy set them I think he put them at stock timing and FactoryPro left them there essentially (no significant adjustment they said) during the dyno tuning. I described what I wanted power delivery wise (less sudden torque than it had post 1350cc build/pre-tune because I couldn't keep the front wheel down away from a stop, ....
Frank
....Hang on....I`ve gotta swap hands....ahhhh....oh to have this problem! (I don`t smoke....but I think I need a cigarette!) :wacko2:
Quote from: andyb on November 24, 2013, 09:01:15 AM
Not to be a smartass, but why not just put the gearing back? Presto, immediate increase in applied torque, job done. It wasn't a big surprise that you lost some snap with the longer gears, right?
You can also change the timing on the stock cams too, though at the cost of some top end.
That is a great point. I missed that part.
Quote from: Dads_FJ on November 24, 2013, 10:11:16 AM
Are XJR cams different? I thought they were in that they offered more low end grunt. Could source some from overseas...
Nope, the XJR cams are the same profile, that additional low end torque of the 1300 is the larger bore size.
Quote from: Flynt on November 24, 2013, 01:05:43 AM
Randy?
Frank?
I missed the question, just too dang busy moving...
What was the question?
Randy - RPM
Quote from: racerrad8 on November 24, 2013, 08:04:03 PM
What was the question?
turbocamino was looking for torque... I knew you'd know where it was.
Not sure where he went, so never mind.
Frank
Thanks guys...just now had a chance to read all above..and digest, :good stuff. Regarding the tall gearing...its just a personal preference as i find my self at highway speed alot and like 3000 better than 4000..i want my cake and eat it too ,as they say and want some low end back. Always more than one way to get it done though. My list of "dont wants" is longer that my list of wants...i dont want to lose gas milage..i dont want to make more heat..i dont want to lose ANY bottom end...i dont want to fart around with jetting all spring. I just did a major car engine project in my "turbocamino" and need to keep this as simple as possible. I got some good direction from you guys,as usual. I will digest all and plot a course. Thanks.
Quote from: turbocamino on November 25, 2013, 11:45:40 AM
Thanks guys...just now had a chance to read all above..and digest, :good stuff. Regarding the tall gearing...its just a personal preference as i find my self at highway speed alot and like 3000 better than 4000..i want my cake and eat it too ,as they say and want some low end back. Always more than one way to get it done though. My list of "dont wants" is longer that my list of wants...i dont want to lose gas milage..i dont want to make more heat..i dont want to lose ANY bottom end...i dont want to fart around with jetting all spring. I just did a major car engine project in my "turbocamino" and need to keep this as simple as possible. I got some good direction from you guys,as usual. I will digest all and plot a course. Thanks.
I have your solution. Change back to standard final drive gearing and simply add a sixth gear to the trans. Problem solved.
Dan
(popcorn)
http://www.robinsonindustriesinc.com/ (http://www.robinsonindustriesinc.com/)
I talked with them about an FJ transmission shaft with a Busa nose to strengthen the drag bike trans and make it easy to use a Busa lockup clutch. They were willing & able to do the work, but Tim came thru with the hybrid FJ/Busa clutch instead. Bet they can make an over drive 5th gear - or under drive 1st gear....like they do for Busa's.
Otherwise, a little headwork could do real nice. Undercut valves, 5 angle valve job, a little port cleanup, and maybe a little epoxy in the intakes to really increase the flow velocity?
Quote from: fj1289 on November 25, 2013, 08:01:59 PM
http://www.robinsonindustriesinc.com/ (http://www.robinsonindustriesinc.com/)
I talked with them about an FJ transmission shaft with a Busa nose to strengthen the drag bike trans and make it easy to use a Busa lockup clutch. They were willing & able to do the work, but Tim came thru with the hybrid FJ/Busa clutch instead. Bet they can make an over drive 5th gear - or under drive 1st gear....like they do for Busa's.
Otherwise, a little headwork could do real nice. Undercut valves, 5 angle valve job, a little port cleanup, and maybe a little epoxy in the intakes to really increase the flow velocity?
That would be a real game changer to have someone make hybrid gears for the FJ...always figured that they would need a large order before they would proceed. That is very cool. (popcorn)
Easiest way to make torque is increased displacement.
Go to a 1350 kit with sock cams degreed to 104 intake and 106 exhaust.
Then you can keep your gearing
How hot does the central cylinder temp get with that 1350? My 1314 was putting big numbers up on the dyno. FJ's run hot.
JMR - what types of numbers are you seeing from 1314s? Thinking with oversized valves, port work, and cams (but staying with shim over bucket)? And is it on an engine dyno or a chassis dyno? Thanks!
Quote from: fj1289 on December 06, 2013, 10:39:04 PM
JMR - what types of numbers are you seeing from 1314s? Thinking with oversized valves, port work, and cams (but staying with shim over bucket)? And is it on an engine dyno or a chassis dyno? Thanks!
Chassis dyno. Around 270F after some pulls (that is the middle of the cylinder block).....and that is with the dual dyno fans going. It seems a bit high to me but if you keep air moving and aren't cruising @ 9,000RPM things will be OK. Be careful with the SOB with either the 13mm or 9.5mm Ti retainers. I have had a problem with "egging" in the shim bore....I'd highly recommend having the retainers DLC or Ti nitrided.
JMR - what about Hp & Tq?
270F isn't as high as I might have thought...what do the head temps look like?!
Quote from: fj1289 on December 12, 2013, 01:25:48 PM
JMR - what about Hp & Tq?
270F isn't as high as I might have thought...what do the head temps look like?!
Seemed high considering the directed fans and relatively short running time. Didn't measure the head temp but I'd guess 300F or so. HP was 156.7, torque 93.2 (very, very close to my stock Gen1 busa)...very real world dyno too. I have to adjust the accelerator pump on the FCR's as it goes to lean when whacked open. The bike moves out well even with high gearing.
Thanks for the info!
Hoping my 1314 will be in the ballpark - was built a few years ago in McBride's shop in VA.
Also good to know where the temps are being seen on these too
Quote from: fj1289 on December 13, 2013, 03:57:50 PM
Thanks for the info!
Hoping my 1314 will be in the ballpark - was built a few years ago in McBride's shop in VA.
Also good to know where the temps are being seen on these too
People told me "no way" with that displacement. I ported the thing ...I know what will happen. :yes: